Can I keep a courtesy car (garage liquidated)
Discussion
I think I'd be minded to keep quiet about it and wait until asked for its return. However I'd be nervous about using it as the insurance position must be uncertain, even if the OP has put it on his own policy. If he hasn't, then it probably isn't insured at all now.
Not sure why people are so adamant he won't see his old car again though - unless it's been destroyed, surely it will ping ANPR pretty quickly if it's being used or, if nothing else, will pop up again when someone tries to change the V5?
Not sure why people are so adamant he won't see his old car again though - unless it's been destroyed, surely it will ping ANPR pretty quickly if it's being used or, if nothing else, will pop up again when someone tries to change the V5?
TooMany2cvs said:
So if you're owed £5k, and have £1k in their assets, the liquidators MIGHT decide it's easier to let you keep the asset if there's £1k due to be paid to you. But if there's insufficient money to pay the taxman (priority creditor), then you are due nothing - you need to return that £1k asset, because the £1k is needed to pay the taxman.
Hmrc have not had a priority for years in a liquidation, they just go in the pool of creditors like others. Charge holders (banks typically) get first dibs other than the Prescribed Part.Edited by TooMany2cvs on Saturday 22 April 16:16
Sheepshanks said:
I think I'd be minded to keep quiet about it and wait until asked for its return.
The problem is that if the business has been run poorly then the liquidators might not even know it exists. (That's assuming it's owned by the business, it might well be another customer's car, or lent to them by somebody else etc.)If we assume the liquidators don't know then the 'cheeky' person might wait until everything has been wound up and then try and apply for a V5, but I'd imagine that since the OP knows the company is in liquidation then it's a criminal offence of some sort to not tell the liquidator that they are in possession of company property.
schrodinger said:
The courtesy car is an asset of the business, and the proceeds of its sale will go to the creditors. However the liquidators are incentivised to move quickly to minimise expenses in shutting the business (while achieving reasonable value).
So why not make them a cheeky low offer to buy the car? Yours has probably gone for good. They will have expenses (collection, auction house) if they get it from you and auction it. And they would only receive auction value. So offer 1k below trade price.
Even if your car turns up later you can always sell it.
This is what I'd do! You can't stay quiet knowing the car isn't yours, you are instantly in the wrong there. I would declare it, explain the situation your in & put in a cheeky 'full & final' type settlement to them to buy it. As has been said, just low enough that if push came to shove, you could sell it on for your money back in a few months whilst you figure out where your own car is.So why not make them a cheeky low offer to buy the car? Yours has probably gone for good. They will have expenses (collection, auction house) if they get it from you and auction it. And they would only receive auction value. So offer 1k below trade price.
Even if your car turns up later you can always sell it.
The car may or may not belong to the company.
If it doesn't and you refuse to return it they will list it as stolen and notify the police.
Had a similar thing about 14 years ago. Company went bust owing me expense and wages. I found out and bought fuel and oil on fuel card until later that day when it was stopped.
I kept car and lease car company came to my parents at the time house. The car was on private land and I refused to return it. About a week later police came and said sorry about the circumstances and the car was listed as stolen. They know I did not steel it but no insurance was in place and I needed to give them the keys and move it off my property. I gave them the keys and said I am not driving now you have told me there is no insurance. Plus if its not insured its shouldn't be on the public highway.
The officers then looked a bit blank, I said I will get my things out and the cars yours. They then after about 15mins of scratching their heads parked it in the road outside my house and left it.
When I came back later it was gone!
If it doesn't and you refuse to return it they will list it as stolen and notify the police.
Had a similar thing about 14 years ago. Company went bust owing me expense and wages. I found out and bought fuel and oil on fuel card until later that day when it was stopped.
I kept car and lease car company came to my parents at the time house. The car was on private land and I refused to return it. About a week later police came and said sorry about the circumstances and the car was listed as stolen. They know I did not steel it but no insurance was in place and I needed to give them the keys and move it off my property. I gave them the keys and said I am not driving now you have told me there is no insurance. Plus if its not insured its shouldn't be on the public highway.
The officers then looked a bit blank, I said I will get my things out and the cars yours. They then after about 15mins of scratching their heads parked it in the road outside my house and left it.
When I came back later it was gone!
wattsm666 said:
Hmrc have not had a priority for years in a liquidation, they just go in the pool of creditors like others. Charge holders (banks typically) get first dibs other than the Prescribed Part.
Think that has changed recently after talking with an insolvency friend - Liquidator costs and HMRC are I believe the first and formost they are no longer in the pool.Does your car have a new registered keeper lodged at the DVLA?
You have a right to request that as you have reasonable cause before going to your insurance company.
Seeing as you gave the keys to the garage then the insurance company might not consider it "stolen".
You have a right to request that as you have reasonable cause before going to your insurance company.
Seeing as you gave the keys to the garage then the insurance company might not consider it "stolen".
Edited by cootuk on Thursday 27th April 16:19
Mate had a similar issue with one of those dodgy engine replacement outfits that used to flit between various M25 sites when they'd taken his money to fit a replacement engine and he never saw the car again. He kept the insurance live on it, even after it looked inevitable he'd never see the car again, and after reporting to the police and informing his insurer I believe he was told to foxtrot oscar as there was no doubt over who he'd last given the car to, along with the keys.
He was rather embarrassed at the whole episode so I'm not sure what the final outcome was, but I suspect it was never resolved to his satisfaction....
He was rather embarrassed at the whole episode so I'm not sure what the final outcome was, but I suspect it was never resolved to his satisfaction....
OP - have you considered the possibility that you're driving someone else's car around as the garage's courtesy car and somewhere in your approximate locality, someone is driving YOUR car around as a courtesy car?
In the OP's position, I'd be taking steps to find out who owns the car that's currently on my drive AND I'd be reporting my own car as "missing, presumed stolen"
In the OP's position, I'd be taking steps to find out who owns the car that's currently on my drive AND I'd be reporting my own car as "missing, presumed stolen"
My advice would be strictly based on the value of the OP's car. If it's a £100 Vauxhall Astra; personally, I'd just move on. If it was considerably more and it could be proven that the garage had illegally sold it and pocketed the monies, i'd report it to the Police as stolen and the same to my insurance company forthwith.
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