Police BMW engine issues
Discussion
pavarotti1980 said:
carreauchompeur said:
Very true. But then our forthcoming orders are all Volvo, so hopefully a genuinely mixed fleet does result. The Volvos seem to be pretty bad for parts availability already though which is a concern…
And apparently the inability to have some of the safety features disabled....Vauxhall used to make 3.2 V6 (and a V6 CDTi) for the Vectra, do they have uprated engines for the current Insignias if BMWs are off the menu? The next series of Police Interceptors will be very interesting if they are trying to catch someone in a Golf R whilst ragging a 1.5 diesel Combo or Astra 
Met Police tried with Hyundai i30s a few years back, then went back to Ford's and Vauxhalls. I see they have the latest G05 X5s now for traffic duties, along with 5 Series Touring.
I had ax Ex Leicestershire traffic 530d on a 57 plate for a family car, never missed a beat. The 6 cylinder engines are way better than the 4 pots with Swirl Flaps which can be ingested into the cylinders wrecking the engine, and a timing chain at the back of the engine (guides can fail) which requires the complete engine out to get it changed (N47's were known for this).
Met Police tried with Hyundai i30s a few years back, then went back to Ford's and Vauxhalls. I see they have the latest G05 X5s now for traffic duties, along with 5 Series Touring.
I had ax Ex Leicestershire traffic 530d on a 57 plate for a family car, never missed a beat. The 6 cylinder engines are way better than the 4 pots with Swirl Flaps which can be ingested into the cylinders wrecking the engine, and a timing chain at the back of the engine (guides can fail) which requires the complete engine out to get it changed (N47's were known for this).
CourtAgain said:
Vauxhall used to make 3.2 V6 (and a V6 CDTi) for the Vectra, do they have uprated engines for the current Insignias if BMWs are off the menu? The next series of Police Interceptors will be very interesting if they are trying to catch someone in a Golf R whilst ragging a 1.5 diesel Combo or Astra
Met Police tried with Hyundai i30s a few years back, then went back to Ford's and Vauxhalls. I see they have the latest G05 X5s now for traffic duties, along with 5 Series Touring.
I had ax Ex Leicestershire traffic 530d on a 57 plate for a family car, never missed a beat. The 6 cylinder engines are way better than the 4 pots with Swirl Flaps which can be ingested into the cylinders wrecking the engine, and a timing chain at the back of the engine (guides can fail) which requires the complete engine out to get it changed (N47's were known for this).
Spoke to an RPU cop about this last night. I think this decision to pull an entire fleet and use beat cars on a temporary basis is due to the very risk averse nature of the force involved. Other forces have implemented different strategies to cope with the issue. I guess you wouldn't want to be the fleet manager if the wheels came off after BMW highlighted the problem and you had to explain why the fleet was still in use.Met Police tried with Hyundai i30s a few years back, then went back to Ford's and Vauxhalls. I see they have the latest G05 X5s now for traffic duties, along with 5 Series Touring.
I had ax Ex Leicestershire traffic 530d on a 57 plate for a family car, never missed a beat. The 6 cylinder engines are way better than the 4 pots with Swirl Flaps which can be ingested into the cylinders wrecking the engine, and a timing chain at the back of the engine (guides can fail) which requires the complete engine out to get it changed (N47's were known for this).
BMW presence in the market looks increasingly likely to reduce in the coming months though
Second Best said:
Purely anecdotal - I had a coincidental meeting with a trafpol the other day. …. He was in a 530d, it was 2 years old and already had 66k miles on it, so was at least run-in.
Our cars are running a lot more than that, averaging about 6.5 - 7k miles per month! So by the time they’re 2.5 yrs old they’re over 200k miles.The BMWs can handle that - well, they’ve lost a fair bit of acceleration & top speed that they had when new, but they still work - most of the time.
But now we’re going to a mixed fleet & getting Volvo again - the last Volvos we had (XC70’s) were crap! By 120k/130k they weren’t reliable, when you put your foot down the auto boxes had to pause & have a think about what gear they were going for before they changed & on a few of the cars the AWD system had packed in completely & they were driving only the front wheels!
I’m sure as an everyday car (going to the shops, lugging dogs about) the Volvo’s a good car. But Police cars take such a hammering, they just couldn’t cope!
edthefed said:
Its not as simple as going to the local dealership and buying second hand
My Force did just that! They had trouble getting hold of cars from VW through the “Authorities” division or whatever VAG choose to call it, so they approached a National dealer group & bought some secondhand, low mileage Golf GTI PP’s which are now flying about with flashy blue lights & sirens!It might not be feasible for a full fleet purchase but it does happen.
The XC70 was a hated car and was the wrong car to buy. Slow and fragile. The issue with the transmission was apparently the fact that the transfer case for the AWD system dated back to the Ford Granada 4x4 (the issue of trying to mate a transverse engine to an AWD system). Under high stress and high weight (if armoured) they just gave up. They were tested and scored very poorly by the drivers but still ended up being bought across the UK by loads of forces. Similarly with the other D5 cars that were just not fast enough.
However, look back to the S60 T5. Fast, comfortable and reliable. I don't think I've ever spoken to someone who drove one on duty or as a trainer who didn't think it was a great car. I'd like to think the issues with the XC70 were down to it just being the wrong car. The new V60 T6 model with the twin charged engine is a good steer.
However, look back to the S60 T5. Fast, comfortable and reliable. I don't think I've ever spoken to someone who drove one on duty or as a trainer who didn't think it was a great car. I'd like to think the issues with the XC70 were down to it just being the wrong car. The new V60 T6 model with the twin charged engine is a good steer.
Yeah the old S60 was a joy, that 5-pot motor sounded like a beast when going all-out!
We, however, have apparently chosen to go with the B6 “mild hybrid” for the new cars. By all accounts it accelerates like a scalded cat. But who knows how they’ll fare with the daily dose of being ragged constantly day after day!
We, however, have apparently chosen to go with the B6 “mild hybrid” for the new cars. By all accounts it accelerates like a scalded cat. But who knows how they’ll fare with the daily dose of being ragged constantly day after day!
We initially got an email saying that none of our X5's (so ARV fleet) were allowed to be driven in sport mode or above 70 mph. A huge kick off ensued about how ridiculous this was and they very quickly removed all X5's from service. A short time later all the 330d's followed suit. We're now using Vauxhall Vivaro's and Ford Rangers as ARV's and Peugeot 308's and our old fleet of Suberb estates and Golf GTI's as traffic cars.
We recently tested the XC90 B6 and the VW Toureg 3.0 tdi 280 and ordered both as ARV's and V60/V90 B6 as traffic cars. The Volvo's are stonkingly fast cars and got great feedback but are let down by the gearbox and lack of flappy paddles. The VW's are slightly slower but handle better and have the better gearbox.
I absolutely adored the S60 T5, but honestly the X5's were the best all round ARV we ever had (the worst will always be the Volvo XC70 D5. Absolutely horrendously slow, poor handling piles of crap) But stuff happens and I'm excited about both replacements which are inbound........eventually
We recently tested the XC90 B6 and the VW Toureg 3.0 tdi 280 and ordered both as ARV's and V60/V90 B6 as traffic cars. The Volvo's are stonkingly fast cars and got great feedback but are let down by the gearbox and lack of flappy paddles. The VW's are slightly slower but handle better and have the better gearbox.
I absolutely adored the S60 T5, but honestly the X5's were the best all round ARV we ever had (the worst will always be the Volvo XC70 D5. Absolutely horrendously slow, poor handling piles of crap) But stuff happens and I'm excited about both replacements which are inbound........eventually
ConnectionError said:
What is the actual issue with the BMW’s?
And why are Mercedes, Jaguar or Land Rovers/ Range Rovers (cue the unreliable comments) for example not being considered as replacements?
Something to do with iron filings in the engine blocking the oil vanes and causing overheating and subsequently engine fire.And why are Mercedes, Jaguar or Land Rovers/ Range Rovers (cue the unreliable comments) for example not being considered as replacements?
As far as I'm aware, neither Mercedes nor JLR offer anything type approved for the overt Police market
Don Roque said:
The XC70 was a hated car and was the wrong car to buy. Slow and fragile. The issue with the transmission was apparently the fact that the transfer case for the AWD system dated back to the Ford Granada 4x4 (the issue of trying to mate a transverse engine to an AWD system). Under high stress and high weight (if armoured) they just gave up. They were tested and scored very poorly by the drivers but still ended up being bought across the UK by loads of forces. Similarly with the other D5 cars that were just not fast enough.
However, look back to the S60 T5. Fast, comfortable and reliable. I don't think I've ever spoken to someone who drove one on duty or as a trainer who didn't think it was a great car. I'd like to think the issues with the XC70 were down to it just being the wrong car. The new V60 T6 model with the twin charged engine is a good steer.
The Granada 4x4 had an inline engine.However, look back to the S60 T5. Fast, comfortable and reliable. I don't think I've ever spoken to someone who drove one on duty or as a trainer who didn't think it was a great car. I'd like to think the issues with the XC70 were down to it just being the wrong car. The new V60 T6 model with the twin charged engine is a good steer.
pavarotti1980 said:
carreauchompeur said:
Quite an extreme response from that force!
Reading the comments (and some seem to be from people "in the know"), it appears that they have not followed the schedule from BMW therefore it will likely invalidate any warranty.Interestingly a bit further north Berwick and Alnwick just got their new Skoda estates delivered.
Southerner said:
Space issues aside, the 330d seems pretty much the ideal unmarked motor. You can never tell an RPU 3 Series from all the others out there until it's close enough to be far too late! That said, the LED flashers on the grille are a handy giveaway if there's one right behind you in traffic! 
I’m a BMW fanboy and spot those a mile off. However I came up behind a brand new 3 series touring in white on the M5 a couple of days ago and didn’t notice the led strips on the rear numberplate until I drew level with it-very stealthy!ConnectionError said:
What is the actual issue with the BMW’s?
And why are Mercedes, Jaguar or Land Rovers/ Range Rovers (cue the unreliable comments) for example not being considered as replacements?
We had Jaguar XFs on our fleet a good few years ago. They only lasted a few years. Constantly having replacement engines and bits were always coming off them. It's very disconcerting to lose your undertray at 140mphAnd why are Mercedes, Jaguar or Land Rovers/ Range Rovers (cue the unreliable comments) for example not being considered as replacements?
Elroy Blue said:
We had Jaguar XFs on our fleet a good few years ago. They only lasted a few years. Constantly having replacement engines and bits were always coming off them. It's very disconcerting to lose your undertray at 140mph
Makes me laugh when motoring journalists are flown out to Norwegian frozen lakes and the like to preview supposedly premium cars going through their 'intensive durability testing', - then you get them back here and they don't last 10 minutes on the M42.Cobnapint said:
Elroy Blue said:
We had Jaguar XFs on our fleet a good few years ago. They only lasted a few years. Constantly having replacement engines and bits were always coming off them. It's very disconcerting to lose your undertray at 140mph
Makes me laugh when motoring journalists are flown out to Norwegian frozen lakes and the like to preview supposedly premium cars going through their 'intensive durability testing', - then you get them back here and they don't last 10 minutes on the M42.Years ago we got a fleet of VW Transporters to replace the Sherpa vans … yeah I know it was like night and day
Anyway, in very short order the side loading doors started falling off them .. the cast bracket hinges on the top of the door was sheering off and the door would cartwheel down the road. Quite spectacular but not really a good thing to have Police vans decapitating pedestrians
VW said it was impossible and couldn’t happen as in how ever many years they’d been making transporters non had ever snapped, and because of that they didn’t have spare hinges for the doors … because they didn’t need them, because they never broke !
We however had a big yard full of broken transporters all with the same fault .. broken door hinge
It was sorted .. but a load of vehicles had to be taken off the road whilst a fix was found
Bottom line, give it to the cops and they will break the unbreakable
As I understand it the issue with the N57 BMW's is related to the amount of time they are left idling (when on scene) with the engine at very low revs. As most will know, the oil pressure when idling can be very low and it seems particularly damaging to the N57 unit. The end result is main bearing failure which has resulted in seized engines.
An incident was relayed to me where a police officer had been killed in an incident where the engine has seized at speed, in the crash the officers radio aerial (or other vest worn kit) impacted with their head resulting in death.
The person who told me the above info is a serving police officer whose role is as a driving instructor for the police/security services.
An incident was relayed to me where a police officer had been killed in an incident where the engine has seized at speed, in the crash the officers radio aerial (or other vest worn kit) impacted with their head resulting in death.
The person who told me the above info is a serving police officer whose role is as a driving instructor for the police/security services.
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