Other driver pranged barrier while overtaking.
Discussion
Ooh - can I join the wild speculation?
The 4x4 driver has seen the bus pull in and the slight hesitation of the car behind it and gambled on moving up a place on the road at the car's expense. The car has then edged slightly to the right to try and see if it's safe to overtake the bus, which has spooked the 4x4 driver into the barrier.
4x4 drivers fault IMO - took an aggressive 'double overtake' gamble but should have anticipated that the car was also looking to move past the bus.
The 4x4 driver has seen the bus pull in and the slight hesitation of the car behind it and gambled on moving up a place on the road at the car's expense. The car has then edged slightly to the right to try and see if it's safe to overtake the bus, which has spooked the 4x4 driver into the barrier.
4x4 drivers fault IMO - took an aggressive 'double overtake' gamble but should have anticipated that the car was also looking to move past the bus.
Lets Play....SPOT the BUS STOP shall we.
https://www.google.com/maps/@57.4093109,-4.3383227...
If like so many here you have X-RAY specs on please don't cheat.
Anyone saying "I would have seen the bus stop and not overtaken", is quite frankly talking a load of b
ks.
https://www.google.com/maps/@57.4093109,-4.3383227...
If like so many here you have X-RAY specs on please don't cheat.
Anyone saying "I would have seen the bus stop and not overtaken", is quite frankly talking a load of b
ks.Edited by Dont like rolls on Friday 14th February 15:14
Dont like rolls said:
Lets Play....SPOT the BUS STOP shall we.
https://www.google.com/maps/@57.4093109,-4.3383227...
If like so many here you have X-RAY specs on please don't cheat.
Anyone saying "I would have seen the bus stop and not overtaken", is quite frankly talking a load of bks.
You'd have seen the stationary bus and the car sat behind it though, right?https://www.google.com/maps/@57.4093109,-4.3383227...
If like so many here you have X-RAY specs on please don't cheat.
Anyone saying "I would have seen the bus stop and not overtaken", is quite frankly talking a load of b
ks.Edited by Dont like rolls on Friday 14th February 15:14
smn159 said:
Dont like rolls said:
Lets Play....SPOT the BUS STOP shall we.
https://www.google.com/maps/@57.4093109,-4.3383227...
If like so many here you have X-RAY specs on please don't cheat.
Anyone saying "I would have seen the bus stop and not overtaken", is quite frankly talking a load of bks.
You'd have seen the stationary bus and the car sat behind it though, right?https://www.google.com/maps/@57.4093109,-4.3383227...
If like so many here you have X-RAY specs on please don't cheat.
Anyone saying "I would have seen the bus stop and not overtaken", is quite frankly talking a load of b
ks.Edited by Dont like rolls on Friday 14th February 15:14
Dont like rolls said:
Lets Play....SPOT the BUS STOP shall we.
https://www.google.com/maps/@57.4093109,-4.3383227...
If like so many here you have X-RAY specs on please don't cheat.
Anyone saying "I would have seen the bus stop and not overtaken", is quite frankly talking a load of bks.
The massive bus pulling into it would be a large clue for the more sentient among us... https://www.google.com/maps/@57.4093109,-4.3383227...
If like so many here you have X-RAY specs on please don't cheat.
Anyone saying "I would have seen the bus stop and not overtaken", is quite frankly talking a load of b
ks.Edited by Dont like rolls on Friday 14th February 15:14
Graveworm said:
Not when pulling out to overtake the queue of cars. The 4x4 was, from the OPs post almost certainly not the vehicle behind her so it was at least a three vehicle overtake lead vehicle being the bus. That didn't happen in the 2 seconds before the car pulled out around the bus. If it had sat behind it all would still be right with the world.
QQ:Just how thick/entitled do you have to be to arrive at a queue of slowing vehicles/stationary vehicles and decide to mash your foot into the carpet instead of working out what's going on before taking action?
Pulling into his path isn't a bright thing to do but justifying the pickup's actions is like trying to defend Jimmy Savile. Not aimed at you Graveworm, but there's a lot of folks that think gunning it for the overtake is a rational response to a stationary or slowing line of vehicles.
mattyprice4004 said:
The massive bus pulling into it would be a large clue for the more sentient among us...
4x4 was already committed (he had to be if he was that close to her), it is why he binned it when she pulled out.What I ---suspect--- is she was tootling along close behind the bus showing zero interest in overtaking and leaving no over-take space between....basically the classic double road block......
Dont like rolls said:
What I ---suspect--- is she was tootling along close behind the bus showing zero interest in overtaking and leaving no over-take space between....basically the classic double road block......
...and the 4x4 saw the bus slowing down, took the chance, forgetting that if the lead car had or chose to pull out a little (as often happens) he'd have nowhere to go and end up in the barrier. And that there was possibly no need to overtake at all as he didn't know what speed the traffic ahead would get to once the bus had pulled in. Graveworm said:
oyster said:
I would never overtake in this situation.
I would see the bus approaching a bus stop and hold off for a likely better opportunity after the bus stop.
But if you were behind a bus which pulled in partially blocking a road would you pull out into the path of an overtaking motorist, who wasn't as observant or as good at anticipating things as you? I would see the bus approaching a bus stop and hold off for a likely better opportunity after the bus stop.
It's happened many times as well (not someone passing at that moment, but an obstacle, e.g. corner of a bus, sticking into my path) and I am always very aware of it.
Sticks. said:
Dont like rolls said:
What I ---suspect--- is she was tootling along close behind the bus showing zero interest in overtaking and leaving no over-take space between....basically the classic double road block......
...and the 4x4 saw the bus slowing down, took the chance, forgetting that if the lead car had or chose to pull out a little (as often happens) he'd have nowhere to go and end up in the barrier. And that there was possibly no need to overtake at all as he didn't know what speed the traffic ahead would get to once the bus had pulled in. Pegscratch said:
QQ:
Just how thick/entitled do you have to be to arrive at a queue of slowing vehicles/stationary vehicles and decide to mash your foot into the carpet instead of working out what's going on before taking action?
Pulling into his path isn't a bright thing to do but justifying the pickup's actions is like trying to defend Jimmy Savile. Not aimed at you Graveworm, but there's a lot of folks that think gunning it for the overtake is a rational response to a stationary or slowing line of vehicles.
Ohh you little devil, you made that bit up didn't you ? Just how thick/entitled do you have to be to arrive at a queue of slowing vehicles/stationary vehicles and decide to mash your foot into the carpet instead of working out what's going on before taking action?
Pulling into his path isn't a bright thing to do but justifying the pickup's actions is like trying to defend Jimmy Savile. Not aimed at you Graveworm, but there's a lot of folks that think gunning it for the overtake is a rational response to a stationary or slowing line of vehicles.
Dont like rolls said:
Ohh you little devil, you made that bit up didn't you ?
How? From the OP:The bus in front of my wife pulled into the bus stop but was still sticking out a wee bit.
So either the bus went into a really long bus stop that meant it could slow down from a reasonable speed, or into a really short stop and did an emergency stop, whilst the leading car was doing a respectable enough speed that overtaking wasn't the single most moronic decision the pickup could make.
It's simple physics. The pickup gunned it to pass a slowing or stationary line of vehicles. The OP openly says "pulled into the bus stop"; not "there was a bus in the bus stop" as would be required by a lot of the speculation.
Pegscratch said:
How? From the OP:
The bus in front of my wife pulled into the bus stop but was still sticking out a wee bit.
So either the bus went into a really long bus stop that meant it could slow down from a reasonable speed, or into a really short stop and did an emergency stop, whilst the leading car was doing a respectable enough speed that overtaking wasn't the single most moronic decision the pickup could make.
It's simple physics. The pickup gunned it to pass a slowing or stationary line of vehicles. The OP openly says "pulled into the bus stop"; not "there was a bus in the bus stop" as would be required by a lot of the speculation.
Long bus stop.The bus in front of my wife pulled into the bus stop but was still sticking out a wee bit.
So either the bus went into a really long bus stop that meant it could slow down from a reasonable speed, or into a really short stop and did an emergency stop, whilst the leading car was doing a respectable enough speed that overtaking wasn't the single most moronic decision the pickup could make.
It's simple physics. The pickup gunned it to pass a slowing or stationary line of vehicles. The OP openly says "pulled into the bus stop"; not "there was a bus in the bus stop" as would be required by a lot of the speculation.
https://www.google.com/maps/@57.4099648,-4.3377491...
The RAC seem to think advice needs to be given
https://www.rac.co.uk/drive/advice/how-to/overtaki...
Points that clash based on the bus speed/already stopped/ etc......4x4 speed/vision/should anticipate a bus stop etc
Can I overtake more than one car?
You must only do this if it is safe to do so and under certain conditions:
--
The opposite side of the road is sufficiently clear to safely overtake
There‘s a suitable gap in front of the vehicles you plan to overtake
You have a clear view ahead of you
A road user behind isn’t attempting to overtake you
When should I not overtake?
--
When you don’t have clear visibility of the road: such as on a bend, a hump bridge, or on the brow of a hill.
Approaching a potential hazard: such as roadworks, a junction, school crossing, level crossing or a narrowing of the road ahead.
Edited by Dont like rolls on Friday 14th February 16:45
Dont like rolls said:
Pegscratch said:
How? From the OP:
The bus in front of my wife pulled into the bus stop but was still sticking out a wee bit.
So either the bus went into a really long bus stop that meant it could slow down from a reasonable speed, or into a really short stop and did an emergency stop, whilst the leading car was doing a respectable enough speed that overtaking wasn't the single most moronic decision the pickup could make.
It's simple physics. The pickup gunned it to pass a slowing or stationary line of vehicles. The OP openly says "pulled into the bus stop"; not "there was a bus in the bus stop" as would be required by a lot of the speculation.
Long bus stop.The bus in front of my wife pulled into the bus stop but was still sticking out a wee bit.
So either the bus went into a really long bus stop that meant it could slow down from a reasonable speed, or into a really short stop and did an emergency stop, whilst the leading car was doing a respectable enough speed that overtaking wasn't the single most moronic decision the pickup could make.
It's simple physics. The pickup gunned it to pass a slowing or stationary line of vehicles. The OP openly says "pulled into the bus stop"; not "there was a bus in the bus stop" as would be required by a lot of the speculation.
https://www.google.com/maps/@57.4099648,-4.3377491...
CharlieH89 said:
So the 4x4 was doing a legal overtake.
I guess it's upto the insurance company to decide whether the actions of the OPs wife making a movement into the lane that the 4x4 is in and making the 4x4 avoid the collision means that the liability is on her.
If the overtake hadn't already begun then the 4x4 just would have slowed down as there is nowhere to go.
If the overtake had begun, which it seems it has, then the OPs wife has gone into the path of the 4x4 and made it hit an object.
Is that an offence?
Why do you ask? This thread is about liability in a potential insurance claim.I guess it's upto the insurance company to decide whether the actions of the OPs wife making a movement into the lane that the 4x4 is in and making the 4x4 avoid the collision means that the liability is on her.
If the overtake hadn't already begun then the 4x4 just would have slowed down as there is nowhere to go.
If the overtake had begun, which it seems it has, then the OPs wife has gone into the path of the 4x4 and made it hit an object.
Is that an offence?
That is a civil matter. Offences are criminal. The OP has made no mention of his O/H or the pickup driver facing a RTA charge.
PorkInsider said:
It'll be knock for knock.
ISWYDT. Another poster mentioned KfK earlier without the emoticon.
There is no such thing any more (and hasn't been for many years).
Split liability is the name of the game.
A 50/50 split is not the same thing as KfK despite what many folk still seem to think.
Dont like rolls said:
Lets Play....SPOT the BUS STOP shall we.
https://www.google.com/maps/@57.4093109,-4.3383227...
If like so many here you have X-RAY specs on please don't cheat.
Anyone saying "I would have seen the bus stop and not overtaken", is quite frankly talking a load of bks.
You conveniently gloss over the fact that the vehicle making the bus stop invisible in Street View is a motorhome/campervan.https://www.google.com/maps/@57.4093109,-4.3383227...
If like so many here you have X-RAY specs on please don't cheat.
Anyone saying "I would have seen the bus stop and not overtaken", is quite frankly talking a load of b
ks.I don't recall the OP mentioning that there was one ahead of his O/H.
She was following a bus. Oddly enough these stop from time time to allow passengers to board/alight.
Something which any competent driver should expect.
Although I live at the other end of the UK, I've driven the A82 between Drumnadrochit and Inverness a fair few times when on holiday.
You need to be very circumspect about where you choose to make overtakes.
This is the view further back along that road - https://goo.gl/maps/6UgD4BiA7zZddJqE7
Even if you've never driven it before, the village nameplate is big enough hint that there might well be a bus stop upcoming.
It's not rocket science.
Red Devil said:
You conveniently gloss over the fact that the vehicle making the bus stop invisible in Street View is a motorhome/campervan.
I don't recall the OP mentioning that there was one ahead of his O/H.
She was following a bus. Oddly enough these stop from time time to allow passengers to board/alight.
Something which any competent driver should expect.
Although I live at the other end of the UK, I've driven the A82 between Drumnadrochit and Inverness a fair few times when on holiday.
You need to be very circumspect about where you choose to make overtakes.
This is the view further back along that road - https://goo.gl/maps/6UgD4BiA7zZddJqE7
Even if you've never driven it before, the village nameplate is big enough hint that there might well be a bus stop upcoming.
It's not rocket science.
A bus is a motor home with the beds removed and seat put in ....of course it is the same size if not a little bigger. (I really don't get your point here)I don't recall the OP mentioning that there was one ahead of his O/H.
She was following a bus. Oddly enough these stop from time time to allow passengers to board/alight.
Something which any competent driver should expect.
Although I live at the other end of the UK, I've driven the A82 between Drumnadrochit and Inverness a fair few times when on holiday.
You need to be very circumspect about where you choose to make overtakes.
This is the view further back along that road - https://goo.gl/maps/6UgD4BiA7zZddJqE7
Even if you've never driven it before, the village nameplate is big enough hint that there might well be a bus stop upcoming.
It's not rocket science.
I would not expect a Bus Stop on a raised (10-15 foot drop ?) piece of road with a crash/roll off barrier next to the stop.
The stop is 15 yards short of being out of the village.
Dont like rolls said:
A bus is a motor home with the beds removed and seat put in ....of course it is the same size if not a little bigger. (I really don't get your point here)
I would not expect a Bus Stop on a raised (10-15 foot drop ?) piece of road with a crash/roll off barrier next to the stop.
The stop is 15 yards short of being out of the village.
You are the pick up driver AICMFP.I would not expect a Bus Stop on a raised (10-15 foot drop ?) piece of road with a crash/roll off barrier next to the stop.
The stop is 15 yards short of being out of the village.
Buses don't screech to a halt for a stop. It'd have been slowing (and probably indicating) for a while. Overtaking there was the act of a Muppet.
Dont like rolls said:
A bus is a motor home with the beds removed and seat put in ....of course it is the same size if not a little bigger. (I really don't get your point here)
Are you being deliberately obtuse or it is simply that your comprehension skills could do with further development? In both cases the bus stop is obscured.However, if I'm following a bus through a residential area (particularly one big enough to have its own roadside name plate) I anticipate a very real likelihood of it stopping somewhere in the vicinity.
Not so with a motor home which is not engaged in providing a service to the public.
Dont like rolls said:
I would not expect a Bus Stop on a raised (10-15 foot drop ?) piece of road with a crash/roll off barrier next to the stop.
The stop is 15 yards short of being out of the village.
So what? If I'm a regular user of the road I will (or certainly should) already know where the stop is.The stop is 15 yards short of being out of the village.
Otoh, if I'm not, then its location or the adjoining street furniture is not the salient point in my driving plan.
My primary focus will be on the possibility of it occurring anywhere within the confines of the village.
The Monty Python approach can easily lead you into a trap.
Regardless of the fact it wasn't too bright to attempt the overtake, the OP's wife has caused the accident, it wasn't happening until she pulled across the road without checking properly (definition of properly here is that she didn't see something that was approaching).
She may get away with it or may not, I suspect if it was on film in great detail from many angles she'd be wholly culpable. Interesting to see how it turns out.
She may get away with it or may not, I suspect if it was on film in great detail from many angles she'd be wholly culpable. Interesting to see how it turns out.
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