Garage has had my car over six months
Discussion
JohnnyUK said:
Hi All
To cut a long story short, I eventually agreed that the bottom end needed a new bearing and "while you're at it" we may as well do an engine re-build.
Just to come back here. How did you decide it needed a new bearing? Also what did that mean? It's normally termed bearings for the bottom end. As you went in for a clutch cylinder, how did you get from there to an engine refresh? And my point is wondering whether he had you over from the start?To cut a long story short, I eventually agreed that the bottom end needed a new bearing and "while you're at it" we may as well do an engine re-build.
As for your approach, have you visited again to ask for your car back, or just messaged? If the latter, if you go and see him and try a pleasant chat, you can scout to see whether turning up with a trailer and a couple of mates to help load is likely to succeed.
Otherwise if you have a documented refusal to do the work or give the ca back, get an injunction? Not sure that is even a thing!
BertBert said:
JohnnyUK said:
Hi All
To cut a long story short, I eventually agreed that the bottom end needed a new bearing and "while you're at it" we may as well do an engine re-build.
Just to come back here. How did you decide it needed a new bearing? Also what did that mean? It's normally termed bearings for the bottom end. As you went in for a clutch cylinder, how did you get from there to an engine refresh? And my point is wondering whether he had you over from the start?To cut a long story short, I eventually agreed that the bottom end needed a new bearing and "while you're at it" we may as well do an engine re-build.
As for your approach, have you visited again to ask for your car back, or just messaged? If the latter, if you go and see him and try a pleasant chat, you can scout to see whether turning up with a trailer and a couple of mates to help load is likely to succeed.
Otherwise if you have a documented refusal to do the work or give the ca back, get an injunction? Not sure that is even a thing!
You need to physically see your car ASAP, and if possible identify if any parts might be missing (tricky with engines). Then see what condition it's in - ideally you want it to be able to be rolled onto a transporter, but you need to check before hiring one.
Maybe have a notepad with you with the VIN and engine #s written down, just-in-case (this is probably unnecessary, but in a worst-case scenario would be good to have to hand).
Also take a camera - he'll probably kick off, but photos of what state it's in there and then would be a good record if you and he ARE able to come to an agreement for you to take it away. e.g. "You clearly don't want the work anymore. I want my car back. I'll give you £x-hundred to take it away in its current condition with all the parts I supplied" (doesn't sound like that'll work, but he might be more amenable face-to-face and less of the hard-man)
Finally, take a friend. Not a hard man, but someone who will witness everything and provide you with some moral support if he does go off on one. A mechanic friend would be good - someone who'll keep quiet until he tries to fob you off with blatant lies.
Maybe have a notepad with you with the VIN and engine #s written down, just-in-case (this is probably unnecessary, but in a worst-case scenario would be good to have to hand).
Also take a camera - he'll probably kick off, but photos of what state it's in there and then would be a good record if you and he ARE able to come to an agreement for you to take it away. e.g. "You clearly don't want the work anymore. I want my car back. I'll give you £x-hundred to take it away in its current condition with all the parts I supplied" (doesn't sound like that'll work, but he might be more amenable face-to-face and less of the hard-man)
Finally, take a friend. Not a hard man, but someone who will witness everything and provide you with some moral support if he does go off on one. A mechanic friend would be good - someone who'll keep quiet until he tries to fob you off with blatant lies.
I don't understand what the mechanic has to gain here if he is shutting up shop and leaving the country anyway - clearly one of those people that are dedicated to being a PITA.
Where in the UK is the car OP?
Could we organise some friendly PHers to help load it on to the transport so the mechanic doesn't injur himself trying to do it single-handed?
Where in the UK is the car OP?
Could we organise some friendly PHers to help load it on to the transport so the mechanic doesn't injur himself trying to do it single-handed?
BrettMRC said:
I don't understand what the mechanic has to gain here if he is shutting up shop and leaving the country anyway - clearly one of those people that are dedicated to being a PITA.
He may be in a pretty bad way and certainly not able to sort out a financial mess. There was an example in the world of old Porsches where the specialist got into such a bad way that he took his own life leaving a horrendous mess for his customers behind.What has he got to gain by keeping a car he has no intention of doing any work on? Surely any money to him is better than none at all.
Has he come up with a price he is prepared to accept for you to just take the car away?
Have you offered him any payment, either for work done or just to get the car back?
Most people are open to a bit ofbribery financial incentive.
I realise that this isn't what you want and any price he comes up with will probably be completely fictitious and I also suspect that you won't get all the parts back. But this must be a starting point for both sides to come out of the whole sorry mess with something.
How much do you believe you owe him for work done or how much do you believe he owes you for work not done?
Has he come up with a price he is prepared to accept for you to just take the car away?
Have you offered him any payment, either for work done or just to get the car back?
Most people are open to a bit of
I realise that this isn't what you want and any price he comes up with will probably be completely fictitious and I also suspect that you won't get all the parts back. But this must be a starting point for both sides to come out of the whole sorry mess with something.
How much do you believe you owe him for work done or how much do you believe he owes you for work not done?
BrettMRC said:
I don't understand what the mechanic has to gain here if he is shutting up shop and leaving the country anyway - clearly one of those people that are dedicated to being a PITA.
Where in the UK is the car OP?
Could we organise some friendly PHers to help load it on to the transport so the mechanic doesn't injur himself trying to do it single-handed?
Get job..provide updatesWhere in the UK is the car OP?
Could we organise some friendly PHers to help load it on to the transport so the mechanic doesn't injur himself trying to do it single-handed?
Identify "issues" and get payment for the materials etc that are needed
Never buy the parts
Repeat above as required to build a pot of money
Stop paying rent and rates
if you're busy there's a surefire way to build up a good chunk of cash to do a runner with
Yellow Lizud said:
What has he got to gain by keeping a car he has no intention of doing any work on? Surely any money to him is better than none at all.
Has he come up with a price he is prepared to accept for you to just take the car away?
Have you offered him any payment, either for work done or just to get the car back?
Most people are open to a bit ofbribery financial incentive.
I realise that this isn't what you want and any price he comes up with will probably be completely fictitious and I also suspect that you won't get all the parts back. But this must be a starting point for both sides to come out of the whole sorry mess with something.
How much do you believe you owe him for work done or how much do you believe he owes you for work not done?
The problem is that he's totally lost the plot. I've offered to pay the (un-invoiced) labour charges when I collect the car. Has he come up with a price he is prepared to accept for you to just take the car away?
Have you offered him any payment, either for work done or just to get the car back?
Most people are open to a bit of
I realise that this isn't what you want and any price he comes up with will probably be completely fictitious and I also suspect that you won't get all the parts back. But this must be a starting point for both sides to come out of the whole sorry mess with something.
How much do you believe you owe him for work done or how much do you believe he owes you for work not done?
He's removed & dismantled the engine. The block, head and flywheel have been re-skimmed (so he says - which I've already paid for.)
So, the outstanding work is to re-build the engine with the new parts I have already paid for, re-install the engine and ancillaries and that's it.
JohnnyUK said:
Yellow Lizud said:
What has he got to gain by keeping a car he has no intention of doing any work on? Surely any money to him is better than none at all.
Has he come up with a price he is prepared to accept for you to just take the car away?
Have you offered him any payment, either for work done or just to get the car back?
Most people are open to a bit ofbribery financial incentive.
I realise that this isn't what you want and any price he comes up with will probably be completely fictitious and I also suspect that you won't get all the parts back. But this must be a starting point for both sides to come out of the whole sorry mess with something.
How much do you believe you owe him for work done or how much do you believe he owes you for work not done?
The problem is that he's totally lost the plot. I've offered to pay the (un-invoiced) labour charges when I collect the car. Has he come up with a price he is prepared to accept for you to just take the car away?
Have you offered him any payment, either for work done or just to get the car back?
Most people are open to a bit of
I realise that this isn't what you want and any price he comes up with will probably be completely fictitious and I also suspect that you won't get all the parts back. But this must be a starting point for both sides to come out of the whole sorry mess with something.
How much do you believe you owe him for work done or how much do you believe he owes you for work not done?
He's removed & dismantled the engine. The block, head and flywheel have been re-skimmed (so he says - which I've already paid for.)
So, the outstanding work is to re-build the engine with the new parts I have already paid for, re-install the engine and ancillaries and that's it.
JohnnyUK said:
He's removed & dismantled the engine. The block, head and flywheel have been re-skimmed (so he says - which I've already paid for.)
All of that should be easy to confirm through a visual inspection by someone experienced, right?Trouble here is the chap doesn't seem to want paying-off...that's what I don't currently get. Unless he's playing hardball to make you think you're backed into a corner and have no choice but to cough up a much larger sum.
Definitely visit. Definitely take some (calm, unthreatening, mechanically-savvy) support with you. Definitely take pictures for further evidence.
One final question - is this business a limited company or sole trader?
andburg said:
BrettMRC said:
I don't understand what the mechanic has to gain here if he is shutting up shop and leaving the country anyway - clearly one of those people that are dedicated to being a PITA.
Where in the UK is the car OP?
Could we organise some friendly PHers to help load it on to the transport so the mechanic doesn't injur himself trying to do it single-handed?
Get job..provide updatesWhere in the UK is the car OP?
Could we organise some friendly PHers to help load it on to the transport so the mechanic doesn't injur himself trying to do it single-handed?
Identify "issues" and get payment for the materials etc that are needed
Never buy the parts
Repeat above as required to build a pot of money
Stop paying rent and rates
if you're busy there's a surefire way to build up a good chunk of cash to do a runner with
JohnnyUK said:
Yes, I was stupid buying the parts as we went along - I thought I was supporting a local business - I'll never be that altruistic again.
I don't think it was particularly altruistic at all. Many of these businesses being one man bands don't have the cash flow to just be paid on completion, so you end up with some form of stage payments. One needs to visit on a regular basis and see the progress that is being paid for in my view.JohnnyUK said:
havoc said:
JohnnyUK said:
He's removed & dismantled the engine. The block, head and flywheel have been re-skimmed (so he says - which I've already paid for.)
One final question - is this business a limited company or sole trader?MustangGT said:
JohnnyUK said:
havoc said:
JohnnyUK said:
He's removed & dismantled the engine. The block, head and flywheel have been re-skimmed (so he says - which I've already paid for.)
One final question - is this business a limited company or sole trader?My concern would be that he has cash flow issues, and that the cash you’ve given him has gone but not wholly on parts or labour for your car. He’s playing silly buggers since he knows he can’t show you the physical progress on your car or return to you the parts you’ve paid for since neither exist to the extent they should, and he doesn’t have the cash to refund you.
Edited by djohnson on Monday 3rd April 17:03
djohnson said:
My concern would be that he has cash flow issues, and that the cash you’ve given him has gone but not wholly on parts or labour for your car. He’s playing silly buggers since he knows he can’t show you the physical progress on your car or return to you the parts you’ve paid for since neither exist to the extent they should, and he doesn’t have the cash to refund you.
I think you're spot on - the accounts submitted recently show debts of £200k and he owes his landlord £17k.Edited by djohnson on Monday 3rd April 17:03
He has sold the lifts in the garage to the landlord today as part payment.
When it's all done & dusted, I'll share the screen shots of the WhatsApp conversations....
My suggestion would be to stop playing nice now, try to get some sort of legal judgement ASAP*, and send the bailiffs in.
The minute someone else does that, he winds the company up and no-one gets anything**. You'd have to prove that the car parts still in the
business (if any) were from your car, so you could end up with a car minus the engine (and any other bits removed for any reason).
Alternative option may well be to rock up with a trailer and with a couple of 'heavies' and offer to do him a deal there and then (for cash if you feel so inclined, as long as you get everything back there and then). By all means try the nice, polite approach suggested above first, but it all depends how close you think the business is to collapse - time could be of the essence for you.
* IANAL and don't know how long that could take, however.
** Chances are any unsecured creditors will get somewhere between nothing and pennies. Plus the process could take months to sort out, and anything on-premises without clear title (see my comments above about engine # and VIN #) will be held until the process is finished, or until the administrators see a good deal to sell any clearly-unencumbered assets off.
The minute someone else does that, he winds the company up and no-one gets anything**. You'd have to prove that the car parts still in the
business (if any) were from your car, so you could end up with a car minus the engine (and any other bits removed for any reason).
Alternative option may well be to rock up with a trailer and with a couple of 'heavies' and offer to do him a deal there and then (for cash if you feel so inclined, as long as you get everything back there and then). By all means try the nice, polite approach suggested above first, but it all depends how close you think the business is to collapse - time could be of the essence for you.
* IANAL and don't know how long that could take, however.
** Chances are any unsecured creditors will get somewhere between nothing and pennies. Plus the process could take months to sort out, and anything on-premises without clear title (see my comments above about engine # and VIN #) will be held until the process is finished, or until the administrators see a good deal to sell any clearly-unencumbered assets off.
JohnnyUK said:
I think you're spot on - the accounts submitted recently show debts of £200k and he owes his landlord £17k.
He has sold the lifts in the garage to the landlord today as part payment.
When it's all done & dusted, I'll share the screen shots of the WhatsApp conversations....
Just slightly curious about why the LL is sharing this info with youHe has sold the lifts in the garage to the landlord today as part payment.
When it's all done & dusted, I'll share the screen shots of the WhatsApp conversations....
BertBert said:
Just slightly curious about why the LL is sharing this info with you
LL wants him out, but wants someone else to do the dirty work, perhaps?LL probably has the most to lose if the garage 'owner' has a fit of pique and leaves the place trashed. Or maybe the owner really is unhinged?
...or maybe as simple as the LL is just fed up of the chap and wanted the change to have a whinge with someone in a similar boat?
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