Shotgun Cartridges and the law?
Discussion
creampuff said:
> Slugs are section 1, and need to be listed on a FAC. Practical shotgun is justification for them.
Can you get buckshot (as opposed to birdshot) on a SGC?
Yes. Providing the cartridge contains 5 or more pellets none of which exceed .36". Can you get buckshot (as opposed to birdshot) on a SGC?
Edited by creampuff on Friday 12th May 06:04
http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1968/27/sectio...
creampuff said:
> Technically a member of the Military or Police who is issued firearms as part of their job, is breaking the law if they have in their possession live ammunition the moment they clock off - unless they have a FAC including calibre of ammunition in question.
I think even if they have a FAC with that ammo on it, if they go home with on the job ammo they will still be breaking the law as it needs to be entered on the FAC.
No technicality about it. Unless they hold the appropriate certification or are exempt from the requirement to hold a certificate they are liable to prosecution.I think even if they have a FAC with that ammo on it, if they go home with on the job ammo they will still be breaking the law as it needs to be entered on the FAC.
Edited by creampuff on Friday 12th May 06:04
You may recall the Danny Nightingale case.
Similarly the holder of a FAC may only possess such calibres and quantities of ammunition as authorised by that certificate & would be liable to prosecution if found in possession of other calibres or more than authorised.
I can't find any definitive requirement to remove the bolt in a firearm so it appears to be a preference only dependent on Force area/Firearms Officer. The only place it is mentioned is on their website with regard to disabling the gun whilst transporting it , and again only a recommendation.
overunder12g said:
Nothing stopping you from buying a shotgun, or any other, down the pub from someone without a licence so not sure what your point is.Illegal, but happens.
Just for clarity:-Firearms act 1968 Part 1 section 2.1 clearly states:-
(1) Subject to any exemption under this Act, it is an offence for a person to have in his possession, or to purchase or acquire, a shot gun without holding a certificate under this Act authorising him to possess shot guns.
http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1968/27/sectio...
So yes, it is an offence!
creampuff said:
That is the first I've ever heard of that. Also in the case of semi-autos which in the U.K. Is 22s or Sect 1 shotguns, taking the bolt out can be a major event and isn't practical.
Came across this this morning, they are only a government guideline, but it does outline the basics.https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploa...
cmaguire said:
Back in the late 80's/early 90's my gun cabinet was a run-of-the-mill locker made of thin steel you would find in the workplace. Back then I had a 9mm semi-auto in it. I doubt that would pass muster now, and thanks to Michael Ryan Thomas Hamilton it wouldn't have the pistol in it anyway.
Lost my 9mm and .357 Mag wheelgun too.
cmaguire said:
You could keep them on your dining room table if it floats your boat.
My gun cabinets are mounted on the wall in a cupboard under the stairs. The shotgun shells are in the cupboard but not in the cabinets.
Likewise. When I shot regularly I bought plastic wad 1000 at a time, then had some fibre wad so could have maybe 1500 carts at a time.My gun cabinets are mounted on the wall in a cupboard under the stairs. The shotgun shells are in the cupboard but not in the cabinets.
I remember a very long time ago my friend (at the time) done loft conversions and found a shotgun belt with cartridges inside it. The house owner let him keep it.
He was a complete bell end and i remember he thought it was funny one day to throw some into a fire he had lit in a forest area of a park.
The bang was extreme and i'd ran away too far by that time to hear if any pellets had came out.
I wonder what the offence would be for that these days
Thankfully we don't speak anymore. Last i heard he had "blown up" his house trying to make something cannabis related with gas.
He was a complete bell end and i remember he thought it was funny one day to throw some into a fire he had lit in a forest area of a park.
The bang was extreme and i'd ran away too far by that time to hear if any pellets had came out.
I wonder what the offence would be for that these days
Thankfully we don't speak anymore. Last i heard he had "blown up" his house trying to make something cannabis related with gas.
TooMany2cvs said:
rxe said:
For shotgun cartridges, the regulations are very slack. I have several thousand in the utility room, I've got a box in the Land-Rover, several on the desk in my office, and a couple on the ledge of the extractor fan in the kitchen. You can get cartridges delivered by courier and left on your doorstep if you're out.
Metallic ammunition (a.k.a. bullets) is different. Mine is all in a locked compartment in a different gun cupboard to the rifles, and the bolts are in a locked compartment in the main cupboard. Paranoid? Sure. But I really don't want a burglar to get their hands on a working rifle.
But there'd be no problem with a burglar getting their hands on a loaded shotgun, right?Metallic ammunition (a.k.a. bullets) is different. Mine is all in a locked compartment in a different gun cupboard to the rifles, and the bolts are in a locked compartment in the main cupboard. Paranoid? Sure. But I really don't want a burglar to get their hands on a working rifle.
rxe said:
I find the slackness around shotgun ammunition slightly surprising.
Surely there's two questions here...Is the law slack? Perhaps.
Does that mean you have to be slack, too? Umm...
If you think the law should be stricter, there's really nothing to stop you from being stricter yourself, is there? I mean, if the law requires shotgun cartridges to be kept in Land Rovers, I'm screwed, since my Landy's completely unarmed.
smack said:
Slugs are section 1, and need to be listed on a FAC. Practical shotgun is justification for them.
Bloody hell. This is where we've been going wrong with our veg patch. Thanks for the tip. Not sure the greenhouse will survive, though... Presumably, for snails, nothing short of an AK47 will do?On slackness, clearly the guns are locked away. Having cartridges to hand is convenient. What I really find slack is the ease with which you can order 10,000 online, and have them left on the doorstep!
A 12 gauge 2 3/4" chambered shotgun is probably the most versatile gun on the planet.
Capable of firing ammunition from solid slug through assorted pellet sizes, to flechettes,ferret, hatton & rip rounds.
The Germans complained about the use by the Americans of pump shotguns (Winchester M97) & buckshot in WW1.
With rifled slug & a decent set of sights a man sized target at 100 yards is not a problem. Recoil is interesting.
Ammunition widely available worldwide.
Capable of firing ammunition from solid slug through assorted pellet sizes, to flechettes,ferret, hatton & rip rounds.
The Germans complained about the use by the Americans of pump shotguns (Winchester M97) & buckshot in WW1.
With rifled slug & a decent set of sights a man sized target at 100 yards is not a problem. Recoil is interesting.
Ammunition widely available worldwide.
Edited by paintman on Friday 12th May 19:41
Big Al. said:
My third and final question was if he were me where would he store them in my home? for small amounts 100 - 300 Qty, IN MY GUN CABINET along with my gun.
I've probably got about 3000 at the moment because I thought a slab of 250 was plenty, it's not. you will be surprised how often you decide to top up! They are boxed in an old filing cabinet.My wife hosted the local playgroup one morning during the Easter holiday a few weeks ago. One of the parents must have been washing up tea cups in the kitchen, because someone for reasons unknown left these spent cartidges round the bottom of the flower pot by the sink. This never used to happen when we lived in Belsize Park!
I have never been able to figure out why in the UK - Shotguns should be treated any differently to rimfire/centre fire rifles. Both tools will kill people - so why not license them the same.
Down the bottom here - IF there is an armed holdup - the tool of choice is a sawn-off shotgun, followed by cut down 22. The shotgun is preferable, bigger bang, looks more frightening staring down the wrong end - and better chance of hitting someone.
Here we licence the person - if suitable, they can possess whatever type and whatever quantity of rifles/ammo (barring AKs and pistols).
Storage wise, the law requires all reasonable precautions, which means firearms MUST- all locked away and ammo separate to gun, and bolts away from gun as well - common-sense precautions to stop the casual criminal and children gaining access.
Whilst the law MAY say one thing - it is really not difficult to take precautions over and above, which are still reasonable.
Down the bottom here - IF there is an armed holdup - the tool of choice is a sawn-off shotgun, followed by cut down 22. The shotgun is preferable, bigger bang, looks more frightening staring down the wrong end - and better chance of hitting someone.
Here we licence the person - if suitable, they can possess whatever type and whatever quantity of rifles/ammo (barring AKs and pistols).
Storage wise, the law requires all reasonable precautions, which means firearms MUST- all locked away and ammo separate to gun, and bolts away from gun as well - common-sense precautions to stop the casual criminal and children gaining access.
Whilst the law MAY say one thing - it is really not difficult to take precautions over and above, which are still reasonable.
^ Are you in NZ? You can't get pistols in NZ?
>> I have never been able to figure out why in the UK - Shotguns should be treated any differently to rimfire/centre fire rifles. Both tools will kill people - so why not license them the same.
Firearms licensing: it doesn't need to make sense.
Shotgun licensing isn't too lax in the UK, firearms licensing is too pointlessly strict to the point where it doesn't reduce crime, it just makes it inconvenient. It's quite common to have 1,000+ rounds of centerfire ammo authorised for purchase on an FAC. So why not just make it an unlimited quantity?
>> I have never been able to figure out why in the UK - Shotguns should be treated any differently to rimfire/centre fire rifles. Both tools will kill people - so why not license them the same.
Firearms licensing: it doesn't need to make sense.
Shotgun licensing isn't too lax in the UK, firearms licensing is too pointlessly strict to the point where it doesn't reduce crime, it just makes it inconvenient. It's quite common to have 1,000+ rounds of centerfire ammo authorised for purchase on an FAC. So why not just make it an unlimited quantity?
Edited by creampuff on Saturday 13th May 04:57
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