Euro NCAP to mark down cars relying on touchscreens
Discussion
Mr Tidy said:
Well it took them long enough. 
If only they could also downgrade cars that have DRLs with no lights on at the rear, or that don't have auto-lights - they're an accident waiting to happen when it's dark!
And in the daylight too, section of motorway I use is driving up hill straight into the rising sun so anything that improves the visibility of the car in front is most welcome!If only they could also downgrade cars that have DRLs with no lights on at the rear, or that don't have auto-lights - they're an accident waiting to happen when it's dark!
This is only a good thing.
I really don't know how things have become so s
t nowadays. manufacturers have spent decades designing interiors to make them ergonomic and easy to use on the fly.
If a button doesn't work, you replace the button. what you doing to do when a £400 screen fails? haptic feedback is not a good replacement for a real button/switch.
I really don't know how things have become so s
t nowadays. manufacturers have spent decades designing interiors to make them ergonomic and easy to use on the fly.If a button doesn't work, you replace the button. what you doing to do when a £400 screen fails? haptic feedback is not a good replacement for a real button/switch.
ambuletz said:
This is only a good thing.
I really don't know how things have become so st nowadays. manufacturers have spent decades designing interiors to make them ergonomic and easy to use on the fly.
If a button doesn't work, you replace the button. what you doing to do when a £400 screen fails? haptic feedback is not a good replacement for a real button/switch.
I get the feeling that they positively want you to buy another new one when anything vaguely major fails out of warranty. I really don't know how things have become so s
t nowadays. manufacturers have spent decades designing interiors to make them ergonomic and easy to use on the fly.If a button doesn't work, you replace the button. what you doing to do when a £400 screen fails? haptic feedback is not a good replacement for a real button/switch.
I am not sure that the manufacturers are, in the main, the slightest bit interested in cars lasting 20 or 30 years.
Their business model is about selling new cars.
You could say that this is as it has been for as long as all of us have been driving.
On the other hand, the rust issues we suffered up to the 1980s are largely a thing of the past now, and for a good while from say the mid 80s until early this century, the durability of cars like Volvos was seen as a positive thing.
But we seem to be slipping back into a throw away mindset again, with cars made now far too complicated for the owner to fix on his driveway.
I'm an old fart (ask my wife for confirmation of this
) and I drive nothing newer than 2005 vintage, so I guess you could say that this would be my attitude. I prefer cars where you can actually see the engine, which don't have 48 nanny devices I don't need, where things can be understood and fixed without thousands of pounds of electronic devices and special tools.But I do also run a company car fleet which is exclusively EV and PHEV cars, so have some awareness of the repair costs and complexities. When they work faultlessly they are great. But when they don't, main dealers don't seem to have a clue about anything except increasing the bill.
Also, we had a Tesla Model 3 blow two tyres on potholes last week. Over £800 for the two new tyres.
When did they get so ridiculously expensive? I am looking for two for my 2005 X Trail, but am not expecting to pay more than £200.
mr rusty said:
I drive a recent Volvo. Most things that aren't on the steering wheel or on the stalks can be accessed by voice commands, and the things that don't react to voice you don't need to change on the move anyway. What's the big deal.
How is the voice control on that? Did you have to learn key words and phrases or is it properly intuitive?My experiences of voice control on cars is that they've all been as pedantic as a Boulogne shopkeeper in terms of what they'll understand ("UNE croissant?! Qu'est-ce qu'UNE croissant?!"). Having to learn specific commands is the spoken equivalent of the Palm devices in the early 2000s where you had to learn to write in a particular way for it to recognise handwriting.
donkmeister said:
mr rusty said:
I drive a recent Volvo. Most things that aren't on the steering wheel or on the stalks can be accessed by voice commands, and the things that don't react to voice you don't need to change on the move anyway. What's the big deal.
How is the voice control on that? Did you have to learn key words and phrases or is it properly intuitive?My experiences of voice control on cars is that they've all been as pedantic as a Boulogne shopkeeper in terms of what they'll understand ("UNE croissant?! Qu'est-ce qu'UNE croissant?!"). Having to learn specific commands is the spoken equivalent of the Palm devices in the early 2000s where you had to learn to write in a particular way for it to recognise handwriting.
Say something the wrong way to Erin Dawes, and you get something incoming between a frosty silence, a slap and a frying pan. At least the car just ignores you or says the motoring version of "pardon?" in Swedish or Korean..
EU_Foreigner said:
VAG has demist as buttons so you can quickly get rid of that, whilst on the Tesla that is on the screen.
Fair, demist is certainly something you might want to turn on in a hurry while on the move.Our Volvo V60 II isn't too bad for it, but the cabin temperature adjustment and heated seat/wheel control is on the screen, which is a shame.
I does also prevent you using a lot of the settings in the screen while moving, which for things like driver profile settings and read the user manual has to be a no brainer.
119 said:
"Indicators, hazard warning lights, windscreen wipers, horn, and SOS features will have to be controlled by proper switches in order for cars to be granted Euro NCAP’s coveted five star safety rating."
I haven't seen a car where any of these tasks are directly performed via a screen?
I haven't seen a car where any of these tasks are directly performed via a screen?
FMOB said:
NCAP Leading from behind.
Bit late to be saying this as the horse has well and truly bolted, buttons are already gone, cost savings spent elsewhere.
These statements appear contradictory to me! Bit late to be saying this as the horse has well and truly bolted, buttons are already gone, cost savings spent elsewhere.
Mr E said:
I dislike some of the functionality buried in screen menus on Teslas
Indicators are on the stalk or on the steering wheel on the most recent cars.
Wipers are on the stalk and adjusted via steering wheel multifunction. Unsure where there are on the latest update.
Horn is on the wheel.
Not clear what an “sos” feature is, guess it’s specced somewhere.
It’s the lesser used functions that can be a bit of a fiddle. I’m 18k in and I couldn’t tell you right now how to turn the fogs on. I guess it’s in the lighting augment, but I’d need to take eyes off the road to do it.
Indicators are on the wheel in the new Model 3 which I dislike. fatboy b said:
That’s Tesla fked then 
Hazards are in on a specific button. ked then Indicators are on the stalk or on the steering wheel on the most recent cars.
Wipers are on the stalk and adjusted via steering wheel multifunction. Unsure where there are on the latest update.
Horn is on the wheel.
Not clear what an “sos” feature is, guess it’s specced somewhere.
It’s the lesser used functions that can be a bit of a fiddle. I’m 18k in and I couldn’t tell you right now how to turn the fogs on. I guess it’s in the lighting augment, but I’d need to take eyes off the road to do it.
Fogs are in the car menu next to the auto lights but if you push the indicator forward you get a mini menu on the display just like the wipers one that allows you to put the fogs on.
Wipers are also on the wheel in the new Model 3. I think it is a tap on the button to single wipe and a hold for wash.
IMO if you need an SOS feature then you'll probably not be in a state to find and use a button. I believe cars will automatically call the SOS number when in an accident.
Most of the things I'd need to look in the menus are accesible with voice and TBH I never change climate control when driving and if I needed to I'd just say "Turn climate to xx", "defog windscreen" or "turn the heated seat on"
James6112 said:
Hammersia said:
Euro NCAP wants more pushbuttons for major functions, otherwise manufacturers will lose points:
https://www.hagerty.com/media/news/car-makers-must...
Why care (unless the insurance goes up)https://www.hagerty.com/media/news/car-makers-must...
A lot of the stuff that increases the points is an annoyance, a box ticking exercise.
In the past they were relavent, not now .
Edited by James6112 on Monday 4th March 18:32
eldar said:
James6112 said:
Hammersia said:
Euro NCAP wants more pushbuttons for major functions, otherwise manufacturers will lose points:
https://www.hagerty.com/media/news/car-makers-must...
Why care (unless the insurance goes up)https://www.hagerty.com/media/news/car-makers-must...
A lot of the stuff that increases the points is an annoyance, a box ticking exercise.
In the past they were relavent, not now .
Edited by James6112 on Monday 4th March 18:32
Pica-Pica said:
119 said:
Is lane assist compulsory on new cars these days?
YesI had a courtesy car last year, an electric Zoe. Once on the A3 I overtook a line of traffic and gently eased back into lane 1. Except I thought I had had a front wheel blow out.
The steering was fighting me and took me by surprise. It was only when I got it back to the dealers that I was told that it had lane assist.
What a fekin stupid idea.
croyde said:
I bought a new car a few weeks ago and thankfully it doesn't have lane assist or stop/go.
I had a courtesy car last year, an electric Zoe. Once on the A3 I overtook a line of traffic and gently eased back into lane 1. Except I thought I had had a front wheel blow out.
The steering was fighting me and took me by surprise. It was only when I got it back to the dealers that I was told that it had lane assist.
What a fekin stupid idea.
Just wait for the more aggressive Emergency Lane-Keeping Assist which really takes over steering control I had a courtesy car last year, an electric Zoe. Once on the A3 I overtook a line of traffic and gently eased back into lane 1. Except I thought I had had a front wheel blow out.
The steering was fighting me and took me by surprise. It was only when I got it back to the dealers that I was told that it had lane assist.
What a fekin stupid idea.
Not sure if the driver can turn it off...
mr rusty said:
I drive a recent Volvo. Most things that aren't on the steering wheel or on the stalks can be accessed by voice commands, and the things that don't react to voice you don't need to change on the move anyway. What's the big deal.
Try voice commands when the kids are screaming in the back seat. Or when your wife is screaming at you. Or when you're having a conversation, or when you've just had a tooth out and your mouth is numb, or you don't speak the language, or you have a speech impediment, or you can't speak at all due to a laryngectomy or some other surgery.I hate touch screens and won't buy a car where I can't control the major functions with physical switches, knobs and buttons. That's because I have very poor coordination and find hitting a virtual button on a screen almost impossible in a moving car.
croyde said:
Pica-Pica said:
119 said:
Is lane assist compulsory on new cars these days?
YesI had a courtesy car last year, an electric Zoe. Once on the A3 I overtook a line of traffic and gently eased back into lane 1. Except I thought I had had a front wheel blow out.
The steering was fighting me and took me by surprise. It was only when I got it back to the dealers that I was told that it had lane assist.
What a fekin stupid idea.
That car must have been registered before 2022
Lane assist is turned off when you indicate. But like you, I don’t always wish to indicate when changing lanes, that is my decision as to whether it is needed, and I certainly don’t want to always indicate when I move back into a left lane after overtaking.
The thing is, everyone you speak to seems to prefer buttons and knobs, yet OEMs are constantly ditching them. Are the cost savings really so great?
I hate touch screen even on in car entertainment. One of our cars has touch screen for volume and with nothing to guide your finger to the right spot it always takes a few attempts to hit it whilst keeping your eyes on the road. Horrible UX.
I hate touch screen even on in car entertainment. One of our cars has touch screen for volume and with nothing to guide your finger to the right spot it always takes a few attempts to hit it whilst keeping your eyes on the road. Horrible UX.
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