Leon Briggs Death in custody misconduct hearing collapses.
Discussion
Cads said:
The 6 officers will no doubt have strong grounds for compensation, and rightly so.
Unlike Mr Ball, I have no idea, beyond what was reported in the media, about the ins and outs of this particular case. However, a friend and colleague of mine was suspended on full pay for 5 years on a different case. His career was shot and he was the target of intimidation and threats. He was forced to move out of country due to the lack of support from his own force. When the trial collapsed, just as promised by the judge in a pre-trial hearing, on the first day, he was angry and wanted to hit back. He had evidence of lies from senior officers (one of whom was promoted to high office almost immediately the case they were in charge of collapsed) and failure to check evidence. There was also evidence of the CPS going outside the guidelines (not only continuing with a prosecution where there was no chance of it not being binned by the trial judge). His evidence, unlike that against him (but then his file was prepared by someone who had some idea of the requirements), was strong. But no compensation. They right their own rules.
Derek Smith said:
..However, a friend and colleague of mine was suspended on full pay for 5 years on a different case. His career was shot and he was the target of intimidation and threats. He was forced to move out of country due to the lack of support from his own force...
Why did the investigation take so long? Who was responsible? Intimidation and threats from whom?Justice and the tax payer were not well served by the delay.
Delay seems to be a means of managing hot potatoes.
Will the delay give the IOPC time to find a reason not to pass on the killing of Sean Fitzgerald to the CPS and will it, in turn, trot out its well-worn “not sufficient evidence for a realistic prosecution” bulls
t to hand the killer an immunity card.I wonder if the full details of that killing will be made public.
Like how far away the unarmed Sean was from the, presumably well-trained, armed officer when he chose to kill him. Was it far enough away to give the officer a commendation for long distance marksmanship?
But the killer is a member of an organization that has a history of promoting officers who fail the humanity test and of shielding those who are complicit in trampling over peoples human rights, especially women’s rights. Note the Undercover Policing Inquiry which will probably issue its findings next century. All it appears to have done since 2013 is grant anonymity to police officers and give employment to a number of people at the tax payer’s expense.
Let us not forget the tactics that led to the scandalous abandoning of the disciplinary hearings against those officers on duty at the time of the death of Leon Briggs who collapsed whilst in police custody, where a 7 year delay denied any justice to him and his family.
Police immunity in action yet again.
La Liga said:
I wonder if the virus has led to a shortage of David’s meds.
I wonder if Davud would expect a fair trial if he ever found himself in a situation where his actions were under minute scrutiny? If so it's a shame he cant extend the same courtesy to others but then hed have nothing else to come on here to cry about. Do you think he also believes the conspiracy theories about 5G causing peoples immune systems to shut down allowing for a man made virus to be released from Asia to kill 1,000s of people simply on the basis that there are too many people and it is a worldwide conspiracy between all countries
davidball said:
Derek Smith said:
..However, a friend and colleague of mine was suspended on full pay for 5 years on a different case. His career was shot and he was the target of intimidation and threats. He was forced to move out of country due to the lack of support from his own force...
Why did the investigation take so long? Who was responsible? Intimidation and threats from whom?Justice and the tax payer were not well served by the delay.
An investigation, headed by an ambitious senior officer, was started and it was decided to prosecute. The delay was that the CPS kept pointing out there was insufficient evidence to proceed. The head of the enquiry then instigated an expensive search for evidence which came up with nothing, as it wasn't there. There were lies, there was intimidation. After charge, it went to pre-trial, and the judge pointed out that there was insufficient evidence, or rather told the CPS that they should consider whether or not to prosecute. The two briefs - prosecution and defence - were then advised, in a move I've not seen before, that they case would not get beyond the first day at court. He told the defence brief to tell the officers that the trial would not go ahead without further evidence.
It went to trial a while later, after delays in the hope of evidence, and the officers did not even enter the court. The CPS barrister was given a dressing down. When the officers, who were rather angry, tried to sue, they were told that, for technical reasons, it was impossible to proceed. The professional group they belonged to went for further advice, and even for a judicial ruling, but were thwarted. Some suggest that the amount they would get was part of the reason, but I don't know about that.
What I do know, because I saw the disclosure, was that any non-police defendant would have been released from bail within weeks. However, police immunity from being treated like people, I think that's what you mean, meant they were treated as special.
As for the threats, nasty people have nasty friends. They took it upon themselves to spread rumours of a police cover-up and others, ignorant of the details, took this up - not that they cared whether there was any truth in it or not - and there were cars and other vehicles, typical of the group involved, driving past his house day and night, stopping, taking photographs, and then driving on. There were scrawled messages, crude but explicit and other things were thrown into the front garden.
You see, the main problem was that there were people spreading the myth that the police had immunity from prosecution. I think they should be sued. After all, it takes a particularly evil person to spread rumours of misconduct without any evidence.
It's a nasty world out there for police officers. On the one side you have villains who have no concern for those they hurt, and ambitious senior officers (by no means all of them, not even a majority, but too many) who have no concern for who they hurt in their scramble for promotion. And in the middle, those who spout rubbish off online.
I had a good friend change completely. It ruined his career, his self confidence, his aspirations. All because the police are not treated the same as other members of the public. I've got more examples, but this one was special to me as I saw a friend victimised and there was nothing I could do about it.
You mentioned justice; do us all a favour and think about things as they are.
Derek,
Thank you for the detailed response.
Of course that is only one side of the coin. I will do a search to see if the other side is online.
I am surprised to see that there are some points that we agree on e.g some senior police officers using nasty underhand tactics to further their careers.
The problem is that we, the public, do not know who they are. That is why I take the view that, when faced with a situation where my freedom might be in jeopardy, I think it safest to assume that the police are not my fiends.
Thank you for the detailed response.
Of course that is only one side of the coin. I will do a search to see if the other side is online.
I am surprised to see that there are some points that we agree on e.g some senior police officers using nasty underhand tactics to further their careers.
The problem is that we, the public, do not know who they are. That is why I take the view that, when faced with a situation where my freedom might be in jeopardy, I think it safest to assume that the police are not my fiends.
davidball said:
Hi La Liga,
Has that tantrum exhausted your list of infantile insults for today?
Greendubber. Do you know how to use a spell checker?
Stones and glass houses comes to mind: Has that tantrum exhausted your list of infantile insults for today?
Greendubber. Do you know how to use a spell checker?
davidball said:
..trot out its well-worn “not sufficient evidence for a realistic prosecution” bullst to hand the killer an immunity card.
Was it far enough away to give the officer a commendation for long distance marksmanship?
But the killer is a member of an organization that has a history of promoting officers who fail the humanity test
Police immunity in action yet again.
Watch out 'the system', here comes David with his angry ranting on a car forum. t to hand the killer an immunity card.Was it far enough away to give the officer a commendation for long distance marksmanship?
But the killer is a member of an organization that has a history of promoting officers who fail the humanity test
Police immunity in action yet again.
Take that!
I wonder where people like you went before the internet.
You must be so frustrating not understanding things. Why not stick to something more simple?
davidball said:
Derek,
Thank you for the detailed response.
Of course that is only one side of the coin. I will do a search to see if the other side is online.
I am surprised to see that there are some points that we agree on e.g some senior police officers using nasty underhand tactics to further their careers.
The problem is that we, the public, do not know who they are. That is why I take the view that, when faced with a situation where my freedom might be in jeopardy, I think it safest to assume that the police are not my fiends.
I think the problem is that the public often have no idea of what they are criticising. Thank you for the detailed response.
Of course that is only one side of the coin. I will do a search to see if the other side is online.
I am surprised to see that there are some points that we agree on e.g some senior police officers using nasty underhand tactics to further their careers.
The problem is that we, the public, do not know who they are. That is why I take the view that, when faced with a situation where my freedom might be in jeopardy, I think it safest to assume that the police are not my fiends.
I'm not sure you realise that my post was not so much a response as a critique of your beliefs.
The police are not their to be your friends. They have a function. I doubt the fire service is your friend. But if they put out your fire, who cares? The ambulance service paramedic probably doesn't care much about you as an individual. They are there to help you, perhaps save your life. The police have the function to protect you, including saving your life, but they might also have a requirement to investigate you. They should be honest and truthful in their dealings with you, but they don't regard you as a friend. If you commit an offence, or series of offences, they will still protect you against the actions of others, or, indeed, your friends if necessary, but they will still investigate you if they have suspicion you might be guilty of an offence, or be about to commit one.
davidball said:
The problem is that we, the public, .
You don't even live in this country so I don't think "we the public" really applies to you.Maybe if you were talking about the Belgium police you may have a point. As a matter of interest do you use other forums to complain about the Belgium police?
Drumroll said:
You don't even live in this country so I don't think "we the public" really applies to you.
Maybe if you were talking about the Belgium police you may have a point. As a matter of interest do you use other forums to complain about the Belgium police?
Flanders is a great place to live and so far I have no quarrel with the police here. Since I am liable to pay UK taxes on my UK pension I do feel I am part of the public whether I live in the UK or not. Tough if you do not like it.Maybe if you were talking about the Belgium police you may have a point. As a matter of interest do you use other forums to complain about the Belgium police?
Visit https://twitter.com/justiceforsean1?lang=en for a reality check.
davidball said:
Drumroll said:
You don't even live in this country so I don't think "we the public" really applies to you.
Maybe if you were talking about the Belgium police you may have a point. As a matter of interest do you use other forums to complain about the Belgium police?
Flanders is a great place to live and so far I have no quarrel with the police here. Since I am liable to pay UK taxes on my UK pension I do feel I am part of the public whether I live in the UK or not. Tough if you do not like it.Maybe if you were talking about the Belgium police you may have a point. As a matter of interest do you use other forums to complain about the Belgium police?
Visit https://twitter.com/justiceforsean1?lang=en for a reality check.
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