Car hit while parked - what happens if Cat B?
Discussion
Steve H said:
Lots of very useful info
Thanks for the detailed and knowledgeable reply! Yes, I expect the car would be written off based on new OEM parts not existing and secondhand being scarce. This isn't the end of the world for me, I've no plans to sell it and would definitely be wanting to repair it with the payout. (As long as it does indeed get a Cat N/S)
If they try to Cat B it (again, unlikely but I have heard horror stories of lightly damaged older cars getting a Cat B) but I don't accept this, is there anything that can be done to reduce the severity of the category? I guess if push came to shove I could withdraw the claim but then I really wouldn't be very hopeful of getting any cash out of the other driver!
The car is valued (not as an agreed value, but it is written on my policy) at £7k and while there are no exact matches for sale, any Civic with VTi in the model name is £6k+ on Ebay.
I know I've left it way longer than I should've if I initiate a claim, but I've pretty much been bullied into not doing - other driver has been quite aggressive about the 'fact' that it'll go to Copart and never be seen again etc. Even tried to tell me I'm probably not insured for being on a work car park (this was the red flag that made me realise he was talking b
ks) The more I think about it all, the more I regret not just initiating a claim straight away, because now I'm a bit more clued up I've realised how much I've been manipulated. It happened a couple of weeks ago now (there has been a LOT of back and forth between then and now, me constantly telling him I want to go through insurance, and him using every trick in the book to talk me out of it and make me feel like the bad guy in the situation), is this likely to mean his insurance company washes their hands of it all? I guess it'll put him in a bit of hot water with his insurance company, part of me thinks "not my problem" and another part makes me feel guilty about screwing him over.
Either way, lesson learned - don't be walked all over when thrust into a situation completely out of your control!
OutInTheShed said:
It's possible that an assessor will categorise it as a 'breaker'.
It doesn't take much, certain structural damage which raises the risk of the car never being sound again.
If anything is out of alignment in a way that's perceived as dififcult to fix.
On an old car, corrosion can complicate things.
To see it from the assessors POV, does he want that car back on the road with his name chalked against it?
That is a bit of a concern, there is some rust on the chassis leg near the damage, it's ugly but rock solid (stabbing at it with a screwdriver it shows no sign of softness etc)It doesn't take much, certain structural damage which raises the risk of the car never being sound again.
If anything is out of alignment in a way that's perceived as dififcult to fix.
On an old car, corrosion can complicate things.
To see it from the assessors POV, does he want that car back on the road with his name chalked against it?
I'm convinced the chassis leg hasn't moved - ideally need to bolt up a replacement crash bar to prove such, but obviously don't want to go messing with the car before it's assessed
BertBert said:
Who's assessing it?
Based on my most recent experiences nobody! Admiral decided my nephews car was a Cat S based on photos he sent them from his phone (it was Cat N at worst) and that mine was a Cat N based on an estimate prepared by a bodyshop they had recommended.
All it needed was a bumper cover that BMW could supply in primer for £650, but the "estimate" ended up at over £2K after some creative padding.
Jaaack said:
If they try to Cat B it (again, unlikely but I have heard horror stories of lightly damaged older cars getting a Cat B) but I don't accept this, is there anything that can be done to reduce the severity of the category? I guess if push came to shove I could withdraw the claim but then I really wouldn't be very hopeful of getting any cash out of the other driver!
It happened a couple of weeks ago now (there has been a LOT of back and forth between then and now, me constantly telling him I want to go through insurance, and him using every trick in the book to talk me out of it and make me feel like the bad guy in the situation), is this likely to mean his insurance company washes their hands of it all? I guess it'll put him in a bit of hot water with his insurance company, part of me thinks "not my problem" and another part makes me feel guilty about screwing him over.
You aren’t screwing anyone over. He crashed into your car and you are just trying to get the situation sorted. It happened a couple of weeks ago now (there has been a LOT of back and forth between then and now, me constantly telling him I want to go through insurance, and him using every trick in the book to talk me out of it and make me feel like the bad guy in the situation), is this likely to mean his insurance company washes their hands of it all? I guess it'll put him in a bit of hot water with his insurance company, part of me thinks "not my problem" and another part makes me feel guilty about screwing him over.
And the insurance company cannot wash their hands of it all. As long as you can show with certainty that this guy is responsible for the damage then ultimately you can sue him and his insurance has to cover that (it won’t come to that but you get the idea).
It seems very unlikely that it would go catB but if they suggested that, you don’t withdraw the claim, you argue! It could be you would need a report doing to give a different view etc but usually just talking sense about the lack of damage while making it clear that you will not be making anything easy for them does the trick.
Always remember that accepting how the other side wants this to go isn’t going to get it sorted, that’s how you got off track in the first place.
If you are satisfied with the cash amount that you agreed with the guy then tell him that it all needs paying now. It’s none of his business whether you spend it on fixing the car or a trip to Bermuda, he agreed to compensate you for the damage and it’s time to stump up. His alternative is you go the official route which I gather doesn’t suit him as much but can still work ok for you.
You need to push this in the direction that you want it to go!
It might be worthwhile phoning your insurance company and have a chat with them. They can explain how it might be assessed. I'm thinking that you could take the car to the bodyshop that your insurance company use and see if they will agree that the car is not Cat A/B. That will then give you added weight when putting in a claim with your insurers.
Also, if you don't go with the insurance company, then get a legal agreement drawn up where the other guy admits liability and the payment is agreed. Then if he doesn't pay you can take him to the small claims court.
Also, if you don't go with the insurance company, then get a legal agreement drawn up where the other guy admits liability and the payment is agreed. Then if he doesn't pay you can take him to the small claims court.
Cat B is about the type of damage not the value of fixing it, essentially Cat N is for uneconomical to repair, Cat S structural damage not economical to repair, Cat B not SAFE to repair.
anyone being this much or an arse about a problem they caused isn't worth trying to appease, send him the money back and claim through his insurance.
anyone being this much or an arse about a problem they caused isn't worth trying to appease, send him the money back and claim through his insurance.
Steve H said:
You aren’t screwing anyone over. He crashed into your car and you are just trying to get the situation sorted.
And the insurance company cannot wash their hands of it all. As long as you can show with certainty that this guy is responsible for the damage then ultimately you can sue him and his insurance has to cover that (it won’t come to that but you get the idea).
It seems very unlikely that it would go catB but if they suggested that, you don’t withdraw the claim, you argue! It could be you would need a report doing to give a different view etc but usually just talking sense about the lack of damage while making it clear that you will not be making anything easy for them does the trick.
Always remember that accepting how the other side wants this to go isn’t going to get it sorted, that’s how you got off track in the first place.
If you are satisfied with the cash amount that you agreed with the guy then tell him that it all needs paying now. It’s none of his business whether you spend it on fixing the car or a trip to Bermuda, he agreed to compensate you for the damage and it’s time to stump up. His alternative is you go the official route which I gather doesn’t suit him as much but can still work ok for you.
You need to push this in the direction that you want it to go!
Thanks again! How do I go about initiating the claim without involving my own insurance company? (I've read online that it's better for your NCB to claim directly from the other driver's without involving my own). When I asked him for his insurance company the other week he wouldn't tell me and carried on trying to talk me out of it. And the insurance company cannot wash their hands of it all. As long as you can show with certainty that this guy is responsible for the damage then ultimately you can sue him and his insurance has to cover that (it won’t come to that but you get the idea).
It seems very unlikely that it would go catB but if they suggested that, you don’t withdraw the claim, you argue! It could be you would need a report doing to give a different view etc but usually just talking sense about the lack of damage while making it clear that you will not be making anything easy for them does the trick.
Always remember that accepting how the other side wants this to go isn’t going to get it sorted, that’s how you got off track in the first place.
If you are satisfied with the cash amount that you agreed with the guy then tell him that it all needs paying now. It’s none of his business whether you spend it on fixing the car or a trip to Bermuda, he agreed to compensate you for the damage and it’s time to stump up. His alternative is you go the official route which I gather doesn’t suit him as much but can still work ok for you.
You need to push this in the direction that you want it to go!
Yeah, him wanting to come and pick the car up with me is what's really rubbing me up the wrong way! He did agree that the roof would be painted as part of the whole deal to avoid insurance, but I've got a nagging feeling he's going to say he's not happy with the work and try to squirm his way out of paying the final £100 plus whatever I end up paying for a bumper (plus my time and fuel collecting!)
I guess ask him again for his insurer, and then if no luck speak to either my own insurer or an accident management service?
Tell him to pay the remaining amount he owes you for starters. Although what you have said there makes me wonder if there is an agreed amount still outstanding? An exact amount?
If there is then he needs to pay it. If not then you need to settle that with him, or head to insurance.
If he refuses to give you his details then I would consider involving your employer as it happened on their premises and you both work for them.
But all this stuff involves you being ready to cause some problems. If you aren’t then going to your own insurance is probably the best bet.
If there is then he needs to pay it. If not then you need to settle that with him, or head to insurance.
If he refuses to give you his details then I would consider involving your employer as it happened on their premises and you both work for them.
But all this stuff involves you being ready to cause some problems. If you aren’t then going to your own insurance is probably the best bet.
Steve H said:
Tell him to pay the remaining amount he owes you for starters. Although what you have said there makes me wonder if there is an agreed amount still outstanding? An exact amount?
If there is then he needs to pay it. If not then you need to settle that with him, or head to insurance.
If he refuses to give you his details then I would consider involving your employer as it happened on their premises and you both work for them.
But all this stuff involves you being ready to cause some problems. If you aren’t then going to your own insurance is probably the best bet.
Long story short, he wanted him and his mate to repair it. I obviously wasn't happy with this. He kept insisting on coming round to my house to pick up a spare bumper I have (I told him I had one initially, but upon digging it out it's not in very good condition and I don't want to use it). Even then he was still saying hed be round to pick up the bumper and take it away to paint. I told him in no uncertain terms not to. Days of phone calls back and forth, him guilt tripping me and manipulating me not to go through insurance, and we arrived at a conclusion that I'd get a quote, which would include painting the roof as an incentive not to claim.If there is then he needs to pay it. If not then you need to settle that with him, or head to insurance.
If he refuses to give you his details then I would consider involving your employer as it happened on their premises and you both work for them.
But all this stuff involves you being ready to cause some problems. If you aren’t then going to your own insurance is probably the best bet.
In a bit of a panic (with him still saying he could come pick the no-good bumper up) I spoke to a work colleague who does bodywork on the side, he (without seeing the car physically) arrived at £600 for the paint all in, but I've still got to find a bumper. The splitter is creased and I'm not sure if it's repairable so I might need to find one of those too, at a cost of £200ish. The 'quote' is all word of mouth and he can't paint it for 6 weeks anyway. Again, I rushed into this as he was trying to insist on repairing it himself and I obviously didn't want him to.
Other driver sent me £300 on Thursday (after agreeing to do it Monday) and a further £200 when I pressed him to send the full amount. So to summarise I'm £100 short of the 'quote', still need to find a bumper, headlight washer jet and possibly splitter, although the 'quote' does include the roof of course. And in his words, it'll be settled "when I know it's right, when we, I underline we, collect" - direct quote from texts.
I know it'd work out best financially for me if my car gets Cat N'd, I get paid out for a fair value and get to keep the salvage, and he wouldn't pay his excess (which I know is £500) unless he claimed for his own car too?
Whole situation is giving me a headache!
Tell him that you need the rest of the money so you can get everything settled. Estimate an amount for the parts you need and give him a total that you need, now please.
Or hand him his money back and start with the insurance.
The second option should pay a lot better but will be hassle and a likely cat rating on the car, I would recommend trying the first option as you are most of the way into it now anyway and will feel a lot better once it’s dealt with.
Or hand him his money back and start with the insurance.
The second option should pay a lot better but will be hassle and a likely cat rating on the car, I would recommend trying the first option as you are most of the way into it now anyway and will feel a lot better once it’s dealt with.
Just a little update;
Chased him up again on Thursday by text, no response after 48hrs, so returned the money I'd previously been sent and called my insurer. The number on their website actually put me through to an accident management company who've so far been great.
Car is to undergo a 'desktop assessment' after which a decision on whether they'll repair or write off will be made. I expect it'll be written off as I can't see a Honda dealer stocking anything for this car, let alone the super rare VTi-S front splitter which is cracked.
So far it seems to be no big deal that it's dragged on so long, or that money had changed hands - the operator did ask why I hadn't reported it immediately but accepted my completely honest answer with understanding, and no resistance.
So far I'm happy, MUCH less stressed, and able to let it be someone else's problem. Hopefully the rest of the process goes as smoothly as this initial stage!
Also - they were happy that the car doesn't need to be recovered and it stays on my drive until this mess is sorted, I was definitely worried about it ending up in Copart!
Chased him up again on Thursday by text, no response after 48hrs, so returned the money I'd previously been sent and called my insurer. The number on their website actually put me through to an accident management company who've so far been great.
Car is to undergo a 'desktop assessment' after which a decision on whether they'll repair or write off will be made. I expect it'll be written off as I can't see a Honda dealer stocking anything for this car, let alone the super rare VTi-S front splitter which is cracked.
So far it seems to be no big deal that it's dragged on so long, or that money had changed hands - the operator did ask why I hadn't reported it immediately but accepted my completely honest answer with understanding, and no resistance.
So far I'm happy, MUCH less stressed, and able to let it be someone else's problem. Hopefully the rest of the process goes as smoothly as this initial stage!
Also - they were happy that the car doesn't need to be recovered and it stays on my drive until this mess is sorted, I was definitely worried about it ending up in Copart!
BertBert said:
Well that seems a good turn of events, well done OP. I assume that your key criterion of not losing the car has taken a bit of a back seat now?
It's not the end of the world if it gets written off, provided it gets given a Cat N or S and I get a fair market value for it, and of course get to keep the salvage and get it repaired. There is no structural damage and I drove it home after it was hit. The Cat marker won't bother me too much, as long as any payout takes into account the fact that the car will be worth less.Fingers are firmly crossed for a good outcome!
Jaaack said:
It's not the end of the world if it gets written off, provided it gets given a Cat N or S and I get a fair market value for it, and of course get to keep the salvage and get it repaired. There is no structural damage and I drove it home after it was hit. The Cat marker won't bother me too much, as long as any payout takes into account the fact that the car will be worth less.
Fingers are firmly crossed for a good outcome!
Don't forget, you will get offered market value. The fact that you have "valued" the car at £7k is here nor there on a none agreed value policy.Fingers are firmly crossed for a good outcome!
Jaaack said:
Just a little update;
Chased him up again on Thursday by text, no response after 48hrs, so returned the money I'd previously been sent and called my insurer. The number on their website actually put me through to an accident management company who've so far been great.
Car is to undergo a 'desktop assessment' after which a decision on whether they'll repair or write off will be made. I expect it'll be written off as I can't see a Honda dealer stocking anything for this car, let alone the super rare VTi-S front splitter which is cracked.
So far it seems to be no big deal that it's dragged on so long, or that money had changed hands - the operator did ask why I hadn't reported it immediately but accepted my completely honest answer with understanding, and no resistance.
So far I'm happy, MUCH less stressed, and able to let it be someone else's problem. Hopefully the rest of the process goes as smoothly as this initial stage!
Also - they were happy that the car doesn't need to be recovered and it stays on my drive until this mess is sorted, I was definitely worried about it ending up in Copart!
A word to the wise, don't let them collect the car, unless you're willing to part with it. If it gets collected the chances are you'd end up paying hideous storage charges and even then it would come back worse than it left. Chased him up again on Thursday by text, no response after 48hrs, so returned the money I'd previously been sent and called my insurer. The number on their website actually put me through to an accident management company who've so far been great.
Car is to undergo a 'desktop assessment' after which a decision on whether they'll repair or write off will be made. I expect it'll be written off as I can't see a Honda dealer stocking anything for this car, let alone the super rare VTi-S front splitter which is cracked.
So far it seems to be no big deal that it's dragged on so long, or that money had changed hands - the operator did ask why I hadn't reported it immediately but accepted my completely honest answer with understanding, and no resistance.
So far I'm happy, MUCH less stressed, and able to let it be someone else's problem. Hopefully the rest of the process goes as smoothly as this initial stage!
Also - they were happy that the car doesn't need to be recovered and it stays on my drive until this mess is sorted, I was definitely worried about it ending up in Copart!
Jaaack said:
So far I'm happy, MUCH less stressed, and able to let it be someone else's problem. Hopefully the rest of the process goes as smoothly as this initial stage!
I’m glad you are happier and I hate to say this but it is not someone else’s problem, you are just dealing with someone else now. Look up a few posts to this -
Hopefully I am wrong and they will just offer a sensible number, keep us updated
OP for what it's worth and based purely on my limited personal experience ...... some years ago I managed to crash my car with no-one else involved and the insurance company assesed it as uneconomical to repair with structural damage ... what was then Cat C.
When they broke the news to me I was told that their standard procedure for retaining the salvage was that it was assessed being worth 21% of the pre-accident value - it was a fairly rare classic-ish car where some of the parts were rare/difficult to get hold of, but it all seemed to hinge on the pre-accident value rather than how difficult it was to get replacement parts.
What then took place was a discussion/argument as to what the pre-accident value was.
So my un-expert advice would be to start collecting evidence now to support the best pre-accident value you can come up with.
Best of luck.
When they broke the news to me I was told that their standard procedure for retaining the salvage was that it was assessed being worth 21% of the pre-accident value - it was a fairly rare classic-ish car where some of the parts were rare/difficult to get hold of, but it all seemed to hinge on the pre-accident value rather than how difficult it was to get replacement parts.
What then took place was a discussion/argument as to what the pre-accident value was.
So my un-expert advice would be to start collecting evidence now to support the best pre-accident value you can come up with.
Best of luck.
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