Crime and punishment
Discussion
Oceanrower said:
Well, the one I put up was a BBC reporter. You can make your own judgement on the reliability of it.
Here's one from the Telegraph:https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2018/11/16/labour...
And one from The Guardian:
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/nov/16/la...
You can make your own judgement on which to ignore.
The BBC was first with the report.
I'm not sure if this adds much to the charge. Is she still suggesting she wasn't the driver? I thought it was all down to: 'I just signed a bit of paper put in front of me'. Has her brother pleaded to it?
If the aid is all he says he is, I feel sorry for him. I can't have been easy for him. He's out of a job whichever way the trial decides and he'll probably not get another job in politics. I mean, who wants someone honest?
If the aid is all he says he is, I feel sorry for him. I can't have been easy for him. He's out of a job whichever way the trial decides and he'll probably not get another job in politics. I mean, who wants someone honest?
I've been reading these minute by minute tweets of the proceedings, it's strangely gripping:
https://twitter.com/BBCHelenaLee/status/1063447580...
https://twitter.com/BBCHelenaLee/status/1063447580...
Derek Smith said:
I'm not sure if this adds much to the charge. Is she still suggesting she wasn't the driver? I thought it was all down to: 'I just signed a bit of paper put in front of me'. Has her brother pleaded to it?
If the aide is all he says he is, I feel sorry for him. I can't have been easy for him. He's out of a job whichever way the trial decides and he'll probably not get another job in politics. I mean, who wants someone honest?
No comment interview. Defence Statement may not address this point. Prosecution have to get past half time and she may not give evidence if they do.If the aide is all he says he is, I feel sorry for him. I can't have been easy for him. He's out of a job whichever way the trial decides and he'll probably not get another job in politics. I mean, who wants someone honest?
My brief reading of this case is speeding offences in June, July and August. I’m not entirely clear who received notices and the s.172 forms. Brother has pleaded guilty to all three PCJ offences arising. Sister is having a trial for the July offence only.
If the press reporting is accurate (blue moon tonight?) then some interesting suggestions / questions from defence counsel. To W1 - you may have got the date wrong. To W2 - you may have got the time wrong. What’s the defence case - wrong date or wrong time?
agtlaw said:
No comment interview. Defence Statement may not address this point. Prosecution have to get past half time and she may not give evidence if they do.
My brief reading of this case is speeding offences in June, July and August. I’m not entirely clear who received notices and the s.172 forms. Brother has pleaded guilty to all three PCJ offences arising. Sister is having a trial for the July offence only.
If the press reporting is accurate (blue moon tonight?) then some interesting suggestions / questions from defence counsel. To W1 - you may have got the date wrong. To W2 - you may have got the time wrong. What’s the defence case - wrong date or wrong time?
My understanding is that brother was driving in June & July. She was only driving, allegedly, in August but brother persuaded her to try his patented slam dunk get out of jail free card.My brief reading of this case is speeding offences in June, July and August. I’m not entirely clear who received notices and the s.172 forms. Brother has pleaded guilty to all three PCJ offences arising. Sister is having a trial for the July offence only.
If the press reporting is accurate (blue moon tonight?) then some interesting suggestions / questions from defence counsel. To W1 - you may have got the date wrong. To W2 - you may have got the time wrong. What’s the defence case - wrong date or wrong time?
But I could be wrong.
hutchst said:
My understanding is that brother was driving in June & July. She was only driving, allegedly, in August but brother persuaded her to try his patented slam dunk get out of jail free card.
But I could be wrong.
This is my understanding too - different vehicles and speeding events, but the same Russian was named on the S172 in each case.But I could be wrong.
hutchst said:
My understanding is that brother was driving in June & July. She was only driving, allegedly, in August but brother persuaded her to try his patented slam dunk get out of jail free card.
But I could be wrong.
Her brother had got away with a couple and for whatever reason she thought she could to.But I could be wrong.
However they both lived at the same address and named the same guy using a phone number associated to the brother.
Doesn't surprise me even an ally of the 'greater good' Corbyn will fiddle a speeding fine, what else her expenses. Nothing changed in labour still think they are above the law. Hopefully the throw the book at her as they did with lib dem and his ex wife who tried a similar scam.
Joke is she is in charge of discipline within the labour party!! She should be disbarred from practising commercial property law and kicked out of the commons. Corbyn clearly isn't the man people make out as he should of suspended this crook from the party.
hutchst said:
My understanding is that brother was driving in June & July. She was only driving, allegedly, in August but brother persuaded her to try his patented slam dunk get out of jail free card.
But I could be wrong.
Looks wrong to me.But I could be wrong.
“Prosecutors allege either she or her brother were behind the wheel of a speeding vehicle on July 24 last year but together with her brother, told the authorities someone else - Aleks Antipow - was driving.
The second similar count relates to an incident on August 23 when her brother was allegedly driving, but she told authorities the same man had been behind the wheel.
Festus, 33, a singer from Cambridge, also faces a third charge of perverting the course of justice relating to a similar offence, where he allegedly blamed Suvradip Paul for a speeding offence on June 17 last year.”
It seems to read differently depending on who is reporting it - on the BBC it says "The court was told Ms Onasanya, who is the MP for Peterborough, was sent a Notice of Intended Prosecution (NIP) after her car was clocked by a speed camera in Thorney, near Peterborough, on 24 July last year. She returned the paperwork naming Aleks Antipow as the driver, jurors heard.
The court was told the MP's brother, Festus Onasanya, had also "deployed the tactic" when his car was caught by a speed camera on two occasions last year.
Mr Jeremy accused Ms Onasanya, who is a solicitor, of "adopting her brother's method of evading prosecution".
But yes - heavily dependent on how the reporting is worded.
There doesn't seem to be any mention of who signed the S172 though - in the few cases I've had to deal with surrounding NIPs and similar, our fines administrator has made a witness statement as to why it is her signature on all of the documents.
The court was told the MP's brother, Festus Onasanya, had also "deployed the tactic" when his car was caught by a speed camera on two occasions last year.
Mr Jeremy accused Ms Onasanya, who is a solicitor, of "adopting her brother's method of evading prosecution".
But yes - heavily dependent on how the reporting is worded.
There doesn't seem to be any mention of who signed the S172 though - in the few cases I've had to deal with surrounding NIPs and similar, our fines administrator has made a witness statement as to why it is her signature on all of the documents.
Derek Smith said:
I'm not sure if this adds much to the charge. Is she still suggesting she wasn't the driver? I thought it was all down to: 'I just signed a bit of paper put in front of me'. Has her brother pleaded to it?
If the aid is all he says he is, I feel sorry for him. I can't have been easy for him. He's out of a job whichever way the trial decides and he'll probably not get another job in politics. I mean, who wants someone honest?
He is described in everything I have read as her former aide.If the aid is all he says he is, I feel sorry for him. I can't have been easy for him. He's out of a job whichever way the trial decides and he'll probably not get another job in politics. I mean, who wants someone honest?
I have no idea what he does for a living now.
Is a lack of honesty and morals a 'must have' to work in politics?
Presumably that would be one of the questions at the interview stage.
Rather than a line in your CV.
S11Steve said:
It seems to read differently depending on who is reporting it - on the BBC it says "The court was told Ms Onasanya, who is the MP for Peterborough, was sent a Notice of Intended Prosecution (NIP) after her car was clocked by a speed camera in Thorney, near Peterborough, on 24 July last year. She returned the paperwork naming Aleks Antipow as the driver, jurors heard.
The court was told the MP's brother, Festus Onasanya, had also "deployed the tactic" when his car was caught by a speed camera on two occasions last year.
Mr Jeremy accused Ms Onasanya, who is a solicitor, of "adopting her brother's method of evading prosecution".
But yes - heavily dependent on how the reporting is worded.
There doesn't seem to be any mention of who signed the S172 though - in the few cases I've had to deal with surrounding NIPs and similar, our fines administrator has made a witness statement as to why it is her signature on all of the documents.
The order of offences isn’t mentioned. It says two other occasions, not two previous occasions. Appears to me that you’ve made an assumption which isn’t supported by reporting elsewhere.The court was told the MP's brother, Festus Onasanya, had also "deployed the tactic" when his car was caught by a speed camera on two occasions last year.
Mr Jeremy accused Ms Onasanya, who is a solicitor, of "adopting her brother's method of evading prosecution".
But yes - heavily dependent on how the reporting is worded.
There doesn't seem to be any mention of who signed the S172 though - in the few cases I've had to deal with surrounding NIPs and similar, our fines administrator has made a witness statement as to why it is her signature on all of the documents.
Edited by agtlaw on Friday 16th November 18:56
Oceanrower said:
Well, either the Telegraph or the Guardian reporter should be done for plagiarism.
Damn near word for word!
It's probably come from a news agency if it's word for word. Damn near word for word!
Mind you, they might have interns on the website so one can't read anything into their reports with any certainty.
I used to work on a local newspaper. The journos, especially the young ones, were terrified of the sub-editor. Times have changed.
agtlaw said:
The order of offences isn’t mentioned. It says two other occasions, not two previous occasions. Appears to me that you’ve made an assumption which isn’t supported by reporting elsewhere.
You're right, and my mistake, that brother's offences straddle hers. He was driving in June and August, she in July (allegedly). Does that clear things up a bit?Edited by agtlaw on Friday 16th November 18:56
Edited by hutchst on Saturday 17th November 05:49
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