Chris Kaba Shooting
Discussion
Mr Miata said:
There’s people on here who don’t understand the concept of de-escalating a situation rather than making it worse.
This. But this is PH where being powerfully built and "dominating the space" is the only way forward 
It's just nuts that somebody lost his life, he may not have been the nicest person nor had he perhaps been a model citizen but he didn't deserve or need too die.
SteveKTMer said:
Mr Miata said:
There’s people on here who don’t understand the concept of de-escalating a situation rather than making it worse.
This. But this is PH where being powerfully built and "dominating the space" is the only way forward It's just nuts that somebody lost his life, he may not have been the nicest person nor had he perhaps been a model citizen but he didn't deserve or need too die.
The Police job was & they were equipped to, stop the vehicle. Not let it go & lose potential evidence etc.
What happens next depends on the person stopped.
You can't just let everybody go because they may resist.
The process now is to determine whether the officer was in (justifiable) fear for his or another's life & was therefore justified in shooting because of it.
For that all the facts are needed.
Raccaccoonie said:
Geffg said:
Some of the comments regarding how the police could’ve done better etc etc, all well and good afterwards and not in that moment. Also I would love to live in their perfect world where criminals just stop when asked and everything is all rosy. It’s like they haven’t a clue about the real world. People who’ve never experienced a normal persons living area not a rich persons perfect no crime area. Do gooders who think everyone should have all these rights and respect when these sh#t bags have no respect for anyone or anything. Imo criminals should be dealt with a lot harder than they are. Treat them with the same respect they give others which is none so why they be dealt with lightly.
Smash a few heads in and make them give you respect instead of pussy footing around them like the olden days. if the police treated them like they treat the police I’m sure the tide would turn.
What crimes did he commit to be executed?Smash a few heads in and make them give you respect instead of pussy footing around them like the olden days. if the police treated them like they treat the police I’m sure the tide would turn.
Edited by Raccaccoonie on Saturday 1st April 23:14
CoolHands said:
Geffg said:
Some of the comments regarding how the police could’ve done better etc etc, all well and good afterwards and not in that moment. Also I would love to live in their perfect world where criminals just stop when asked and everything is all rosy. It’s like they haven’t a clue about the real world. People who’ve never experienced a normal persons living area not a rich persons perfect no crime area. Do gooders who think everyone should have all these rights and respect when these sh#t bags have no respect for anyone or anything. Imo criminals should be dealt with a lot harder than they are. Treat them with the same respect they give others which is none so why they be dealt with lightly.
Smash a few heads in and make them give you respect instead of pussy footing around them like the olden days. if the police treated them like they treat the police I’m sure the tide would turn.
You’ll have a sore head tomorrow I guessSmash a few heads in and make them give you respect instead of pussy footing around them like the olden days. if the police treated them like they treat the police I’m sure the tide would turn.
SteveKTMer said:
This. But this is PH where being powerfully built and "dominating the space" is the only way forward
It's just nuts that somebody lost his life, he may not have been the nicest person nor had he perhaps been a model citizen but he didn't deserve or need too die.
And if HE had complied and not attempted to flee, HE still would be. Personal responsibility, as I said previously, severely lacking in modern society, it's always someone else’s fault.It's just nuts that somebody lost his life, he may not have been the nicest person nor had he perhaps been a model citizen but he didn't deserve or need too die.
He needn't have died, and sad that he did.
SteveKTMer said:
Mr Miata said:
There’s people on here who don’t understand the concept of de-escalating a situation rather than making it worse.
This. But this is PH where being powerfully built and "dominating the space" is the only way forward It's just nuts that somebody lost his life, he may not have been the nicest person nor had he perhaps been a model citizen but he didn't deserve or need too die.
If you aren't and haven't done those things and you're telling everyone that the force was unlawful, you should probably wait this one out and see how it ends before jumping to conclusions from your armchair.
nordboy said:
And if HE had complied and not attempted to flee, HE still would be. Personal responsibility, as I said previously, severely lacking in modern society, it's always someone else’s fault.
He needn't have died, and sad that he did.
Personal responsibility severely lacking these days.He needn't have died, and sad that he did.
You said that before and I agree wholeheartedly.
It's lack of personal responsibility that had the population looking to the government to severely screw up the response to Covid.
One example I can think of.
Anyway, for another long running thread.
I admonished my son for feking around in the road and nearly getting hit by a car.
His response was to say that they would be at fault and he could sue??
Not much good if you are severely injured or dead.
A lot of people treat modern life as if it's a game or a theme park yet if it goes horribly wrong, they seem surprised, then look to see who they can blame, or if dead, their relatives play the blame game.
SteveKTMer said:
Mr Miata said:
There’s people on here who don’t understand the concept of de-escalating a situation rather than making it worse.
This. But this is PH where being powerfully built and "dominating the space" is the only way forward It's just nuts that somebody lost his life, he may not have been the nicest person nor had he perhaps been a model citizen but he didn't deserve or need too die.
The real world isn’t like that at all.
I can understand you not taking any notice of the opinions of the serving and ex-cops on here. Understandably, you may consider their opinions to be biased.
I was bang at it for the best part of 20 years. Given half a chance I’ll be highly critical of the police. I’m absolutely no fan of them.
Considering that I’ve spent nearly half of my adult life playing on the opposing team to the police, I should therefore hope that you’d take my opinion as one that is more likely to be biased against the police.
So believe me when I say, Chris Kaba got Chris Kaba killed.
When multiple armed officer are stood there, weapons drawn, screaming at you, you do as you’re told and you live to see another day. What you don’t do is try and use your car to run over armed officers pointing guns at you. It seems obvious to me that the person “not understanding a concept” here is you. The real world is a far more unpleasant place than it would seem you think it is.
This really is a perfect example of how playing stupid games, (trying to run over armed officers), wins you stupid prizes, (getting shot and killed).
I’ll reiterate my previous points, and say once again that I hope the cop(s) involved in this shooting DO NOT face any charges or disciplinary actions at their place of work.
IMO, having previously found myself in a very similar position to Chris Kaba, the police did absolutely nothing wrong.
There’s nothing ‘powerfully built company director’ about my opinion. It’s merely just common sense. Something that was clearly lacking in the mind of Chris Kaba.
SteveKTMer said:
This. But this is PH where being powerfully built and "dominating the space" is the only way forward
It's just nuts that somebody lost his life, he may not have been the nicest person nor had he perhaps been a model citizen but he didn't deserve or need too die.
How do you know? Have you seen the evidence. It's just nuts that somebody lost his life, he may not have been the nicest person nor had he perhaps been a model citizen but he didn't deserve or need too die.
CoolHands said:
He may have “got himself killed” but that doesn’t mean it was lawful. He might have just acted like a complete irresponsible idiot
And that's why there is judicial oversight & a process being completed.We can't know the answer here until it has been gone through.
All we can do is discuss hypothetically.
Raccaccoonie said:
98elise said:
He wasn't executed.
Sorry murdered.Just asking really as the poster said he was a criminal, can't see anything online for convictions.
Try searching for Chris Kaba Criminal Record
First link...
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2022/09/23/chris-...
"Mr Kaba had previously served a four year prison sentence after being convicted of possessing an imitation firearm.
But it has now emerged that in August 2020, after he had got out of jail, he was caught driving without insurance with a knife in his car.
Because the offences were committed while he was still on licence, he received an extra five months in custody.
Court records also show that in April this year, Mr Kaba was served with a 28-day domestic violence protection order relating to the mother of his unborn child"
vonhosen said:
CoolHands said:
He may have “got himself killed” but that doesn’t mean it was lawful. He might have just acted like a complete irresponsible idiot
And that's why there is judicial oversight & a process being completed.We can't know the answer here until it has been gone through.
All we can do is discuss hypothetically.
105.4 said:
So believe me when I say, Chris Kaba got Chris Kaba killed.
When multiple armed officer are stood there, weapons drawn, screaming at you, you do as you’re told and you live to see another day. What you don’t do is try and use your car to run over armed officers pointing guns at you. It seems obvious to me that the person “not understanding a concept” here is you. The real world is a far more unpleasant place than it would seem you think it is.
This really is a perfect example of how playing stupid games, (trying to run over armed officers), wins you stupid prizes, (getting shot and killed).
Exactly... An old mate was arrested in a pre-dawn raid due to a misunderstanding about some pyrotechnics his housemate was storing (not sure about the legality of storing them at home however they were stage pyros for a theatre production that a plumber thought were bombs and reported). Rented house full of unrelated young blokes with Irish passports, explosives hidden under the sink, 2+2=5, they were stormed by armed police. When multiple armed officer are stood there, weapons drawn, screaming at you, you do as you’re told and you live to see another day. What you don’t do is try and use your car to run over armed officers pointing guns at you. It seems obvious to me that the person “not understanding a concept” here is you. The real world is a far more unpleasant place than it would seem you think it is.
This really is a perfect example of how playing stupid games, (trying to run over armed officers), wins you stupid prizes, (getting shot and killed).
As they were not a new faction of the IRA but rather some nice normal chaps they did what normal chaps do in this situation, which is to do what the shouty people with guns asked.
If Chris Kaba had put his hands up and done what was asked, he wouldn't have been shot. If Chris Kaba were white, Asian or any other ethnicity and had done what he did, he would also have been shot.
donkmeister said:
If Chris Kaba were white, Asian or any other ethnicity and had done what he did, he would also have been shot.
And rightly or wrongly it would have been a few news reports and then everybody would have forgotten about it as there's no political motivation to kick off about the police shooting people from any other ethnic groups.The same processes and burden of responsibility would fall upon the police, IOPC and CPS but there wouldn't be the same level of attention because it doesn't fit a narrative for the press and current public attitudes.
SteveKTMer said:
To give verbal instructions ? Really ? You shouting "please stop, we're not happy with the way you are driving" or similar words, isn't going to have any effect at all. Well, it didn't take long for the PH plod zealots to raise the heads did it
Verbal instructions is *exactly* what happens...'tactical comms' in police or military parlance.How many videos have you seen where officers are shouting, armed police, drop the knife, or telling people to stand still etc, whilst aiming their firearm or taser at the subject?
Pointing a gun (or taser) at someone and shouting verbal instructions is *exactly* what police are trained to do, the whole point is that the mere threat of the immediate use of force from the firearm or taser (or police dog etc) is often enough to gain control and to get the subject to comply with the instructions given and start doing as they are told, without the need to resort to actually using a higher level use of force by shooting someone or discharging taser at them etc.
This is the desired outcome and in the vast majority of cases, results in officers gaining control of the subject without any injury to any person. Witness how few people are actually shot by police officers in the UK every year.
You are on about police zealots, you realise I actually am a police officer, trained to carry taser every day anc working as a first responder, who works in a very busy urban area where firearms officers are deployed with authorities to use firearms on a more than daily basis (my force authorises deployment of trained firearms officers to around 4000 incidents *a year*, for context on average there are 4000-5000 police incidents generated each day across the entire force area requiring some sort of attendance or intervention from officers).
I am wholly familiar with tactics and the legislation and policy around use of force, and yet you're telling me I am wrong? What is your level of training and experience in police and firearms tactics in the UK? Prime PH.
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