Discussion
nickfrog said:
Yes and I doubt he will get a licence ever again.
I wouldn't be too confident on that: https://www.cbsnews.com/news/rehab-that-puts-alcoh...A similar case from last year involving a Polish driver. two month sentence and a 12 month ban. A footnote on the story refers to another Polish driver sentenced the next day to four months and a six month ban.
http://www.commercialmotor.com/news/compliance/pri...
http://www.commercialmotor.com/news/compliance/pri...
silentbrown said:
nickfrog said:
Prizam said:
Pilots who turn up drunk get less.
Do you have any evidence they do ?Pilot = 10 months in prison.
Lorry driver = 12 weeks in prison.
La Liga said:
That link rather supports the opposite conclusion.
Pilot = 10 months in prison.
Lorry driver = 12 weeks in prison.
Oops - I misread that the driver's sentence as 12 months, which did seem a little stiff!Pilot = 10 months in prison.
Lorry driver = 12 weeks in prison.
What happens to vehicles seized with a deprivation order? Crushed/sold/handed back to owner...?
ElectricPics said:
A similar case from last year involving a Polish driver. two month sentence and a 12 month ban. A footnote on the story refers to another Polish driver sentenced the next day to four months and a six month ban.
http://www.commercialmotor.com/news/compliance/pri...
The surprising part of that article is where it says “his employer had no knowledge of what he had done.” http://www.commercialmotor.com/news/compliance/pri...
I find it surprising that employers are left wondering how their drivers are getting twice as much mileage out of their regulated hours as they should be but then do f-all about it. Is the fleet manager not attempting to work out how the truck and load have got to their destination in half the time it should have taken? I think not.
I once examined a tachograph and GPS track log of an LGV that had driven 250 miles in a quicker time than a Boeing 747 could have done the journey in a straight line.
While the job at the OP was a good one it is a small scratch at the surface I reckon.
A couple of thoughts:-
- Driving ban in the UK for a foreign driver...isn't that a bit meaningless if he's still got his domestic licence, or have I missed some part of EU law?
- If these devices are buried deep, how complicit would the operator have had to be in the fitting...any way the law can go after their O-Licence?
(Hell...why can't we push the policing of this back on the operators anyway - presence of such a device on a HGV is deemed to be the responsibility of the Operator as well as the driver, i.e. joint and several liability, two/three strikes and the O-licence is gone - hit them both!)
- Driving ban in the UK for a foreign driver...isn't that a bit meaningless if he's still got his domestic licence, or have I missed some part of EU law?
- If these devices are buried deep, how complicit would the operator have had to be in the fitting...any way the law can go after their O-Licence?
(Hell...why can't we push the policing of this back on the operators anyway - presence of such a device on a HGV is deemed to be the responsibility of the Operator as well as the driver, i.e. joint and several liability, two/three strikes and the O-licence is gone - hit them both!)
silentbrown said:
nickfrog said:
Yes and I doubt he will get a licence ever again.
I wouldn't be too confident on that: https://www.cbsnews.com/news/rehab-that-puts-alcoh...silentbrown said:
La Liga said:
That link rather supports the opposite conclusion.
Pilot = 10 months in prison.
Lorry driver = 12 weeks in prison.
Oops - I misread that the driver's sentence as 12 months, which did seem a little stiff!Pilot = 10 months in prison.
Lorry driver = 12 weeks in prison.
What happens to vehicles seized with a deprivation order? Crushed/sold/handed back to owner...?
sas62 said:
Err thats the complete opposite of what I'm saying.
Dangerous driving is a crime with its own charging recommendations.
What you can't do is increase the punishment because they might have killed someone.
The possible outcomes of dangerous driving are pretty much the same as the original post yet you don't often see a ten year ban and prison time.
He is being punished for what he did not for what could have happened. The tampering with a vital safety device is punishable. Dangerous driving is a crime with its own charging recommendations.
What you can't do is increase the punishment because they might have killed someone.
The possible outcomes of dangerous driving are pretty much the same as the original post yet you don't often see a ten year ban and prison time.
You should see what they can do in terms of when regulations are bypassed - no need to have a pile up or an incident, these are after all the effects of such a modification being made, if he had been on the M1 and ploughed into another vehicle then the charge sheet would be a lot longer and would include these findings aswell. would be years in the clunk too. he has been punished within the specification of the law.
http://www.keepmeontheroad.co.uk/tachograph-tamper...
https://www.lawontheweb.co.uk/personal/tachograph-...
tamper with a taco and you could be jailed upto 24 months just for tampering with the device.
Prizam said:
Anyone remember the 80's? I guess its a miracle that the human race survived!
Coppers tweeting this kind of guff and making a big social media thing out of it, plus the sentencing suggests he has been made one hell of an example of.
I don't think what he did was a good idea, but banned for 10 years and a jail sentence for trying to make a few extra quid? Seems a little excessive when aggravated burglary seems to get no interest at all.
It's the whole setup that is attracting the big sentence. This isn't a plug in device, they've had to go to quite some planning to get it working. The driver has taken his part in this by using it. If they gave him a slap on the wrist it would make the risk worthwhile to other haulage companies. The only crime is why the owner of the business was no locked up, he would have known it is impossible to shift goods over those distances with one driver.Coppers tweeting this kind of guff and making a big social media thing out of it, plus the sentencing suggests he has been made one hell of an example of.
I don't think what he did was a good idea, but banned for 10 years and a jail sentence for trying to make a few extra quid? Seems a little excessive when aggravated burglary seems to get no interest at all.
havoc said:
A couple of thoughts:-
- Driving ban in the UK for a foreign driver...isn't that a bit meaningless if he's still got his domestic licence, or have I missed some part of EU law?
- If these devices are buried deep, how complicit would the operator have had to be in the fitting...any way the law can go after their O-Licence?
(Hell...why can't we push the policing of this back on the operators anyway - presence of such a device on a HGV is deemed to be the responsibility of the Operator as well as the driver, i.e. joint and several liability, two/three strikes and the O-licence is gone - hit them both!)
Clue! The driver isn't fitting it.- Driving ban in the UK for a foreign driver...isn't that a bit meaningless if he's still got his domestic licence, or have I missed some part of EU law?
- If these devices are buried deep, how complicit would the operator have had to be in the fitting...any way the law can go after their O-Licence?
(Hell...why can't we push the policing of this back on the operators anyway - presence of such a device on a HGV is deemed to be the responsibility of the Operator as well as the driver, i.e. joint and several liability, two/three strikes and the O-licence is gone - hit them both!)
Prizam said:
Anyone remember the 80's? I guess its a miracle that the human race survived!
Coppers tweeting this kind of guff and making a big social media thing out of it, plus the sentencing suggests he has been made one hell of an example of.
I don't think what he did was a good idea, but banned for 10 years and a jail sentence for trying to make a few extra quid? Seems a little excessive when aggravated burglary seems to get no interest at all.
One would suggest he was a prolific offender, typically that kind of offence a fine and impounding of the vehicle until rest is caught up withCoppers tweeting this kind of guff and making a big social media thing out of it, plus the sentencing suggests he has been made one hell of an example of.
I don't think what he did was a good idea, but banned for 10 years and a jail sentence for trying to make a few extra quid? Seems a little excessive when aggravated burglary seems to get no interest at all.
A rather simple solution for finding out if a vehicle is likely to be iffy match the tacho mileage to ANPR pings from the networked cameras. Likewise ANPR I'm sure could be used to flag up obviously over hours vehicles with single driver coming over from Europe, I'm sure its not difficult in some force areas.
cossy400 said:
We had 4 new Merc Actros Giga spaces with just a fridge in, No leather no microwave and what ever else and they were 95K each I was led to believe.
Or thou just seen on Bookface a local lad is selling an 8 wheeler tipper (Scania) 15 plate for 83k plus VAT with jut shy of 500K on the clock.
Big cash!!!!
So "IF" he was nt English then the operater has no only I presume got to pay to get the truck and load released hes now also got to send a driver over here to fetch it.
Sounds like an expensive job when you consider what he d lose from "in his eyes" from the driver running legal.
Because of the way the truck has been seized, they will never get that truck back no matter how much they pay. It's gone, probably being crushed right now into a large cube.Or thou just seen on Bookface a local lad is selling an 8 wheeler tipper (Scania) 15 plate for 83k plus VAT with jut shy of 500K on the clock.
Big cash!!!!
So "IF" he was nt English then the operater has no only I presume got to pay to get the truck and load released hes now also got to send a driver over here to fetch it.
Sounds like an expensive job when you consider what he d lose from "in his eyes" from the driver running legal.
ghe13rte said:
havoc said:
A couple of thoughts:-
- Driving ban in the UK for a foreign driver...isn't that a bit meaningless if he's still got his domestic licence, or have I missed some part of EU law?
- If these devices are buried deep, how complicit would the operator have had to be in the fitting...any way the law can go after their O-Licence?
(Hell...why can't we push the policing of this back on the operators anyway - presence of such a device on a HGV is deemed to be the responsibility of the Operator as well as the driver, i.e. joint and several liability, two/three strikes and the O-licence is gone - hit them both!)
Clue! The driver isn't fitting it.- Driving ban in the UK for a foreign driver...isn't that a bit meaningless if he's still got his domestic licence, or have I missed some part of EU law?
- If these devices are buried deep, how complicit would the operator have had to be in the fitting...any way the law can go after their O-Licence?
(Hell...why can't we push the policing of this back on the operators anyway - presence of such a device on a HGV is deemed to be the responsibility of the Operator as well as the driver, i.e. joint and several liability, two/three strikes and the O-licence is gone - hit them both!)
...so punishing the driver doesn't really solve the problem...
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