Civil Enforcement ltd.
Discussion
Received a £100 parking charge from this cheerful bunch last week. Overstay beyond a free parking period by 51 minutes.
Only real defence may be that the area was deserted after Christmas - One other car when I parked, none when I left.
Idiotic on my part, as I could have easily parked adjacent to the area being controlled by CEL for a well known fast food chain (no reciept).
Advice please. Pay the compassionate £60 discounted fee (10 days), or refer to POPLA, PePIPoo perhaps?
Only real defence may be that the area was deserted after Christmas - One other car when I parked, none when I left.
Idiotic on my part, as I could have easily parked adjacent to the area being controlled by CEL for a well known fast food chain (no reciept).
Advice please. Pay the compassionate £60 discounted fee (10 days), or refer to POPLA, PePIPoo perhaps?
Not sure there is much basis, other than the fact I didn't impede others from parking during overstay, as there were no other cars there. Not reading the signage is no defence (I assume it is was there). I anticipate a warden may not have given me a ticket as it was a bank holiday and the rest of the car park was free! (it was ANPR). I regard £100 as excessively punitive for a minor transgression, which didn't impede other customers or the business.
M11 MFP said:
Not sure there is much basis, other than the fact I didn't impede others from parking during overstay, as there were no other cars there. Not reading the signage is no defence (I assume it is was there). I anticipate a warden may not have given me a ticket as it was a bank holiday and the rest of the car park was free! (it was ANPR). I regard £100 as excessively punitive for a minor transgression, which didn't impede other customers or the business.
What does the signage say regarding public holidays?Almost always these private tickets can be got off. have a look at http://parking-prankster.blogspot.co.uk/ and http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/forumdisplay.p...
voyds9 said:
Genuine assessment of loses? Car park empty so what have they lost.
Exactly this, with an admission of error and acknowledgment of my failure to appreciate the enforcement on public holidays.This worked before with Parking Eye, who waived a greater overstay than this, with a valid reciept from the store in question, and on a normal working day.
I don't have a receipt from the business concerned this time, but who does from anonburger 10 days later.
It's a works vehicle too, so they don't know the driver, but are keen to acquire this information judging by their threatening paragraph. Pretty sure I don't need to supply it in response to a private car parking companies invoice?
I'm aware this company fines (invoices) at the highest permissible level and is very litigious. They have recently been in court for fraudulently fishing money using legal jargon not valid in Scotland. Also for reissuing threatening PCNs over five years old in England, in anticipation new legal processes aiding their cause will milk significant cash from those who escaped justice in the early days of the private parking cash cow.
Edited by M11 MFP on Friday 13th January 18:08
I would always try to appeal, on the basis that you might be lucky and have an appeal upheld.
Last year, I intentionally parked in a disabled bay (between 1am - 4am, before I get flamed), with the knowledge that I might have to pay a PCN, but I thought that I'd risk it at that time of morning.
Anyway, a PCN was duly issued at 01.45, but rather than paying straightaway, I decided to appeal on the off chance it might be accepted by the council. It was indeed accepted, and the PCN was cancelled.
The key to a successful appeal is carefully preparing and presenting your argument as to why the PCN was incorrectly issued.
Last year, I intentionally parked in a disabled bay (between 1am - 4am, before I get flamed), with the knowledge that I might have to pay a PCN, but I thought that I'd risk it at that time of morning.
Anyway, a PCN was duly issued at 01.45, but rather than paying straightaway, I decided to appeal on the off chance it might be accepted by the council. It was indeed accepted, and the PCN was cancelled.
The key to a successful appeal is carefully preparing and presenting your argument as to why the PCN was incorrectly issued.
Mandat said:
Last year, I intentionally parked in a disabled bay (between 1am - 4am, before I get flamed),
That's alright then. Everyone knows us disabled folk don't venture out after dark. If I had a pound for every time we've not been able to park somewhere from evening time onwards because the disabled bays were packed with taxis, vans and cars without badges I'd be a very rich man. I honestly don't understand why people just assume the disabled regrow their legs at night.Mandat said:
I would always try to appeal, on the basis that you might be lucky and have an appeal upheld.
Last year, I intentionally parked in a disabled bay (between 1am - 4am, before I get flamed), with the knowledge that I might have to pay a PCN, but I thought that I'd risk it at that time of morning.
Anyway, a PCN was duly issued at 01.45, but rather than paying straightaway, I decided to appeal on the off chance it might be accepted by the council. It was indeed accepted, and the PCN was cancelled.
A local authority PCN is a completely different ball game. Dealt with under statute not contract law.Last year, I intentionally parked in a disabled bay (between 1am - 4am, before I get flamed), with the knowledge that I might have to pay a PCN, but I thought that I'd risk it at that time of morning.
Anyway, a PCN was duly issued at 01.45, but rather than paying straightaway, I decided to appeal on the off chance it might be accepted by the council. It was indeed accepted, and the PCN was cancelled.
Mandat said:
The key to a successful appeal is carefully preparing and presenting your argument as to why the PCN was incorrectly issued.
This is true for any dispute. See below.M11 MFP said:
Only real defence may be that the area was deserted after Christmas - One other car when I parked, none when I left.
No. Don't even think of trying that one because you will fall at the first hurdle.M11 MFP said:
voyds9 said:
Genuine assessment of loses? Car park empty so what have they lost.
Exactly this, with an admission of error and acknowledgment of my failure to appreciate the enforcement on public holidays.
This worked before with Parking Eye, who waived a greater overstay than this, with a valid reciept from the store in question, and on a normal working day.Exactly this, with an admission of error and acknowledgment of my failure to appreciate the enforcement on public holidays.
I don't have a receipt from the business concerned this time, but who does from anonburger 10 days later.
It's a works vehicle too, so they don't know the driver, but are keen to acquire this information judging by their threatening paragraph. Pretty sure I don't need to supply it in response to a private car parking companies invoice?
There are other, better, ways of dealing with this.
If it's a works vehicle who exactly is the PCN addressed to? How did it find its way to you?
M11 MFP said:
I'm aware this company fines (invoices) at the highest permissible level and is very litigious.
Litigious? Only if you think threatograms meet that definition. This suggests that few CEL cases make it to court - http://www.bmpa.eu/companydata/Civil_Enforcement.h...M11 MFP said:
They have recently been in court for fraudulently fishing money using legal jargon not valid in Scotland.
Recently? I think your defintion thereof is somewhat wide of the mark. CEL were prosecuted for fraud in an action brought by Trading Standards in Aberdeen.Between them, TS and the PF made a complete fist of the case and lost: 12 months ago - https://www.eveningexpress.co.uk/fp/news/local/par...
M11 MFP said:
Also for reissuing threatening PCNs over five years old in England, in anticipation new legal processes aiding their cause will milk significant cash from those who escaped justice in the early days of the private parking cash cow.
What new legal processes? Link to source please. PoFA 2012 is not retrospective, so keeper liability on anything prior to 01/10/2012 will fail.You need to be aware that CEL's PCNs are non-compliant with PoFA 2012. Read this and compare with the PCN then you will see why.
Get yourself over to MSE and pepipoo, do your homework, and find out how to kick it into the long grass. PH is not the most suitable forum for this.
rainmakerraw said:
Mandat said:
Last year, I intentionally parked in a disabled bay (between 1am - 4am, before I get flamed),
That's alright then. Everyone knows us disabled folk don't venture out after dark. If I had a pound for every time we've not been able to park somewhere from evening time onwards because the disabled bays were packed with taxis, vans and cars without badges I'd be a very rich man. I honestly don't understand why people just assume the disabled regrow their legs at night.May be the case where you live but around where I am most blocks of disabled spaces are half empty at the busiest of times let alone the middle of the night.
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