Mandatory Speed Limiters from 6th July 2022
Discussion
What standards are there in place for the various automated systems/ warnings/ safety features on vehicles?
Someone somewhere myst decide that a system is fit for purpose and be robust and capable enough to recognise the myriad of variables that are continually changing, then use algorithms to make a decision on creating input to suit. Braking, steering etc..
I just bought a new car with the lane detection function. I left it on to see how it worked in the real world.
Interesting to say the least. It activated in some situations but not others.
On rural roads it seemed ok. mostly. Built up areas inactive.
Hatched areas in mid road ( the twin lines with hatching between) no effect.
In all cases there were clear lanes requiring staying in, just with different markings or surroundings. This, to me, indicates a limited capability to read situations and apply the tech.
I haven’t got round to evaluating the collision avoidance system yet, Still turned off. When I do it will be interesting.
My views are that modern cars are filled with tech systems that lull drivers into laziness, inattentiveness, failure to actually control the vehicle. Rely on the car to get them out of the s##t.
Someone somewhere myst decide that a system is fit for purpose and be robust and capable enough to recognise the myriad of variables that are continually changing, then use algorithms to make a decision on creating input to suit. Braking, steering etc..
I just bought a new car with the lane detection function. I left it on to see how it worked in the real world.
Interesting to say the least. It activated in some situations but not others.
On rural roads it seemed ok. mostly. Built up areas inactive.
Hatched areas in mid road ( the twin lines with hatching between) no effect.
In all cases there were clear lanes requiring staying in, just with different markings or surroundings. This, to me, indicates a limited capability to read situations and apply the tech.
I haven’t got round to evaluating the collision avoidance system yet, Still turned off. When I do it will be interesting.
My views are that modern cars are filled with tech systems that lull drivers into laziness, inattentiveness, failure to actually control the vehicle. Rely on the car to get them out of the s##t.
sospan said:
What standards are there in place for the various automated systems/ warnings/ safety features on vehicles?
Someone somewhere myst decide that a system is fit for purpose and be robust and capable enough to recognise the myriad of variables that are continually changing, then use algorithms to make a decision on creating input to suit. Braking, steering etc..
I just bought a new car with the lane detection function. I left it on to see how it worked in the real world.
Interesting to say the least. It activated in some situations but not others.
On rural roads it seemed ok. mostly. Built up areas inactive.
Hatched areas in mid road ( the twin lines with hatching between) no effect.
In all cases there were clear lanes requiring staying in, just with different markings or surroundings. This, to me, indicates a limited capability to read situations and apply the tech.
I haven’t got round to evaluating the collision avoidance system yet, Still turned off. When I do it will be interesting.
My views are that modern cars are filled with tech systems that lull drivers into laziness, inattentiveness, failure to actually control the vehicle. Rely on the car to get them out of the s##t.
Cars can drive fully automated, its just that most cars are generations behind. So it will depend on who is running the implmintaion to if it works. Someone somewhere myst decide that a system is fit for purpose and be robust and capable enough to recognise the myriad of variables that are continually changing, then use algorithms to make a decision on creating input to suit. Braking, steering etc..
I just bought a new car with the lane detection function. I left it on to see how it worked in the real world.
Interesting to say the least. It activated in some situations but not others.
On rural roads it seemed ok. mostly. Built up areas inactive.
Hatched areas in mid road ( the twin lines with hatching between) no effect.
In all cases there were clear lanes requiring staying in, just with different markings or surroundings. This, to me, indicates a limited capability to read situations and apply the tech.
I haven’t got round to evaluating the collision avoidance system yet, Still turned off. When I do it will be interesting.
My views are that modern cars are filled with tech systems that lull drivers into laziness, inattentiveness, failure to actually control the vehicle. Rely on the car to get them out of the s##t.
I understand the ability to create driverless cars. In itself not that difficult in controlled conditions. However in the real world with so many variables that are possible to encounter, where is the ability of such systems to spot, analyse, react appropriately to?
The algorithms and computing power to be doing this are quite demanding, especially within the near instantaneous timescales involved. Even more complex when in a mix of autonomous and human controlled traffic where humans will react differently to a vehicle programmed to conform to tight limits. If all cars were autonomous and able to link data and be highly reliable then ok. Add in human variables and it is suddenly far more complex.
The algorithms and computing power to be doing this are quite demanding, especially within the near instantaneous timescales involved. Even more complex when in a mix of autonomous and human controlled traffic where humans will react differently to a vehicle programmed to conform to tight limits. If all cars were autonomous and able to link data and be highly reliable then ok. Add in human variables and it is suddenly far more complex.
Steve Dean said:
I also find the performance "arms race" that appears to be going on with EV's is rather nutty. How long will it be before 'the men in the ministry' step in and restrict EV performance. To put that in context ..... someone I know has on order a Tesla S Plaid which reputedly can do 0-60MPH in 2.9 seconds. And no doubt he'll want to try. Damp road, greasy spot ....... hello tree- lamp post- dead walker.
No problem - Advanced Driver Assistance Systems will take control before anything untoward happens. But I can still see acceleration restrictions being mandated if only to 'improve' safety of the road environment. Don't want any nasty surprises.
Pixelpeep 135 said:
Smart motorways are a great example of when someone thinks they can use fully automated tech successfully
Nearly all UK motorways are smart as demonstrated by all the sunken sensors that monitor traffic flow, lane usage, noise and pollution and by doing so then activate the gantry signs to clear lanes or slow approaching traffic behind slow or queuing traffic. Are you referring to the ones where they have implemented use of the hard shoulder during peak traffic loads? senninha2 said:
Pixelpeep 135 said:
Smart motorways are a great example of when someone thinks they can use fully automated tech successfully
Nearly all UK motorways are smart as demonstrated by all the sunken sensors that monitor traffic flow, lane usage, noise and pollution and by doing so then activate the gantry signs to clear lanes or slow approaching traffic behind slow or queuing traffic. Are you referring to the ones where they have implemented use of the hard shoulder during peak traffic loads? 
Johnnytheboy said:
mmm-five said:
senninha2 said:
A closing thought … its likely too late to defer these changes but maybe, just maybe, if as petrolheads we ALL drove within the speed limits and gave consideration to others the reduction in casualties and deaths could be acheived and we might convince big brother not to be driving our cars for us for a little longer …
No previous reduction in casualties has led to any easing of the 'war on motorists', so why would anyone believe that it would happen now?GranpaB said:
Johnnytheboy said:
mmm-five said:
senninha2 said:
A closing thought … its likely too late to defer these changes but maybe, just maybe, if as petrolheads we ALL drove within the speed limits and gave consideration to others the reduction in casualties and deaths could be acheived and we might convince big brother not to be driving our cars for us for a little longer …
No previous reduction in casualties has led to any easing of the 'war on motorists', so why would anyone believe that it would happen now?
OutInTheShed said:
Always amazing me that the road system mostly copes with half bright human drivers at 2 second intervals, but the highly automated, controlled railways can only manage a train every few minutes.
https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/reported-road-casualties-in-great-britain-provisional-estimates-year-ending-june-2021there were 1,390 reported road deaths, a decrease of 11% compared to the year ending June 2020
there were 119,850 casualties of all severities, a decrease of 9% compared to the year ending June 2020
Decreasing but still not great.
The restriction to newer cars gives me some hope the future values of older stuff may rise. I think it'll swing heavily one way or the other.
Edited by Rick101 on Tuesday 28th June 20:05
Rick101 said:
https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/reported-...
there were 1,390 reported road deaths, a decrease of 11% compared to the year ending June 2020
there were 119,850 casualties of all severities, a decrease of 9% compared to the year ending June 2020
Decreasing but still not great.
The restriction to newer cars gives me some hope the future values of older stuff may rise. I think it'll swing heavily one way or the other.
Of course there was less road deaths and casualties - there was no bloody cars on the road that year!! there were 1,390 reported road deaths, a decrease of 11% compared to the year ending June 2020
there were 119,850 casualties of all severities, a decrease of 9% compared to the year ending June 2020
Decreasing but still not great.
The restriction to newer cars gives me some hope the future values of older stuff may rise. I think it'll swing heavily one way or the other.
Rick101 said:
https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/reported-...
there were 1,390 reported road deaths, a decrease of 11% compared to the year ending June 2020
there were 119,850 casualties of all severities, a decrease of 9% compared to the year ending June 2020
Decreasing but still not great.
Outstanding not great...there were 1,390 reported road deaths, a decrease of 11% compared to the year ending June 2020
there were 119,850 casualties of all severities, a decrease of 9% compared to the year ending June 2020
Decreasing but still not great.
Britain has amongst the best road safety figures worldwide. We should be proud of our success.
Draxindustries1 said:
Johnnytheboy said:
GranpaB said:
How is that going to work going forward?
Buy used!jm doc said:
After 5 years of the public buying used cars manufacturers will be removing all the crap and restrictions whatever the governments say. Those that still remain in business by then.
Huge majority will grasp advanced driver-assistance 'safety' features with glee. Makes them feel safer. Cars without ADAS will not sell in any great numbers.In due course, mandatory ADAS will not be switchable. Engaged by default, you will have to live with it.
Today's initiative is tomorrow's regulation.
OutInTheShed said:
Always amazing me that the road system mostly copes with half bright human drivers at 2 second intervals, but the highly automated, controlled railways can only manage a train every few minutes.
^ ^ I think you already know the answer to that.The stopping distance for a train from 70mph is about half a mile.
Also, it can't swerve to avoid the one in front.
jm doc said:
After 5 years of the public buying used cars manufacturers will be removing all the crap and restrictions whatever the governments say. Those that still remain in business by then.
Although diminishing, more than half of new cars are bought as company vehicles. Plus with the focus on fuel economy at the moment it would seem the perfect time to introduce such an "aid"!Debaser said:
bigothunter said:
Can ISA reliably differentiate between mph and kph signs/territories? If not, be prepared for a fun time 
If you want a glimpse of the future, just use cruise control in a Mk. 8 Golf. My favourite experience so far was when I was doing 80ish in the outside lane of a busy motorway, the system incorrectly picked up on a 30mph sign, then got confused between mph and kph, changed the cruise control set speed to 19mph and started braking down to that speed. 
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