Eight months for using a laser jammer ?!! Wtf

[WJNB]

valiant said:

Thread title is wrong. He got jail time for perverting the course of justice ( quite a s serious offence) and no doubt for being a prize dhead.

Warranted in my opinion

Couldn't agree more. The follow-on story I'd like to read is how he coped or otherwise with prison & how he was treated by fellow felons.

[Greendubber]

WJNB said:

valiant said:

Thread title is wrong. He got jail time for perverting the course of justice ( quite a s serious offence) and no doubt for being a prize dhead.

Warranted in my opinion

Couldn't agree more. The follow-on story I'd like to read is how he coped or otherwise with prison & how he was treated by fellow felons.

They might mistake him for Rolf Harris.

[cmaguire]

Greendubber said:

Criminal damage is a lesser offence than PCOJ and people are happy for that to be ignored, so why should the police investigate your car being vandalised?

The issue here is that many do not consider PCoJ an appropriate response. You and others want to focus entirely on the PCoJ, whereas those that don't agree with the use of PCoJ draw attention to the original offence.
This all stems from the political actions of the authorities, whereby they are massively over-exaggerating the importance and effect of speeding, and by actively encouraging and facilitating the reduction of many limits as well they are seen to be using their power to force their agenda. An agenda many view as totally illogical and unreasonable.
A lack of respect for the limits is the result, and from there also a lack of respect for the enforcement of those limits. Trying to avoid being punished for something you perceive as unreasonable is then not a huge leap or difficult to understand.
Personally I see the whole anti-speed machine as a political exercise that just inconveniences millions for no good reason. In the last 20 years or so my respect for the limits has changed massively because so many of them are now laughably slow.

[vonhosen]

cmaguire said:

Greendubber said:

Criminal damage is a lesser offence than PCOJ and people are happy for that to be ignored, so why should the police investigate your car being vandalised?

The issue here is that many do not consider PCoJ an appropriate response. You and others want to focus entirely on the PCoJ, whereas those that don't agree with the use of PCoJ draw attention to the original offence.
This all stems from the political actions of the authorities, whereby they are massively over-exaggerating the importance and effect of speeding, and by actively encouraging and facilitating the reduction of many limits as well they are seen to be using their power to force their agenda. An agenda many view as totally illogical and unreasonable.
A lack of respect for the limits is the result, and from there also a lack of respect for the enforcement of those limits. Trying to avoid being punished for something you perceive as unreasonable is then not a huge leap or difficult to understand.
Personally I see the whole anti-speed machine as a political exercise that just inconveniences millions for no good reason. In the last 20 years or so my respect for the limits has changed massively because so many of them are now laughably slow.

There's nothing wrong with trying to avoid being punished for any offence, by legal means that is.

[Greendubber]

cmaguire said:

Greendubber said:

Criminal damage is a lesser offence than PCOJ and people are happy for that to be ignored, so why should the police investigate your car being vandalised?

The issue here is that many do not consider PCoJ an appropriate response. You and others want to focus entirely on the PCoJ, whereas those that don't agree with the use of PCoJ draw attention to the original offence.
This all stems from the political actions of the authorities, whereby they are massively over-exaggerating the importance and effect of speeding, and by actively encouraging and facilitating the reduction of many limits as well they are seen to be using their power to force their agenda. An agenda many view as totally illogical and unreasonable.
A lack of respect for the limits is the result, and from there also a lack of respect for the enforcement of those limits. Trying to avoid being punished for something you perceive as unreasonable is then not a huge leap or difficult to understand.
Personally I see the whole anti-speed machine as a political exercise that just inconveniences millions for no good reason. In the last 20 years or so my respect for the limits has changed massively because so many of them are now laughably slow.

You and some others need to ignore the speeding offence, it's irrelevant to the PCOJ. It doesn't matter what the original offence was as far as the law is concerned, it's seperate.

You may not agree with it, that's fine but plenty of people on here don't have an issue with it and this guy was convicted fair and square. It really is a bit of a zero event! Stupid bloke gets caught doing something utterly stupid.

[anonymous-user]

vonhosen said:

There are 47 million of us in the UK & I don't see many marching to your drum beat call for action.
How's it going? How many have you got signed up to your call for action & what action are you going to take?

Lol, with such cases already getting such good press coverage and stirring up legitimate outrage, it seems I don’t have to do much at all.

That said if everyone fought their tickets at every opportunity rather than simply bowing down due to the fear of the system these cases are intended to create, would see the courts get backed up for months, even more so than they are now. Take away their ability to prosecute every silly minor motoring infraction due to limited resources and they’d have no option but to focus on real crimes imo.

[vonhosen]

Schmed said:

vonhosen said:

There are 47 million of us in the UK & I don't see many marching to your drum beat call for action.
How's it going? How many have you got signed up to your call for action & what action are you going to take?

Lol, with such cases already getting such good press coverage and stirring up legitimate outrage, it seems I don’t have to do much at all.

So where, when & what's the action?
When will we have change?
It's alright claiming it's a coming (with no evidence or timescale to support that).

Schmed said:

That said if everyone fought their tickets at every opportunity rather than simply bowing down due to the fear of the system these cases are intended to create, would see the courts get backed up for months, even more so than they are now. Take away their ability to prosecute every silly minor motoring infraction due to limited resources and they’d have no option but to focus on real crimes imo.

Again.
If my aunty.............

[anonymous-user]

Schmed said:

vonhosen said:

There are 47 million of us in the UK & I don't see many marching to your drum beat call for action.
How's it going? How many have you got signed up to your call for action & what action are you going to take?

Lol, with such cases already getting such good press coverage and stirring up legitimate outrage, it seems I don’t have to do much at all.

That said if everyone fought their tickets at every opportunity rather than simply bowing down due to the fear of the system these cases are intended to create, would see the courts get backed up for months, even more so than they are now. Take away their ability to prosecute every silly minor motoring infraction due to limited resources and they’d have no option but to focus on real crimes imo.

Lol indeed. You’re on a motoring forum and your views are in a minority even here! As to your wizard wheeze how to solve the ‘problem’, just get that organised when you’ve brought down fuel prices by boycotting BP, Esso etc in turn.

[andy_s]

Schmed said:

vonhosen said:

There are 47 million of us in the UK & I don't see many marching to your drum beat call for action.
How's it going? How many have you got signed up to your call for action & what action are you going to take?

Lol, with such cases already getting such good press coverage and stirring up legitimate outrage, it seems I don’t have to do much at all.

That said if everyone fought their tickets at every opportunity rather than simply bowing down due to the fear of the system these cases are intended to create, would see the courts get backed up for months, even more so than they are now. Take away their ability to prosecute every silly minor motoring infraction due to limited resources and they’d have no option but to focus on real crimes imo.

Your posts get increasingly subjective and hyperbolic the more entrenched you get. We don't live in a police state, everyone knows the rules and knows what will happen if you dick about with them. This is simply responsibility and consequence, he brought it on himself.

[anonymous-user]

vonhosen said:

Schmed said:

vonhosen said:

There are 47 million of us in the UK & I don't see many marching to your drum beat call for action.
How's it going? How many have you got signed up to your call for action & what action are you going to take?

Lol, with such cases already getting such good press coverage and stirring up legitimate outrage, it seems I don’t have to do much at all.

So where, when & what's the action?
When will we have change?
It's alright claiming it's a coming (with no evidence or timescale to support that).

Schmed said:

That said if everyone fought their tickets at every opportunity rather than simply bowing down due to the fear of the system these cases are intended to create, would see the courts get backed up for months, even more so than they are now. Take away their ability to prosecute every silly minor motoring infraction due to limited resources and they’d have no option but to focus on real crimes imo.

Again.
If my aunty.............

Lot of questions for one evening, Vonhosen. “Tell me your plans: Actions, change, timescales” all sound to me like the language of the police state... Hypothetically if something was in the pipeline do you really think the specifics would be announced on a public forum?

[anonymous-user]

cmaguire said:

The issue here is that many do not consider PCoJ an appropriate response. You and others want to focus entirely on the PCoJ, whereas those that don't agree with the use of PCoJ draw attention to the original offence.

That’s just plain wrong. PCoJ was not a “response” it was the crime committed. How many times does this have to be said? What “original offence” are you claiming was committed and he should have been prosecuted for?

[anonymous-user]

Roman Rhodes said:

Schmed said:

vonhosen said:

There are 47 million of us in the UK & I don't see many marching to your drum beat call for action.
How's it going? How many have you got signed up to your call for action & what action are you going to take?

Lol, with such cases already getting such good press coverage and stirring up legitimate outrage, it seems I don’t have to do much at all.

That said if everyone fought their tickets at every opportunity rather than simply bowing down due to the fear of the system these cases are intended to create, would see the courts get backed up for months, even more so than they are now. Take away their ability to prosecute every silly minor motoring infraction due to limited resources and they’d have no option but to focus on real crimes imo.

Lol indeed. You’re on a motoring forum and your views are in a minority even here! As to your wizard wheeze how to solve the ‘problem’, just get that organised when you’ve brought down fuel prices by boycotting BP, Esso etc in turn.

Fuel prices ? I think we’ve got bigger problems here with the justice system to start with, one thing at a time lol.

[Boosted LS1]

^ Who says his views are in the minority? Are you qualified? My take is that speeding is a taxable offence but just like parking fines and bus lane tickets some people won't fight it because to lose results in even more pain. The system is rigged against us. Iirc even the magistrates are a part of the camera/safety partnership. You're going to lose either way unless you can really prove your case.

It's funny that we never see education being promoted, just more and more blanket enforcement resulting in a dumbing down of drivers. Cash is king. Rake it in but don't spend it improving driving standards.

[JNW1]

Greendubber said:

cmaguire said:

Greendubber said:

Criminal damage is a lesser offence than PCOJ and people are happy for that to be ignored, so why should the police investigate your car being vandalised?

The issue here is that many do not consider PCoJ an appropriate response. You and others want to focus entirely on the PCoJ, whereas those that don't agree with the use of PCoJ draw attention to the original offence.
This all stems from the political actions of the authorities, whereby they are massively over-exaggerating the importance and effect of speeding, and by actively encouraging and facilitating the reduction of many limits as well they are seen to be using their power to force their agenda. An agenda many view as totally illogical and unreasonable.
A lack of respect for the limits is the result, and from there also a lack of respect for the enforcement of those limits. Trying to avoid being punished for something you perceive as unreasonable is then not a huge leap or difficult to understand.
Personally I see the whole anti-speed machine as a political exercise that just inconveniences millions for no good reason. In the last 20 years or so my respect for the limits has changed massively because so many of them are now laughably slow.

You and some others need to ignore the speeding offence, it's irrelevant to the PCOJ. It doesn't matter what the original offence was as far as the law is concerned, it's seperate.

You may not agree with it, that's fine but plenty of people on here don't have an issue with it and this guy was convicted fair and square. It really is a bit of a zero event! Stupid bloke gets caught doing something utterly stupid.

I think what many from a non-law enforcement background struggle to get their heads around is how an attempt to avoid something trivial can become such a serious offence. I suspect many would think sending someone to prison for seeking to avoid a speeding ticket is completely disproportionate, especially when others who commit crimes against individuals and/or property often escape with non-custodial sentences.

Now I know the response will be "ah, but seeking to avoid the speeding conviction was PCOJ and that's very serious don't you know" but, in all honestly, a large proportion of the public would say that's nonsense in a situation like this and that you ought to view it in the context of the original offence. I'm not defending the bloke who got put away - as you say, a stupid bloke caught doing something stupid - but detaining him at Her Majesty's pleasure doesn't feel like a proportionate response and seems a total waste of taxpayer money to me; wouldn't two or three hundred hours of community service have made more sense? Just seems the authorities are determined to make a point with anything to do with speeding which once again begs the question whether they've got their priorities right.....

[Greendubber]

JNW1 said:

Greendubber said:

cmaguire said:

Greendubber said:

Criminal damage is a lesser offence than PCOJ and people are happy for that to be ignored, so why should the police investigate your car being vandalised?

The issue here is that many do not consider PCoJ an appropriate response. You and others want to focus entirely on the PCoJ, whereas those that don't agree with the use of PCoJ draw attention to the original offence.
This all stems from the political actions of the authorities, whereby they are massively over-exaggerating the importance and effect of speeding, and by actively encouraging and facilitating the reduction of many limits as well they are seen to be using their power to force their agenda. An agenda many view as totally illogical and unreasonable.
A lack of respect for the limits is the result, and from there also a lack of respect for the enforcement of those limits. Trying to avoid being punished for something you perceive as unreasonable is then not a huge leap or difficult to understand.
Personally I see the whole anti-speed machine as a political exercise that just inconveniences millions for no good reason. In the last 20 years or so my respect for the limits has changed massively because so many of them are now laughably slow.

You and some others need to ignore the speeding offence, it's irrelevant to the PCOJ. It doesn't matter what the original offence was as far as the law is concerned, it's seperate.

You may not agree with it, that's fine but plenty of people on here don't have an issue with it and this guy was convicted fair and square. It really is a bit of a zero event! Stupid bloke gets caught doing something utterly stupid.

I think what many from a non-law enforcement background struggle to get their heads around is how an attempt to avoid something trivial can become such a serious offence. I suspect many would think sending someone to prison for seeking to avoid a speeding ticket is completely disproportionate, especially when others who commit crimes against individuals and/or property often escape with non-custodial sentences.

Now I know the response will be "ah, but seeking to avoid the speeding conviction was PCOJ and that's very serious don't you know" but, in all honestly, a large proportion of the public would say that's nonsense in a situation like this and that you ought to view it in the context of the original offence. I'm not defending the bloke who got put away - as you say, a stupid bloke caught doing something stupid - but detaining him at Her Majesty's pleasure doesn't feel like a proportionate response and seems a total waste of taxpayer money to me; wouldn't two or three hundred hours of community service have made more sense? Just seems the authorities are determined to make a point with anything to do with speeding which once again begs the question whether they've got their priorities right.....

It wouldnt matter if it wasn't a speeding offence, it would still be treated the same. It's not a war on speeding motorists.

[Boosted LS1]

^^ What he said.

[anonymous-user]

JNW1 said:

Now I know the response will be "ah, but seeking to avoid the speeding conviction was PCOJ and that's very serious don't you know" but, in all honestly, a large proportion of the public would say that's nonsense in a situation like this and that you ought to view it in the context of the original offence.

So if I get prosecuted for dropping a bit of litter and a witness is asked to appear for the prosecution it’s OK if I send my mates round to threaten to burn their house down unless they withdraw? After all, the “original offence” is minor isn’t it?

[vonhosen]

Boosted LS1 said:

^ Who says his views are in the minority? Are you qualified? My take is that speeding is a taxable offence but just like parking fines and bus lane tickets some people won't fight it because to lose results in even more pain. The system is rigged against us. Iirc even the magistrates are a part of the camera/safety partnership. You're going to lose either way unless you can really prove your case.

It's funny that we never see education being promoted, just more and more blanket enforcement resulting in a dumbing down of drivers. Cash is king. Rake it in but don't spend it improving driving standards.

We don't know the number in relation as to views, but we can see evidence that they don't care enough to force the issue.
You need enough to push a government over the tipping point, but what are you trying to tip them into doing?
Forcing the Police not to prosecute obstruction or PtCoJ?

If you want to spend money on education you have to have money sitting around to spend. There isn't, so they give the option to drivers to pay for their own education in lieu of FPNs/ prosecution.

[anonymous-user]

Boosted LS1 said:

^ Who says his views are in the minority? Are you qualified?

It's funny that we never see education being promoted.

Just IMO having read the thread.

Don’t people get offered speed awareness courses?

[JNW1]

Greendubber said:

JNW1 said:

Greendubber said:

cmaguire said:

Greendubber said:

Criminal damage is a lesser offence than PCOJ and people are happy for that to be ignored, so why should the police investigate your car being vandalised?

The issue here is that many do not consider PCoJ an appropriate response. You and others want to focus entirely on the PCoJ, whereas those that don't agree with the use of PCoJ draw attention to the original offence.
This all stems from the political actions of the authorities, whereby they are massively over-exaggerating the importance and effect of speeding, and by actively encouraging and facilitating the reduction of many limits as well they are seen to be using their power to force their agenda. An agenda many view as totally illogical and unreasonable.
A lack of respect for the limits is the result, and from there also a lack of respect for the enforcement of those limits. Trying to avoid being punished for something you perceive as unreasonable is then not a huge leap or difficult to understand.
Personally I see the whole anti-speed machine as a political exercise that just inconveniences millions for no good reason. In the last 20 years or so my respect for the limits has changed massively because so many of them are now laughably slow.

You and some others need to ignore the speeding offence, it's irrelevant to the PCOJ. It doesn't matter what the original offence was as far as the law is concerned, it's seperate.

You may not agree with it, that's fine but plenty of people on here don't have an issue with it and this guy was convicted fair and square. It really is a bit of a zero event! Stupid bloke gets caught doing something utterly stupid.

I think what many from a non-law enforcement background struggle to get their heads around is how an attempt to avoid something trivial can become such a serious offence. I suspect many would think sending someone to prison for seeking to avoid a speeding ticket is completely disproportionate, especially when others who commit crimes against individuals and/or property often escape with non-custodial sentences.

Now I know the response will be "ah, but seeking to avoid the speeding conviction was PCOJ and that's very serious don't you know" but, in all honestly, a large proportion of the public would say that's nonsense in a situation like this and that you ought to view it in the context of the original offence. I'm not defending the bloke who got put away - as you say, a stupid bloke caught doing something stupid - but detaining him at Her Majesty's pleasure doesn't feel like a proportionate response and seems a total waste of taxpayer money to me; wouldn't two or three hundred hours of community service have made more sense? Just seems the authorities are determined to make a point with anything to do with speeding which once again begs the question whether they've got their priorities right.....

It wouldnt matter if it wasn't a speeding offence, it would still be treated the same. It's not a war on speeding motorists.

So a prison sentence for seeking to avoid a speeding conviction is a proportionate response in your view and represents a sensible solution for the taxpayer?