Advice required on negotiating a total loss pay out.
Discussion
What do you do if the offer you receive is bottom book price?
I’ve read that you should never accept the first offer. The bodyshop advised putting forward any receipts/invoices on extras spent on the vehicle.
I’ve found adverts online, screen shot them and sent them but prices swing by as much 4k! There are cars like mine with higher mileage and lower specification, selling for more.
I know they won’t pay a dealership price. I think the offer is off by about 1k.
Does the insurer take averages of a few adverts or go for the lowest price first?
Thank you.
I’ve read that you should never accept the first offer. The bodyshop advised putting forward any receipts/invoices on extras spent on the vehicle.
I’ve found adverts online, screen shot them and sent them but prices swing by as much 4k! There are cars like mine with higher mileage and lower specification, selling for more.
I know they won’t pay a dealership price. I think the offer is off by about 1k.
Does the insurer take averages of a few adverts or go for the lowest price first?
Thank you.
When this happened to me I told the insurer if they thought my car was only worth X amount then they can source me a replacement. After some haggling I got an increase that I thought was reasonable. Problem always is you know your car and it's faults. It's risky buying second hand as always.
Had the same issue when my daughters car was written off by a third party in May.
To replace her car with the same model and spec £2500
Best price from her insurer £2000, they started at £1500
Despite me showing them a bunch of adverts they just say "its top book". My argument is that
a. the car is quite rare and Ombudsman guideline say not to stick with the book for rare cars
b. the market for cheap cars has gone mad since covid, and the book doesn't reflect that as by definition it must be a lagging indicator
The 3rd parties insurers said to me they would have paid £2500 but as my daughters insurers had already offered £2000 there was nothing they could do.
So, its currently with the Ombudsman who is slow. Now £500 isnt that much to me, but for a student with nil income is huge.
To replace her car with the same model and spec £2500
Best price from her insurer £2000, they started at £1500
Despite me showing them a bunch of adverts they just say "its top book". My argument is that
a. the car is quite rare and Ombudsman guideline say not to stick with the book for rare cars
b. the market for cheap cars has gone mad since covid, and the book doesn't reflect that as by definition it must be a lagging indicator
The 3rd parties insurers said to me they would have paid £2500 but as my daughters insurers had already offered £2000 there was nothing they could do.
So, its currently with the Ombudsman who is slow. Now £500 isnt that much to me, but for a student with nil income is huge.
Print off adverts of the closest spec, age and mileage to yours and send them in. I have had this twice before and both times they upped their offer a fair bit. One was another £200 on my sons £1600 car, the other they went from 5k to 7k for the wife’s car.
Stick to your guns or ask them to source the replacement.
Fb
Stick to your guns or ask them to source the replacement.
Fb
Super_G said:
What do you do if the offer you receive is bottom book price?
I’ve read that you should never accept the first offer. The bodyshop advised putting forward any receipts/invoices on extras spent on the vehicle.
Did you inform the insurer of these added extras? If not, then they weren't specifically insured, so why should the insurer pay for them?I’ve read that you should never accept the first offer. The bodyshop advised putting forward any receipts/invoices on extras spent on the vehicle.
The insurer's argument tends to be that the price you see on Autotrader or Pistonhead isn't the selling price, only the asking price. You may get more traction if you provided examples of the same car from ebay with their ending price.
I've only had 2 instances where I've needed to consider the write-off value.
The first time (considered 'at fault', but just below write-off level) they took an average of 3 trade guides and was about what I considered to be the market value (mine's an outlier though with high miles for the model)...then they added in the value to replace the mods I'd added (and declared).
The second time (no fault, written off), the car was 2 weeks old (approved used), bought from a dealer and the insurer paid out what I'd paid 2 weeks previously.
I just repeatedly told them if they could source the same spec and mileage car and deliver it to me I would be happy or they could increase their offer. From memory the offer went up 25%+ as there was no way they could do what I'd asked. I just stood my ground. That advice was gleaned from this forum and it worked in my case.
It does seem to be a case of who has the most patience and determination wins. I had to go back three or four times when negotiating a settlement for my Land Rover. Prices vary massively and so I put together a really thorough file with close up photos, invoices for parts bought and work done, and made a table of all comparable vehicles on eBay and Autotrader etc.
I kept all discussions very civil and factual but gave a clear message that I wasn’t going away until we’d reached a fair price. In the end the offer had increased by over £2,500 from the starting point, so it was worth the time I spent researching and presenting the case.
I kept all discussions very civil and factual but gave a clear message that I wasn’t going away until we’d reached a fair price. In the end the offer had increased by over £2,500 from the starting point, so it was worth the time I spent researching and presenting the case.
Things have changed over the past few years, it used to be replacement cars within a certain radius that you needed to look at, and now its nationally.
When looking for ads, there is no point in picking the highest ad on there, as they will check and fid the lower priced ads,
The ads you supply need to be same, make, model, spec, mileage, and as close to your car as possible.
No point in submitting receipts for tyres, brakes or anything like that as they are consumables so dont add value to the car.
Effectively, you just need to supply adverts for the same, make, model and spec, with mileage, if yours has no service history and the ad you supply has full service history, then it wont be taken into account,
Likewise, if there are loads of ads for the price they are offering, and you send them one for a couple of grand higher, they wont accept them, and there are only certain places you can use for reference, can use ebay, gumtree or pistonheads.
When looking for ads, there is no point in picking the highest ad on there, as they will check and fid the lower priced ads,
The ads you supply need to be same, make, model, spec, mileage, and as close to your car as possible.
No point in submitting receipts for tyres, brakes or anything like that as they are consumables so dont add value to the car.
Effectively, you just need to supply adverts for the same, make, model and spec, with mileage, if yours has no service history and the ad you supply has full service history, then it wont be taken into account,
Likewise, if there are loads of ads for the price they are offering, and you send them one for a couple of grand higher, they wont accept them, and there are only certain places you can use for reference, can use ebay, gumtree or pistonheads.
Thanks so much everyone. I followed the spreadsheet idea. I included 20 examples. Same year. Similar mileages. 10 trade and 10 private. The average came out as a whopping £19,000.
What made me chuckle was all the adverts claiming high specification when they had may be 2-3 out of 12 optional extras. Mine had every single imaginable option and was the pinnacle.
Full main dealer service. Then genuine body kit parts and not knock offs - fitted by dealer.
Let’s hope they increase it a little. I’m not cupidinous about it but think a sensible offer seems justified given what the situation is.
What made me chuckle was all the adverts claiming high specification when they had may be 2-3 out of 12 optional extras. Mine had every single imaginable option and was the pinnacle.
Full main dealer service. Then genuine body kit parts and not knock offs - fitted by dealer.
Let’s hope they increase it a little. I’m not cupidinous about it but think a sensible offer seems justified given what the situation is.
Smurfsarepeopletoo said:
Things have changed over the past few years, it used to be replacement cars within a certain radius that you needed to look at, and now its nationally..
Daughter had her car written 2yrs ago this month. It was a Golf Twist and VW sold loads of them around 2011. Prices an Autorader went from £5000 to £7000. There were 35 of them for sale. Insurer first offered the cheapest on Autotrader but it was 200 miles away (and I'm sure it was 'scam' priced to be the lowest as it had £5995 in the screen!). Then they said they'd messed up and should have looked at cars within (I think) 50 miles. They immediately offered £5500. Both average and median prices on Autorader were £6000 but they absolutely wouldn't budge. We'd owned the car from new, full service history, newish Michelin tyres and had not long spent a grand on cambelt and brakes. Insurer didn't give a toss about any of that.
I will say our car had a higher mileage than most others - was mid 70's and many for sale were in the 30's - and it did have a few body imperfections but neither of those were mentioned by the insurer. Overall it was probably a fair price, but I'd have liked nearer the £6K.
Super_G said:
...,..
Let’s hope they increase it a little. I’m not cupidinous about it but think a sensible offer seems justified given what the situation is.
Can I just say that AFAIK this is the only time that the word Cupidinous has been used on PH, and I for one applaud its usage.Let’s hope they increase it a little. I’m not cupidinous about it but think a sensible offer seems justified given what the situation is.
Thank you. Please carry on.
FlyingPanda said:
Super_G said:
...,..
Let’s hope they increase it a little. I’m not cupidinous about it but think a sensible offer seems justified given what the situation is.
Can I just say that AFAIK this is the only time that the word Cupidinous has been used on PH, and I for one applaud its usage.Let’s hope they increase it a little. I’m not cupidinous about it but think a sensible offer seems justified given what the situation is.
Thank you. Please carry on.
Won't help you now but look at an agreed valuation policy at renewal. Agree up front with the underwriters using supporting evidence the value of the vehicle then there is no need to worry about total loss as you get what you are insured for not bottom book value and have to haggle the valuation up.
t.blueg33 said:
Had the same issue when my daughters car was written off by a third party in May.
To replace her car with the same model and spec £2500
Best price from her insurer £2000, they started at £1500
Despite me showing them a bunch of adverts they just say "its top book". My argument is that
a. the car is quite rare and Ombudsman guideline say not to stick with the book for rare cars
b. the market for cheap cars has gone mad since covid, and the book doesn't reflect that as by definition it must be a lagging indicator
The 3rd parties insurers said to me they would have paid £2500 but as my daughters insurers had already offered £2000 there was nothing they could do.
So, its currently with the Ombudsman who is slow. Now £500 isnt that much to me, but for a student with nil income is huge.
Had a similar situation with Mrs H’s car when it got written off. The insurance company was extremely keen to suggest that I could go go the ombudsman if I wasn’t happy with their valuation (which covered about 75% of any available replacement), you could almost hear them sniggering down the phone as they said it was the only way to resolve the situation. To replace her car with the same model and spec £2500
Best price from her insurer £2000, they started at £1500
Despite me showing them a bunch of adverts they just say "its top book". My argument is that
a. the car is quite rare and Ombudsman guideline say not to stick with the book for rare cars
b. the market for cheap cars has gone mad since covid, and the book doesn't reflect that as by definition it must be a lagging indicator
The 3rd parties insurers said to me they would have paid £2500 but as my daughters insurers had already offered £2000 there was nothing they could do.
So, its currently with the Ombudsman who is slow. Now £500 isnt that much to me, but for a student with nil income is huge.
When I said I wouldn’t be going to an ombudsman but I would happily take them to court I got a call back within 30 minutes offering a more sensible figure.
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