Old people with speed guns

[bigdog3]

KM said:

bigdog3 said:

KM said:

Sorry but how does the length of time I’ve been on here invalidate my point?

Speeding is against the law and if you commit the offence, surely it’s only fair you get punished.

And if the law is an ass, so are you

Wow, childish

Ooooh bh

[anonymous-user]

KM said:

We aren’t talking about a tiny margin over, we’re on about the fact it seems this whole forum condones it.

Ah, so your speeding margins are ok.

But. You’re breaking the law

Edited by anonymous-user on Thursday 15th August 10:26

[bigdog3]

KM said:

We aren’t talking about a tiny margin over, we’re on about the fact it seems this whole forum condones it.

There are those with intellectual capacity to challenge authority and its impositions on the population (eg politically motivated laws).

There are those who find thinking too difficult and prefer to leave it to their "superiors".

If you're capable, you make the choice...

[Paul Dishman]

KM said:

We aren’t talking about a tiny margin over, we’re on about the fact it seems this whole forum condones it.

This forum used to be sub-titled “Speed Matters” and many of us enjoy driving at speeds that may exceed a number on a pole.
Perhaps you’d be more suited to Brake or Mumsnet

[bigdog3]

Paul Dishman said:

KM said:

We aren’t talking about a tiny margin over, we’re on about the fact it seems this whole forum condones it.

This forum used to be sub-titled “Speed Matters” and many of us enjoy driving at speeds that may exceed a number on a pole.
Perhaps you’d be more suited to Brake or Mumsnet

The way things are going, could soon be time for PistonHeads and Brake to amalgamate

[Johnnytheboy]

KM said:

May I just add that the once I went just over, I was fully aware however your point seems to just be to dismiss the fact it is breaking the law regardless of how petty. Basically you are just trying to ‘mug me off’ which fair enough but the fact is almost everyone on here seems to dislike anyone who doesn’t do 35 in a 30 etc.

I see your point however speeding is just something I hate since it does affect lives when idiot drivers mess up and kill innocent people

You'll fit in this sub forum just fine, it's increasingly populated by zealots like you. The rest of the site: not so much.

[bigdog3]

KM said:

May I just add that the once I went just over, I was fully aware however your point seems to just be to dismiss the fact it is breaking the law regardless of how petty. Basically you are just trying to ‘mug me off’ which fair enough but the fact is almost everyone on here seems to dislike anyone who doesn’t do 35 in a 30 etc.

I see your point however speeding is just something I hate since it does affect lives when idiot drivers mess up and kill innocent people

Are you a rabid leftie or just a troll ?

[Graveworm]

KM said:

May I just add that the once I went just over, I was fully aware however your point seems to just be to dismiss the fact it is breaking the law regardless of how petty. Basically you are just trying to ‘mug me off’ which fair enough but the fact is almost everyone on here seems to dislike anyone who doesn’t do 35 in a 30 etc.

I see your point however speeding is just something I hate since it does affect lives when idiot drivers mess up and kill innocent people

Driving faster all other things being equal increases risk. But you do know that when drivers exceed the speed limit they are far less likely to mess up or kill innocent people?

[bigdog3]

Johnnytheboy said:

You'll fit in this sub forum just fine, it's increasingly populated by zealots like you. The rest of the site: not so much.

Try News, Politics & Economics if you want zealots

[Dixy]

KM said:

May I just add that the once I went just over, I was fully aware however your point seems to just be to dismiss the fact it is breaking the law regardless of how petty. Basically you are just trying to ‘mug me off’ which fair enough but the fact is almost everyone on here seems to dislike anyone who doesn’t do 35 in a 30 etc.

I see your point however speeding is just something I hate since it does affect lives when idiot drivers mess up and kill innocent people

To respond to some of your points.
The reason why you are getting so much vitriol as a new poster is it appears you may have joined purely to be a Troll.
Speed is only a factor in a very small percentage of KSIs.
Many speed limits are set against national guidelines by the wrinkleys sat on parish councils and when actual police do proper speed checks they are frequently the ones who get caught.

The police frequently say let us do our job and then delegate this task to vigilantes, in the southern states of the USA they take it a little further.

[anonymous-user]

KM said:

May I just add that the once I went just over, I was fully aware however your point seems to just be to dismiss the fact it is breaking the law regardless of how petty. Basically you are just trying to ‘mug me off’ which fair enough but the fact is almost everyone on here seems to dislike anyone who doesn’t do 35 in a 30 etc.

I see your point however speeding is just something I hate since it does affect lives when idiot drivers mess up and kill innocent people

So it’s ‘once’ now

It’s like this. The reason new drivers are charged so much to insure their vehicles is that as a group they are a big risk. They don’t fully understand road craft, inexperienced and full of themselves they make fundamental errors of judgement. I know this, because I was one, all are some point.

Wading into debates about speeding sounding like a newly promoted anti speed campaigner is what is ‘mugging you off’. You’ll learn it’s not ‘speeding’ that is the problem, no, that’s just good for revenue. The real issue are those who use inappropriate speed for their surroundings. Hence why so many condone it, in the right places.

When did kids become so terribly boring?

[bigdog3]

KM said:

We can’t keep going around in these circles, you all like to speed. You can all crack on with that but please don’t try and make it seem that I’m the one in the wrong for disagreeing with it.

So please just accept we won’t ever agree on this and move on.

To be honest, mumsnet seems like they might actually have some sense about them.

I now fully understand why piston heads gets a bad rep in other online communities

Enjoy your time at Mumsnet. Give them my regards

[anonymous-user]

Have you thought of joining the Police, serious question?

[MrTrilby]

yonex said:

I speed on occasion, always have done. But I’m very careful in urban areas and drive to the conditions around me.

OK, so you drive to conditions in urban areas - the areas that speed watch operates - and you are very careful. So if you claim to be careful in urban areas, why are you so ready to imply that everyone else here is not careful in urban areas by calling them hypocrites? What makes you special? If you think driving carefully in urban areas is a good idea, why are you so against efforts to encourage other people to drive carefully?

[bigdog3]

KM said:

A sad but safe generation.

Risk averse but not risk aware. Unwilling to push the boundaries. Be careful, in all this cosseting life will pass you by

[anonymous-user]

MrTrilby said:

OK, so you drive to conditions in urban areas - the areas that speed watch operates - and you are very careful. So if you claim to be careful in urban areas, why are you so ready to imply that everyone else here is not careful in urban areas by calling them hypocrites? What makes you special? If you think driving carefully in urban areas is a good idea, why are you so against efforts to encourage other people to drive carefully?

No, that’s not what I said Columbo.

What I said is simplistic comments like ‘I never speed’ are folly, it’s impossible. Also, ‘but it’s breaking the law’, again, ridiculous as everyone does it.

i don’t speed in urban areas, it’s pointless. It goes without saying near schools etc are beyond question places which anyone sane would be careful.

Outside these areas, like most who enjoy cars there are places which you able to enjoy yourself safely.

It appears PH is full of these anti speeding loonies who really cannot understand why the war on speeding is farcical. As for being a hypocrite, that’ll be anyone who calls out anyone else for breaking the law, whilst doing the very same themselves.

[Countdown]

yonex said:

No, that’s not what I said Columbo.

What I said is simplistic comments like ‘I never speed’ are folly, it’s impossible. Also, ‘but it’s breaking the law’, again, ridiculous as everyone does it.

i don’t speed in urban areas, it’s pointless. It goes without saying near schools etc are beyond question places which anyone sane would be careful.

Outside these areas, like most who enjoy cars there are places which you able to enjoy yourself safely.

It appears PH is full of these anti speeding loonies who really cannot understand why the war on speeding is farcical. As for being a hypocrite, that’ll be anyone who calls out anyone else for breaking the law, whilst doing the very same themselves.

AIUI these CSW people are based in urban areas which suggests that there are plenty of people out there who think it's OK to speed in urban areas. There are also plenty of knobs out there who will happily speed past schools. If CSW ends up in them slowing down, isn't that a good thing?

[MrTrilby]

yonex said:

No, that’s not what I said Columbo.

What I said is simplistic comments like ‘I never speed’ are folly, it’s impossible. Also, ‘but it’s breaking the law’, again, ridiculous as everyone does it.

i don’t speed in urban areas, it’s pointless. It goes without saying near schools etc are beyond question places which anyone sane would be careful.

No, you didn't say that. You're constructing a straw man argument. You called people like myself a hypocrite solely because we advocated in favour of speed watch. No mention of "I never speed" or "but it's breaking the law" below, yet you're happy to resort to "hypocrite" :

yonex said:

MrTrilby said:

Highest speed recorded on our road is over 70mph. During the daytime. Speed limit is 40mph. No pavement. Houses along the road - rural village. Primary school at the end of the road. Pretty sure no one needed a speed gun to decide they didn’t fancy that coming towards them whilst walking down the road.

Mock Speedwatch all you like, but it’s low cost, isn’t a revenue raising exercise (unless people are replying to the warning letters they get sent by CSW and enclosing cash for some reason), and it helps make people think about their driving.

It’s pointless. Put a camera van out there if you want results, or campaign for a camera.

Or just continue sitting outside tutting. You’re all hypocrites anyway

yonex said:

It appears PH is full of these anti speeding loonies who really cannot understand why the war on speeding is farcical. As for being a hypocrite, that’ll be anyone who calls out anyone else for breaking the law, whilst doing the very same themselves.

And sadly the country is full of people like you who are happy to carp, snipe, and be insulting about things they clearly don't really understand, yet can aren't prepared to put the same effort into being constructive or proposing better solutions.

So far the best you've come up with is a suggestion that we ask for speed cameras to be put in place, which seems quite at odds with you now claiming that "the war on speeding is farcical". Whilst I'm sure that the suggestion of "just ask for a speed camera" will come as quite a shock to people running speed watch schemes - there's no way that idea might have already occurred to them - it might also come as a shock to you that those "revenue cameras" aren't quite as cheap or easy to install as you imply. Speedwatch is a relatively cheap solution that can and has been implemented on a large scale - feel free to come up with a better idea rather than just snipe.

[RSTurboPaul]

KM said:

Not exactly signed up to become a ‘troll’

I don’t agree with vigilante speed cameras however because police should be left to their job.

I just know of a few people who died speeding and killed others whilst speeding and I now understand why there are so many accidents because of the attitudes towards it. Whether you’re young or not is irrelevant, the amount you put the pedal down is. The reason younger people are more ‘boring’ is because we’ve actually been educated on speed and dangerous driving from a younger age. All be it there is still a few (a lot) of idiots. But having a forum based on agree or leave is a bit harsh really.

Personally I don’t ever want to crash or kill an innocent person which might have been prevented if I’d stuck to the limit.

My views are also the same on drink driving. However that is something I never do and by never I mean I won’t drive even after half a pint for at least 6 hours, more often 12 (even if it sounds ridiculous) just for my peace of mind.

Maybe it’s just the way new drivers have been taught but in ‘x’ amount of years when the era of speeding and a couple of beers is ok are off the road, the world will be a safer place

Thanks

The part in bold sounds suspiciously like brainwashing of the young

Speeding is not a binary activity - what you appear to be saying is that if you always stick to the limit, everywhere, at all times, even when you are the only car on the motorway at 3am on a bone-dry July morning or when you are travelling through a 20mph limit that used to be a 40mph limit, you will be safe and you won't kill someone.

Like most things, speed is actually 'shades of grey', which is what others have already mentioned.

Zealous application of zero-tolerance to speed limits, regardless of whether or not they are incorrectly set, does not create safety - it creates drivers who pay no attention to what is happening on the road because they are not speeding therefore they think they are safe, which means increased accident risk and realisation.


Rather than relying on brainwashing anecdotal evidence and emotive campaigning about how 'speed kills!!!', look at the officially recorded accident causation factors:
https://www.gov.uk/government/statistical-data-set...

You want table RAS50002, 'Contributory factors allocated to vehicles or pedestrians in reported accident':
https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/governmen...

2017

Contributory factor reported for vehicle or pedestrian - number / percent

Driver/Rider failed to look properly - 37897 / 41%
Driver/Rider failed to judge other person’s path or speed - 20292 / 22%
Driver/Rider careless, reckless or in a hurry - 13853 / 15%
Poor turn or manoeuvre - 12771 / 14%
Loss of control - 10830 / 12%
Pedestrian failed to look properly - 7929 / 9%
Slippery road (due to weather) - 8502 / 8%
Travelling too fast for conditions - 6090 / 7%
Sudden braking - 57/ 6%
Exceeding speed limit - 4880 / 5%

Total number of accidents - 93125 / 100%

As is evident, going faster than the number on a pole is the cause of only 5% of accidents, whereas inattention (i.e. failure to look, failure to judge, careless, which may well be brought about through boredom due to being forced to drive too slowly for the road and environment and conditions) is much, much higher.

Do you think that making people drive so slowly that they feel nothing is happening (or is going to happen) will make them pay more attention or less attention?


If you never drive fast than the number on the pole because you think the people setting the limits have no political motives and you believe it is so dangerous (despite the evidence to the contrary), what are you doing about the other 95% of causation factors that you may well be guilty of doing?

Have you undertaken advanced driver training with the IAM / RoSPA / HPC / Reg Local / A.N.Other recommended trainer/group?

Edited by RSTurboPaul on Thursday 15th August 11:45

[anonymous-user]

Countdown said:

AIUI these CSW people are based in urban areas which suggests that there are plenty of people out there who think it's OK to speed in urban areas. There are also plenty of knobs out there who will happily speed past schools. If CSW ends up in them slowing down, isn't that a good thing?

Untrained, grumpy old people taking matters into their own hands. Not really, no.