Driving through an X on a smart Motorway

[BikeBikeBIke]

I got caught up in the carnage on the M27 this morning.

Dozens of cars were driving in the closed lanes passing multiple X signs on the gantries.

I thought that was an offence punishable with an FPN and google says I'm correct.

I didn't see any camera flashes. Are those X signs typically enforced? Seems to me a hundreds of drivers will be (rightly) getting multiple FPNs and potentially totting up bans if they passed several gantries.

[CraigyMc]

BikeBikeBIke said:

I got caught up in the carnage on the M27 this morning.

Dozens of cars were driving in the closed lanes passing multiple X signs on the gantries.

I thought that was an offence punishable with an FPN and google says I'm correct.

I didn't see any camera flashes. Are those X signs typically enforced? Seems to me a hundreds of drivers will be (rightly) getting multiple FPNs and potentially totting up bans if they passed several gantries.

--> https://nationalhighways.co.uk/article/don-t-ignor...

Probably hasn't been enforced yet, usually that sort of thing would come in with a new camera being certified.

[E-bmw]

BikeBikeBIke said:

I got caught up in the carnage on the M27 this morning.

Dozens of cars were driving in the closed lanes passing multiple X signs on the gantries.

I thought that was an offence punishable with an FPN and google says I'm correct.

I didn't see any camera flashes. Are those X signs typically enforced? Seems to me a hundreds of drivers will be (rightly) getting multiple FPNs and potentially totting up bans if they passed several gantries.

They aren't always policed by cameras that flash.

Most commonly (I believe) by CCTV cameras, could be wrong, but yes you are correct it is an offence & likely they will all get a letter in the post.

[119]

And this is the problem.

It’s not like it hasnt been closed for nearly 24 hours.

[GasEngineer]

BikeBikeBIke said:

.. and potentially totting up bans if they passed several gantries.

That's an interesting question. So at 3 points per red X, would passing 4 be a totting up ban, or is it all one offence at 3 points?

[BertBert]

GasEngineer said:

That's an interesting question. So at 3 points per red X, would passing 4 be a totting up ban, or is it all one offence at 3 points?

Depends on how the legislation is framed, but it feels likely that the offence is driving in a closed lane rather than driving through a red X. So that would be one offence.

However a bit of googling shows "an offence under section 36(1) of the Road Traffic Act 1988 consisting in the failure to comply with an indication given by a light signal that vehicular traffic is not to proceed and/or an offence under section 36(1) of that Act consisting in the failure to comply with an indication given by a light signal to vehicular traffic not to enter, or proceed in, a traffic lane."

So does going through 3 Xs mean failing to comply 3 times? Quite possibly I would think.

[silverfoxcc]

Saw some sap get lit up on the M3 the other week, Everyone shifting into L2 Chappy still cruises passed a red X in L1

Smile!!!

[richhead]

having been broken down on a smart motorway, i pulled into what would have been the hard shoulder, and got out the truck as fast as i could, the amount of people who nearly rammed into the back of it was unreal, so anyone ignoring a red x needs deaaling with , i was driving a truck aswell, so not hard to see, i went up the embancment and waited for the tyre fitter, he said hes seen some amazing things on smart motrways and is thinking of changing jobs because of the danger , i know i wouldnt want to do it.
Never had a visit from a police car or even a womble in the few hours i was there aswell, and i was parked right under a camera

[BikeBikeBIke]

richhead said:

having been broken down on a smart motorway, i pulled into what would have been the hard shoulder, and got out the truck as fast as i could, the amount of people who nearly rammed into the back of it was unreal, so anyone ignoring a red x needs deaaling with , i was driving a truck aswell, so not hard to see, i went up the embancment and waited for the tyre fitter, he said hes seen some amazing things on smart motrways and is thinking of changing jobs because of the danger , i know i wouldnt want to do it.
Never had a visit from a police car or even a womble in the few hours i was there aswell, and i was parked right under a camera

Smart motorways are lethal and respect for the X's is critical to try to make them work to some degree, but in this case it was safe as houses the powers that be were just using the Xs to stop people zip merging at the cones a few miles on which is what all the 'overtakers' were doing. The only thing stopping me doing in the same was fear of FPNs, plus the general rudeness of queue jumping - the massive number of cars going to the front effective meant I was stationary. (But I won't be banned and I suspect some of them might.)

Edited by BikeBikeBIke on Thursday 22 February 14:16

[Desiderata]

Sorry, but how can you possibly know in advance why the redX is up? Maybe some traffic controllers do abuse them and put them on for dubious reasons, but you've no way of knowing that before you pass the all clear at the end of the hazard.

[BikeBikeBIke]

Desiderata said:

Sorry, but how can you possibly know in advance why the redX is up? Maybe some traffic controllers do abuse them and put them on for dubious reasons, but you've no way of knowing that before you pass the all clear at the end of the hazard.

I didn't know in advance. I'm recounting this afterwards.

[119]

Desiderata said:

Sorry, but how can you possibly know in advance why the redX is up? Maybe some traffic controllers do abuse them and put them on for dubious reasons, but you've no way of knowing that before you pass the all clear at the end of the hazard.

Yeah well of course they do it for sts and giggles sometimes.

[chopper602]

Red X's are not just on SMART motorways, they are right across the network.

They do have enforcement cameras and they take the front of the vehicle ONLY when it has passed through a red signal. They are active on the M62 SMART motorway, but are spreading across the network.

[Vasco]

BertBert said:

Depends on how the legislation is framed, but it feels likely that the offence is driving in a closed lane rather than driving through a red X. So that would be one offence.

However a bit of googling shows "an offence under section 36(1) of the Road Traffic Act 1988 consisting in the failure to comply with an indication given by a light signal that vehicular traffic is not to proceed and/or an offence under section 36(1) of that Act consisting in the failure to comply with an indication given by a light signal to vehicular traffic not to enter, or proceed in, a traffic lane."

So does going through 3 Xs mean failing to comply 3 times? Quite possibly I would think.

Good, I hope so.

We all need to improve the (currently terrible) standard of driving on motorways - and just about all roads across the country.

[No ideas for a name]

Vasco said:

Good, I hope so.

We all need to improve the (currently terrible) standard of driving on motorways - and just about all roads across the country.

Almost everyone knows the rules, but it would seem many then just ignore them.
What we need to see, very well publicised are headlines like for instance "684 drivers fined for ignoring red X's, along with 232 with bans".

Otherwise some people will just carry on as the think they won't be caught.

[covboy]

BikeBikeBIke said:

Seems to me a hundreds of drivers will be (rightly) getting multiple FPNs and potentially totting up bans if they passed several gantries.

Not sure about that Doesn't it count as a single journey, like multiple speeding offnces on the same stretch of road on a single journey ?

[BikeBikeBIke]

No ideas for a name said:

Vasco said:

Good, I hope so.

We all need to improve the (currently terrible) standard of driving on motorways - and just about all roads across the country.

Almost everyone knows the rules, but it would seem many then just ignore them.
What we need to see, very well publicised are headlines like for instance "684 drivers fined for ignoring red X's, along with 232 with bans".

Otherwise some people will just carry on as the think they won't be caught.

That can't be right, if they know it's illegal they'll must also know they'll be caught. Unless they know something I don't know and there's no enforcement of Red X's on the M27?

[BikeBikeBIke]

covboy said:

Not sure about that Doesn't it count as a single journey, like multiple speeding offnces on the same stretch of road on a single journey ?

25 years ago "multiple speeding offences on the same stretch of road on a single journey" was not routinely considered a single offence by the courts. Sometimes it was, sometimes it wasn't. DAMHIKIJDOK.

[No ideas for a name]

BikeBikeBIke said:

No ideas for a name said:

Vasco said:

Good, I hope so.

We all need to improve the (currently terrible) standard of driving on motorways - and just about all roads across the country.

Almost everyone knows the rules, but it would seem many then just ignore them.
What we need to see, very well publicised are headlines like for instance "684 drivers fined for ignoring red X's, along with 232 with bans".

Otherwise some people will just carry on as the think they won't be caught.

That can't be right, if they know it's illegal they'll must also know they'll be caught. Unless they know something I don't know and there's no enforcement of Red X's on the M27?

Maybe that wasn't clear as to what I meant.
The point is, no one thinks it is enforced. They know it is wrong but expect to get away with it.

The publicity is needed to show people that they can't get away with it... without that there is no effect on the general population.

[otolith]

When stuck in standing traffic in the open lanes with people still flying down the closed ones, it would be pleasing to think that they are getting penalties and that one is not merely being a mug.