Being messed around, when to say enough is enough?
Discussion
The problem here is that the car isn’t physically going to be easy to remove. It sounds like it’s going to be blocked in by other cars and generally be a nightmare unless the garage owner is fully on side.
On the basis that you are a businessman, rather than a crook, I think you need to walk in, ask for coffee, look the guy between the eyeballs and produce a wad of (legitimate) cash.
I’d say - look - I’m disappointed - but I don’t want to fall out. I’m leaving here today with my car. I have money here to pay an invoice that is commensurate with a job not finished, not well done and not on time. If you’re man enough to admit on this one you have screwed up then I’m man enough to still pay you at least some money.
I’d go on to tell him that if agreement can be reached today then that is an end to it for you both. A line drawn. I’d explain that if not, then he’s looking at legal action and all sorts of unpleasantness that will lead to both of you being losers.
And then I’d make a deal for right or for wrong.
And not look back.
There will be people who will approach this differently of course, but in my experience if he is even half a reasonable man he will be able to understand your viewpoint and will probably be glad of the headache of the car out of the way and some money back in the bank. Make sure you get a receipt and understand that my method falls down the moment you get the car home and discover half the bits are missing and the wiring is rubbish. But also understand that the error has already been made - you chose a bum guy - now it’s a question of paying for that.
If you are very wealthy, disregard everything I have just written, because I’m fairly certain that expensive legal redress will work. The problem with that is that unless it becomes a matter of sheer principle working with the legal profession is probably not going to be good value for money if money is an issue in the consideration.
Whichever way, best of luck.
On the basis that you are a businessman, rather than a crook, I think you need to walk in, ask for coffee, look the guy between the eyeballs and produce a wad of (legitimate) cash.
I’d say - look - I’m disappointed - but I don’t want to fall out. I’m leaving here today with my car. I have money here to pay an invoice that is commensurate with a job not finished, not well done and not on time. If you’re man enough to admit on this one you have screwed up then I’m man enough to still pay you at least some money.
I’d go on to tell him that if agreement can be reached today then that is an end to it for you both. A line drawn. I’d explain that if not, then he’s looking at legal action and all sorts of unpleasantness that will lead to both of you being losers.
And then I’d make a deal for right or for wrong.
And not look back.
There will be people who will approach this differently of course, but in my experience if he is even half a reasonable man he will be able to understand your viewpoint and will probably be glad of the headache of the car out of the way and some money back in the bank. Make sure you get a receipt and understand that my method falls down the moment you get the car home and discover half the bits are missing and the wiring is rubbish. But also understand that the error has already been made - you chose a bum guy - now it’s a question of paying for that.
If you are very wealthy, disregard everything I have just written, because I’m fairly certain that expensive legal redress will work. The problem with that is that unless it becomes a matter of sheer principle working with the legal profession is probably not going to be good value for money if money is an issue in the consideration.
Whichever way, best of luck.
If the car is 90% finished, I would be very surprised if the 10% left to do is not being stopped by a fault in the other 90% he can’t find given the amount of electrical work involved.
Tricky situation, but you should get prepared to take him to the small claims court after the independent inspection to get some of your money back, which unfortunately it seems you will have to pay to retrieve your property legally.
Hope it turns out well for you OP. I had an issue where a TVR dealer body shop seemed to prefer to repair high volume tin tops rather than put a new back end on my Grif which had been hit from behind. I used to go there regularly and see absolutely no progress and deeper levels of dust collecting on it while a stream of other cars were going out of their doors. Very frustrating, and no amount of complaining could change that priority. Given it was half way through a fairly serious fibreglass repair, it was tough to find anyone else to take it on.
Only 5 months but a summer lost in a crap substitute car.
Tricky situation, but you should get prepared to take him to the small claims court after the independent inspection to get some of your money back, which unfortunately it seems you will have to pay to retrieve your property legally.
Hope it turns out well for you OP. I had an issue where a TVR dealer body shop seemed to prefer to repair high volume tin tops rather than put a new back end on my Grif which had been hit from behind. I used to go there regularly and see absolutely no progress and deeper levels of dust collecting on it while a stream of other cars were going out of their doors. Very frustrating, and no amount of complaining could change that priority. Given it was half way through a fairly serious fibreglass repair, it was tough to find anyone else to take it on.
Only 5 months but a summer lost in a crap substitute car.
Finally spoke to him yesterday... made it clear I was collecting the car finished of not, expressed my extreme disappointment, but offered to pay whatever is due, I don’t want to fall out but need to draw a line etc.
He appologised profusely, understands he has f
ked up and promised it will be finished and running within 2 weeks, this was all said in front of a witness (another professional and someone that he would be embarrassed to let down - the guy that reccomended him).
You will all say I’m being soft, collect the car etc... my current situation means I can’t get to the car for 2 weeks anyway (2nd child due 2 days ago, work busier than a very busy thing)... so this is the best option and no sooner than I could get there even if I wanted to.
Collecting is not that straight forward, need to organise trailer transport, prep the guy that’s taking it next for snagging and bodywork etc (thankfully a close friend and just round the corner from my home), no matter what, the car is being collected in 2 weeks.
We shall see... if it runs, doesn’t explode and makes the numbers I want... I’ll be posting a video, if he fails again... I’ll collect the car and take it to someone that can do the job. Will also update this thread with further details and a timelined rundown of my experience with the “business”.
He appologised profusely, understands he has f
ked up and promised it will be finished and running within 2 weeks, this was all said in front of a witness (another professional and someone that he would be embarrassed to let down - the guy that reccomended him).You will all say I’m being soft, collect the car etc... my current situation means I can’t get to the car for 2 weeks anyway (2nd child due 2 days ago, work busier than a very busy thing)... so this is the best option and no sooner than I could get there even if I wanted to.
Collecting is not that straight forward, need to organise trailer transport, prep the guy that’s taking it next for snagging and bodywork etc (thankfully a close friend and just round the corner from my home), no matter what, the car is being collected in 2 weeks.
We shall see... if it runs, doesn’t explode and makes the numbers I want... I’ll be posting a video, if he fails again... I’ll collect the car and take it to someone that can do the job. Will also update this thread with further details and a timelined rundown of my experience with the “business”.
Edited by sl0wlane on Thursday 23 May 05:23
There would be a big red warning flag to me- what if he's having business issues? Struggling along and has mothballed yours whilst he's chasing immediate quick cash flow.
Go and get your car asap. Pay him an acceptable percentage. Work it out on the spot.
Have you been down there and seen your car recently? Don't forwarn him, he may take parts off and say not able to pick up or it's stored 'elsewhere'. It maY even have been sold..
Go and get your car asap. Pay him an acceptable percentage. Work it out on the spot.
Have you been down there and seen your car recently? Don't forwarn him, he may take parts off and say not able to pick up or it's stored 'elsewhere'. It maY even have been sold..
sl0wlane said:
Finally spoke to him yesterday... made it clear I was collecting the car finished of not, expressed my extreme disappointment, but offered to pay whatever is due, I don’t want to fall out but need to draw a line etc.
He appologised profusely, understands he has fked up and promised it will be finished and running within 2 weeks, this was all said in front of a witness (another professional and someone that he would be embarrassed to let down - the guy that reccomended him).
You will all say I’m being soft, collect the car etc... my current situation means I can’t get to the car for 2 weeks anyway (2nd child due 2 days ago, work busier than a very busy thing)... so this is the best option and no sooner than I could get there even if I wanted to.
Collecting is not that straight forward, need to organise trailer transport, prep the guy that’s taking it next for snagging and bodywork etc (thankfully a close friend and just round the corner from my home), no matter what, the car is being collected in 2 weeks.
We shall see... if it runs, doesn’t explode and makes the numbers I want... I’ll be posting a video, if he fails again... I’ll collect the car and take it to someone that can do the job. Will also update this thread with further details and a timelined rundown of my experience with the “business”.
Is this a wind up ?He appologised profusely, understands he has f
ked up and promised it will be finished and running within 2 weeks, this was all said in front of a witness (another professional and someone that he would be embarrassed to let down - the guy that reccomended him).You will all say I’m being soft, collect the car etc... my current situation means I can’t get to the car for 2 weeks anyway (2nd child due 2 days ago, work busier than a very busy thing)... so this is the best option and no sooner than I could get there even if I wanted to.
Collecting is not that straight forward, need to organise trailer transport, prep the guy that’s taking it next for snagging and bodywork etc (thankfully a close friend and just round the corner from my home), no matter what, the car is being collected in 2 weeks.
We shall see... if it runs, doesn’t explode and makes the numbers I want... I’ll be posting a video, if he fails again... I’ll collect the car and take it to someone that can do the job. Will also update this thread with further details and a timelined rundown of my experience with the “business”.
Edited by sl0wlane on Thursday 23 May 05:23
I accept the OP has bigger things to worry about with the imminent arrival of a child, but I personally think he’s being a complete and utter fool. The garage guy clearly doesn’t give two sts about his reputation, or he’d have had the car sorted/returned by now. Making yet more promises about it being ready in two weeks aren’t worth the proverbial “paper” they’re written on, irrelevant of who they’re made in front of. I’m surprised the OPks friend is falling for this guff and isn’t hugely embarrassed himself about the whole fiasco.
I’ll bet £25 the car isn’t sorted as promised. If it is, I’ll gladly apologise to the OP, who is clearly a much more trusting type than I am. I’ll also chuck that £25 wager into a charity of the OP’s choice.
I don’t wish to sound rude, but the OP strikes me as a gullible, naive fool.
ts about his reputation, or he’d have had the car sorted/returned by now. Making yet more promises about it being ready in two weeks aren’t worth the proverbial “paper” they’re written on, irrelevant of who they’re made in front of. I’m surprised the OPks friend is falling for this guff and isn’t hugely embarrassed himself about the whole fiasco. I’ll bet £25 the car isn’t sorted as promised. If it is, I’ll gladly apologise to the OP, who is clearly a much more trusting type than I am. I’ll also chuck that £25 wager into a charity of the OP’s choice.
I don’t wish to sound rude, but the OP strikes me as a gullible, naive fool.
Off Topic - the problem the OP thinks he faces recovering his car might benefit from an experience of mine. A couple of years ago I worked as a driver for a secondhand car dealer. Fetching and delivering cars included dealing with irate customers. I knew i was in for some grief with one car I took back. Some of a long list of complaints had been rectified and some not. The guy answered the door and we started off amicably enough but then he asked what had been done and became immediately angry and aggressive. I'm not a street fighting man. Diplomacy is my preferred route. After a minute or so the guy suddenly became much more reasonable and agreeable. This was better. What I didn't realise was that Istvan, the large Hungarian martial arts aficionado whose resting face was one of silent menace, had got out the other car he had brought to take me back in and had come to stand quietly behind me. He was a lovely guy with a gentle nature who recognised that a lot of folk couldn't see that side of him and he used this phenomenon to good effect. I used to watch Minder and thought most of it was hokum but in some circumstances it works. I witnessed it that day.
Speak softly and carry a big stick. Take a couple of heavies with you. It might be crude but it will help.
Speak softly and carry a big stick. Take a couple of heavies with you. It might be crude but it will help.
OP, I mean this in a good way.
Read back through your posts.
Call the garage. Set a date and time.
Tell him you are coming to agree a full and final settlement, and to walk through the work that has been completed, and that you expect an itemised invoice. Stay calm. Make it a reasonable negotiation.
Recover your car.
Read back through your posts.
Call the garage. Set a date and time.
Tell him you are coming to agree a full and final settlement, and to walk through the work that has been completed, and that you expect an itemised invoice. Stay calm. Make it a reasonable negotiation.
Recover your car.
Sa Calobra said:
There would be a big red warning flag to me- what if he's having business issues? Struggling along and has mothballed yours whilst he's chasing immediate quick cash flow.
Go and get your car asap. Pay him an acceptable percentage. Work it out on the spot.
Have you been down there and seen your car recently? Don't forwarn him, he may take parts off and say not able to pick up or it's stored 'elsewhere'. It maY even have been sold..
This is what I'd be worried about.Go and get your car asap. Pay him an acceptable percentage. Work it out on the spot.
Have you been down there and seen your car recently? Don't forwarn him, he may take parts off and say not able to pick up or it's stored 'elsewhere'. It maY even have been sold..
I had a dispute with a tuning garage about my Skyline R33 GTR that they were working on. They made promises like this guy, and when they had a final deadline from me they used that time to liberate some parts from the car that I subsequently had to pay another garage to replace (had to get the car trailered to them too). Cost me several thousand in the end, the only consolation I had was that they went bust less than a year later.
If he hasn't finished it in 6 months then the chances of him finishing it in 2 weeks is close to 0%. It is possible, but vanishingly unlikely. It sounds like the guy managed to sweet talk the OP.
OP: Did you even see the car and verify the current state? How do you know that 2 weeks is even achievable?
Dibble said:
I’ll bet £25 the car isn’t sorted as promised. If it is, I’ll gladly apologise to the OP, who is clearly a much more trusting type than I am. I’ll also chuck that £25 wager into a charity of the OP’s choice.
Top man.Dibble said:
I don’t wish to sound rude, but the OP strikes me as a gullible, naive fool.
That is a little on the cruel side. I've been in his situation, you want to believe it will be sorted, because you know the aggro you're going to have if it isn't - both recovering the car and getting someone else to finish it off. If you've got a kid on the way too it's the last thing you want to be thinking about.I do agree though, it won't be done in 2 weeks and the OP will be in exactly the same boat then, or worse.
Edited by Durzel on Thursday 23 May 09:51
sl0wlane said:
Finally spoke to him yesterday... made it clear I was collecting the car finished of not, expressed my extreme disappointment, but offered to pay whatever is due, I don’t want to fall out but need to draw a line etc.
He appologised profusely, understands he has fked up and promised it will be finished and running within 2 weeks, this was all said in front of a witness (another professional and someone that he would be embarrassed to let down - the guy that reccomended him).
You will all say I’m being soft, collect the car etc... my current situation means I can’t get to the car for 2 weeks anyway (2nd child due 2 days ago, work busier than a very busy thing)... so this is the best option and no sooner than I could get there even if I wanted to.
Collecting is not that straight forward, need to organise trailer transport, prep the guy that’s taking it next for snagging and bodywork etc (thankfully a close friend and just round the corner from my home), no matter what, the car is being collected in 2 weeks.
We shall see... if it runs, doesn’t explode and makes the numbers I want... I’ll be posting a video, if he fails again... I’ll collect the car and take it to someone that can do the job. Will also update this thread with further details and a timelined rundown of my experience with the “business”.
unlike some of the other comments I think this is a pragmatic approach. You have a fixed deadline to collect the car. I would back this up in writing to confirm what was said. He appologised profusely, understands he has f
ked up and promised it will be finished and running within 2 weeks, this was all said in front of a witness (another professional and someone that he would be embarrassed to let down - the guy that reccomended him).You will all say I’m being soft, collect the car etc... my current situation means I can’t get to the car for 2 weeks anyway (2nd child due 2 days ago, work busier than a very busy thing)... so this is the best option and no sooner than I could get there even if I wanted to.
Collecting is not that straight forward, need to organise trailer transport, prep the guy that’s taking it next for snagging and bodywork etc (thankfully a close friend and just round the corner from my home), no matter what, the car is being collected in 2 weeks.
We shall see... if it runs, doesn’t explode and makes the numbers I want... I’ll be posting a video, if he fails again... I’ll collect the car and take it to someone that can do the job. Will also update this thread with further details and a timelined rundown of my experience with the “business”.
Edited by sl0wlane on Thursday 23 May 05:23
I don't think it will be completed but for the sake of 2 weeks and getting a paper trail sorted ready for court its worth waiting these 2 weeks which is a time line that fits in for the OP.
superlightr said:
unlike some of the other comments I think this is a pragmatic approach. You have a fixed deadline to collect the car. I would back this up in writing to confirm what was said.
I don't think it will be completed but for the sake of 2 weeks and getting a paper trail sorted ready for court its worth waiting these 2 weeks which is a time line that fits in for the OP.
+1 , easy enough for people to shout the odds when it’s not them stuck in the situation .I don't think it will be completed but for the sake of 2 weeks and getting a paper trail sorted ready for court its worth waiting these 2 weeks which is a time line that fits in for the OP.
The guy sounds like he has the absolute worst personality for someone with the job of building a wiring harness from scratch. He sounds like he would be more at home doing oil and filter changes without oiling the rubber seal, and cross threading the sump plug.
I'd be shocked if the car runs properly, if at all following this guys 'work'.
I'd be shocked if the car runs properly, if at all following this guys 'work'.
Giving the guy another two weeks does seem like the triumph of hope over experience.
Unfortunately such people are usually well practiced at endlessly stringing the "more yielding" folks along. I imagine on the appointed day of collection he will have magically contracted some debilitating disease that needs extended hospital treatment. I fear the story has a few more twists and turns yet.....
Unfortunately such people are usually well practiced at endlessly stringing the "more yielding" folks along. I imagine on the appointed day of collection he will have magically contracted some debilitating disease that needs extended hospital treatment. I fear the story has a few more twists and turns yet.....
Bad spot to be in op, regardless of how it's come about. Hope it all comes together for you. I'd at least be wanting to see the car immediately with someone you can use as a witness and taking fairly detailed pics for future reference personally. Dates, times, names and details of conversations may also be of some use down the line. Very much hope it becomes more straightforward from here on in.
superlightr said:
unlike some of the other comments I think this is a pragmatic approach. You have a fixed deadline to collect the car. I would back this up in writing to confirm what was said.
I don't think it will be completed but for the sake of 2 weeks and getting a paper trail sorted ready for court its worth waiting these 2 weeks which is a time line that fits in for the OP.
Give him a copy of the paper trail now, that may spur him on.I don't think it will be completed but for the sake of 2 weeks and getting a paper trail sorted ready for court its worth waiting these 2 weeks which is a time line that fits in for the OP.
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