Fraudulant Card Payment

[Thats What She Said]

DannyScene said:

for reference its a motor factors so hardly a small company that's struggling for money

Why doesnt that surprise me.


ETA removed company name to protect the OP.

Edited by Thats What She Said on Friday 31st August 18:41

[DannyScene]

Bumblebee7 said:

DannyScene said:

I'm going to check my contract when I get home and see if there is anything in there that means I am liable before I try and take this any further

It was a hell of a shock when they told me I would be paying as I always assumed they'd have insurance to cover themselves or that they'd at least want to try look after a member of staff

By all means check your contract but even if such a clause exists it would surely fall under the Unfair Contract Terms Act as a completely unfair and unenforceable standard term in a contract. They categorically cannot hold you liable for your actions, especially as what you did does not fall outside of the standard practices of the company.

Companies rarely look after their employees when push comes to shove, a company will not put the staff's needs before its own, if circumstances change etc. most companies will look at their staff as a number on a page and act accordingly.

I guess that part was naïve of me, I came from a company that was built up by one guy who still headed it up and treat every staff member like family despite being worth 100s of millions to a big national company that treats staff as you say like a number on a page

[Dixy]

Do not accept this, this is part of normal trading risk, I suspect your manager is allowing st to travel down.

[surveyor_101]

Order66 said:

This is illegal. It is an "unlawful deduction from wages" for which you have statutory protection under the Employment Rights Act 1996.

Tell them to get fcked. If they sack you haul them over the coals for wrongful dismissal.

.....if you have less than 24 months service you can't unless its a protected characteristic! IE Sex Orientation/Gender/Ethnicity

[Gareth79]

Holy moly, do not accept this deduction, and certainly not on a verbal decision by a manager. I'd be wanting a letter explaining precisely why the liability fell onto me. In this case I imagine it would need to state that certain documented procedures were not followed, but if you say those procedures didn't exist (or you had never been told about them and it was standard practice) then I can't see how they can.

Also, I can't see why those card terminals were even set up to allow customer-not-present transactions if it wasn't acceptable to the business.

[MrBarry123]

Gareth79 said:

Holy moly, do not accept this deduction, and certainly not on a verbal decision by a manager.

Awful behaviour by your employer OP.

[Funky Squirrel]

If true that's crazy, I can't imagine ECP pay their staff all that much. Best of luck.
I remember having a weekend job in a kitchen in my teens and being told broken plates etc would be deuducted but it never was.

[Wacky Racer]

This happened to me in my business a couple of years back.

Bloke rings up, ordered a couple of items worth £500, said he would pay in full with paypal (Which he did) but said he was ill in hospital and would send his "cousins" in to pick the items up.

I took written details of their photocard driving licences, which turned out to be forgeries with addresses that didn't exist.

Six weeks later, paypal reversed the charges, man claimed he never received them...... by then the images of the two men had been deleted from my CCTV, paypal didn't want to know because I had breeched their terms by allowing personal collection.

If I had sent them by recorded delivery I would have been OK.

Never again.

[Durzel]

OP - you can't allow this to be done (deductions), it's illegal.

[DannyScene]

Is it worth going to internal HR and should I ask my manager if it is his decision or wether it came from higher up?

I don't want to challenge it, stir the pot and makes things worse for me in the long run

[randlemarcus]

DannyScene said:

Is it worth going to internal HR and should I ask my manager if it is his decision or wether it came from higher up?

I don't want to challenge it, stir the pot and makes things worse for me in the long run

Depends on whether you can stomach a 450 hit over the next three months really.

It's happened, you've told your manager you will make it disappear. Going back on that, legal or not, will piss him off, regardless of HR opinion.

Best case scenario, he gets fired (highly unlikely). Worst case scenario, HR side with him, because they also think it's fine, and you get to job hunt slightly more actively.

Given that you now know you are working for a you should be getting your CV in shape anyway. And when the "no phone payments" kicks in, who is he going to be looking at? Might as well do it properly...

[oldbanger]

Whether you piss hr or your manager off by complaining, the bottom line is that these kind of salary deductions are illegal unless you have consented in writing:

http://m.acas.org.uk/index.aspx?articleid=4125

I can’t see any reason to suck it up. You are hardly going to avoid aggro, as this is a whole heap of totally unjustified, and I repeat, illegal aggro by itself.

Edited by oldbanger on Friday 17th August 20:22

[Order66]

surveyor_101 said:

Order66 said:

This is illegal. It is an "unlawful deduction from wages" for which you have statutory protection under the Employment Rights Act 1996.

Tell them to get fcked. If they sack you haul them over the coals for wrongful dismissal.

.....if you have less than 24 months service you can't unless its a protected characteristic! IE Sex Orientation/Gender/Ethnicity

Not true. Unfair dismissal based on the employee attempting to enforce their statutory rights has no qualifying period.

[Red Devil]

surveyor_101 said:

Order66 said:

This is illegal. It is an "unlawful deduction from wages" for which you have statutory protection under the Employment Rights Act 1996.

Tell them to get fcked. If they sack you haul them over the coals for wrongful dismissal.

.....if you have less than 24 months service you can't unless its a protected characteristic! IE Sex Orientation/Gender/Ethnicity

Try arguing that one out with a 'Barrister specialising in employment law...' (the quote below is taken from the other linked thread). Good luck.

Breadvan72 said:

Dismissal for assertion of the statutory right not to have unlawful deductions from wages is automatically unfair, and no qualifying period of service is required for the making of such a claim.

[anonymous-user]

OP, I see from your profile that you are in Leeds

I don't think it would do you any harm to speak with an Emplyoment Lawyer - an initial consultation should be enough to get things rolling and convince you that the employer is in the wrong here

A local one that seems well regarded (winner of recent Employment Law awards etc.) is Morrish

https://www.morrishsolicitors.com/client-services/...

There are others

[The Mad Monk]

DannyScene said:

Is it worth going to internal HR and should I ask my manager if it is his decision or wether it came from higher up?

I don't want to challenge it, stir the pot and makes things worse for me in the long run

Never mind all that.

It's now 8 o'clock Saturday morning, have you checked your contract of employment thing?

I think you will find (IANAL) that they cannot deduct money without your agreement.

Do not agree.

[Dixy]

DannyScene said:

Is it worth going to internal HR and should I ask my manager if it is his decision or wether it came from higher up?

I don't want to challenge it, stir the pot and makes things worse for me in the long run

Tell your manager you want it all in writing from HR and that you do not agree to them taking anything from your salary.

[anonymous-user]

Did you get anywhere with this OP?

[Slaav]

Surely a common sense approach is required?

Tell your manager that you don't accept the deduction. Explain that your understanding is that they cannot do that to you. Ask him/her if they would like you to put it in writing to the manager and to HR?

My guess is that it will all go away and then you have a quite word with your manager once it does.

If it doesn't go away, put it in writing and ask then why they feel justified and on what legal basis they intend to deduct the monies - in writing please so that there is no confusion. It will go away.

If it doesn't, tell them that you (in writing and verbally) have a meeting with a lawyer or CAB if you wont to tread carefully. It will go away.

If it doesn't, confirm in writing that you are seeing a lawyer and requesting legal advice as the lawyer has verbally asked you if you are being constructively dismissed? It will go away...

https://www.gov.uk/dismissal/unfair-and-constructi...

If it doesn't, explain that you are not happy with their conduct and will be pursuing a case for the above and get another job. Pursue the bu66ers.

[pavarotti1980]

Knowing a couple of people who work for ECP they seem to confirm the consensus that they are very poor employers