Legal Advice regarding Car Sale
Discussion
The Spruce Goose said:
The Rotrex Kid said:
IIRC classifieds are just adverts, the sales aren’t processed by eBay so they aren’t covered like auctions. Or something like that.
misconception based on american ebay.Ebay classified advert are adverts, ebay motor adverts with offers are still offers to buy.
If it was ebay classified they were allowed to conclude the sale outside of ebay, but the buyer would have been bound by the terms of ebay's non binding bid policy on motors, which should have meant there was no legal contract.
Maybe the judge would have decided it only applied to offers made directly through ebay and not ones made via whatsapp, maybe they would have decided since the listing came to and end it no longer applied, but to have not brought it up as part of the defence at all seems bizarre.
If it was an ebay auction they had no business completing the sale outside of ebay, this was a violation of ebay terms both parties had agreed to and could potentially have been a reason to void the contract.
Maybe it was better to not bring it up since they through they already had a strong case and this would have shown some bad faith on thier part.
Maybe the judge would have decided it only applied to offers made directly through ebay and not ones made via whatsapp, maybe they would have decided since the listing came to and end it no longer applied, but to have not brought it up as part of the defence at all seems bizarre.
If it was an ebay auction they had no business completing the sale outside of ebay, this was a violation of ebay terms both parties had agreed to and could potentially have been a reason to void the contract.
Maybe it was better to not bring it up since they through they already had a strong case and this would have shown some bad faith on thier part.
cs174 said:
Muzzer79 said:
Do you still believe that you were in the right?
i.e agreeing a price with Buyer A and then selling for more to Buyer B?
In what way do you think that Buyer A was trying it on?
Yes because I don't believe I entered into a contract but the court has already determined that I am in the wrong. Will I make the same mistake again? No.i.e agreeing a price with Buyer A and then selling for more to Buyer B?
In what way do you think that Buyer A was trying it on?
I think Buyer A was trying it on by:
- asking me to give him £2k which was £1k more than I'd sold the car for.
- claiming we'd entered into a contract when we'd only agreed the price (I respect that the court has determined otherwise)
- claiming he was unable to attend my local court so the hearing is moved to his local court where his daughter is a solicitor
This is all pretty much irrelevant now though, the case is over.
Edited by cs174 on Thursday 10th June 19:29
You could have advanced the exact same argument that you couldn't attend in his local court.
In which case I would have expected the court officer allocating the case to decide in the defendant's (your) favour.
If you had legal representation why wasn't the claimant's application for it to be heard in his backyard challenged?
County Court claims are a lottery. You might have got a judge who came to a different decision.
What on earth possessed you to rack up legal costs 50% higher than the amount the claimant was seeking?
A barrister involved in a 2k County Court small claims track case?! Sheesh: your solicitor took you for a ride imo.
e-honda said:
but the buyer would have been bound by the terms of ebay's non binding bid policy on motors, which should have meant there was no legal contract.
you can't bid on a classified advert, so ebay's terms are irrelevant. If the buyers makes an offer then that is covered in law, whatever ebay may advise or not.The Spruce Goose said:
you can't bid on a classified advert, so ebay's terms are irrelevant. If the buyers makes an offer then that is covered in law, whatever ebay may advise or not.
eBay's non binding bid policy clearly mentions eBay motors classifieds ads.https://www.ebay.co.uk/help/policies/rules-policie...
As you have said you cannot 'bid' on classifieds but
you can make an offer, which in this context is the same thing, it is covered in section 7 of the user agreement where it states.
for motor vehicles and real estate (property) listed in the Classified Ad format, a bid or offer is not binding, but expresses a buyer's serious interest in the item
e-honda said:
eBay's non binding bid policy clearly mentions eBay motors classifieds ads.
https://www.ebay.co.uk/help/policies/rules-policie...
As you have said you cannot 'bid' on classifieds but
you can make an offer, which in this context is the same thing, it is covered in section 7 of the user agreement where it states.
for motor vehicles and real estate (property) listed in the Classified Ad format, a bid or offer is not binding, but expresses a buyer's serious interest in the item
Again they can write what they want, which I actually think is copied from American site, UK law us still UK law and will always trump any implied eBay's terms and conditions.https://www.ebay.co.uk/help/policies/rules-policie...
As you have said you cannot 'bid' on classifieds but
you can make an offer, which in this context is the same thing, it is covered in section 7 of the user agreement where it states.
for motor vehicles and real estate (property) listed in the Classified Ad format, a bid or offer is not binding, but expresses a buyer's serious interest in the item
An example is auction law allows you to cancel any bid up to the very end of an auction. Now try that on an eBay auction with 5 minutes to go...
The Spruce Goose said:
Again they can write what they want, which I actually think is copied from American site, UK law us still UK law and will always trump any implied eBay's terms and conditions.
An example is auction law allows you to cancel any bid up to the very end of an auction. Now try that on an eBay auction with 5 minutes to go...
It is from eBay UKAn example is auction law allows you to cancel any bid up to the very end of an auction. Now try that on an eBay auction with 5 minutes to go...
https://www.ebay.co.uk/help/policies/member-behavi...
You keep going on about UK law but there is absolutely nothing in UK law that means agreeing a price automatically forms a contract, just that it can do, there are an a lot of circumstances where it doesn't.
If 2 people agree that when they agree a price it will not form a contract until the sale is complete, then it is a really bizarre set of circumstances form them to agree a price and it does form a contract before the sale is complete.
Edit for some reason the link didn't work
https://www.ebay.co.uk/help/policies/member-behavi...
Edited by e-honda on Friday 11th June 06:41
e-honda said:
It is from eBay UK
https://www.ebay.co.uk/help/policies/member-behavi...
You keep going on about UK law but there is absolutely nothing in UK law that means agreeing a price automatically forms a contract, just that it can do, there are an a lot of circumstances where it doesn't.
If 2 people agree that when they agree a price it will not form a contract until the sale is complete, then it is a really bizarre set of circumstances form them to agree a price and it does form a contract before the sale is complete.
Edit for some reason the link didn't work
https://www.ebay.co.uk/help/policies/member-behavi...
yet we are tallijg about the OP story, andhttps://www.ebay.co.uk/help/policies/member-behavi...
You keep going on about UK law but there is absolutely nothing in UK law that means agreeing a price automatically forms a contract, just that it can do, there are an a lot of circumstances where it doesn't.
If 2 people agree that when they agree a price it will not form a contract until the sale is complete, then it is a really bizarre set of circumstances form them to agree a price and it does form a contract before the sale is complete.
Edit for some reason the link didn't work
https://www.ebay.co.uk/help/policies/member-behavi...
Edited by e-honda on Friday 11th June 06:41
''After the Ebay listing ended, I received an offer via WhatsApp from Buyer A that I agreed to.''
Your point would be if it was a classified advert the offer and acceptance wouldn't be binding, which is clearly b
ks, anyways..The Spruce Goose said:
yet we are tallijg about the OP story, and
''After the Ebay listing ended, I received an offer via WhatsApp from Buyer A that I agreed to.''
Your point would be if it was a classified advert the offer and acceptance wouldn't be binding, which is clearly bks, anyways..
Why's is clearly b''After the Ebay listing ended, I received an offer via WhatsApp from Buyer A that I agreed to.''
Your point would be if it was a classified advert the offer and acceptance wouldn't be binding, which is clearly b
ks, anyways..ks. That's not a rational argumentLike I said the judge may have have decided these terms no longer apply, but I see no reason it is automatic.
The terms do not state they no longer apply when the listing ends, so why do you believe so strongly that they do not.
Are you saying that once that listing ended it was like the eBay advert never happened and this was just 2 people making a sale with no other context?
This sale was entirely based on the eBay advert, a copy of it was in the claimants file so clearly the claimant felt it was still part of the sale?
If the advert had had section 7 of the user agreement printed on the advert it then there is almost no way the judge would have ruled it this way. The judge never got to see it because it was on another page and for some reason the defendant decided not point it out.
Red Devil said:
cs174 said:
Muzzer79 said:
Do you still believe that you were in the right?
i.e agreeing a price with Buyer A and then selling for more to Buyer B?
In what way do you think that Buyer A was trying it on?
Yes because I don't believe I entered into a contract but the court has already determined that I am in the wrong. Will I make the same mistake again? No.i.e agreeing a price with Buyer A and then selling for more to Buyer B?
In what way do you think that Buyer A was trying it on?
I think Buyer A was trying it on by:
- asking me to give him £2k which was £1k more than I'd sold the car for.
- claiming we'd entered into a contract when we'd only agreed the price (I respect that the court has determined otherwise)
- claiming he was unable to attend my local court so the hearing is moved to his local court where his daughter is a solicitor
This is all pretty much irrelevant now though, the case is over.
Edited by cs174 on Thursday 10th June 19:29
You could have advanced the exact same argument that you couldn't attend in his local court.
In which case I would have expected the court officer allocating the case to decide in the defendant's (your) favour.
If you had legal representation why wasn't the claimant's application for it to be heard in his backyard challenged?
County Court claims are a lottery. You might have got a judge who came to a different decision.
What on earth possessed you to rack up legal costs 50% higher than the amount the claimant was seeking?
A barrister involved in a 2k County Court small claims track case?! Sheesh: your solicitor took you for a ride imo.
cs174 said:
The legal fees were around £1.3k at the time it was transferred to the Claimants local court, then my solicitor sent a large bill out of the blue. I totally agree my solicitor has taken me for a ride.
they agree to code of practices governed by the solicitors regulation authority, if you think they have taken you for a ride lodge a complaint. cs174 said:
The legal fees were around £1.3k at the time it was transferred to the Claimants local court, then my solicitor sent a large bill out of the blue. I totally agree my solicitor has taken me for a ride.
You may be able to reject as fees should be outlined in writing during the initial engagement.IANAL.
The Spruce Goose said:
they agree to code of practices governed by the solicitors regulation authority, if you think they have taken you for a ride lodge a complaint.
With the company first via their dispute process, then the SRA. The SRA will want to see that you have exhausted the internal process first If you had legal representation why wasn't the claimant's application for it to be heard in his backyard challenged?
County Court claims are a lottery. You might have got a judge who came to a different decision.
I sued a company from the West Country in Hertford CC and at a pre hearing they applied to have it moved down there.
The Judge, looked over his glasses and said "no" and that that was that
I'm no expert, but I think you took yourself for a ride, OP. Looks like some lawyers posted on the thread saying you were going to lose. You lost, and looks to me no use complaining about it, or trying to argue things here that you didn't try in court or which you tried but didn't work.
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