Farewell sweet clean license
Discussion
deeps said:
Ahh, they were in a vehicle. That makes things a bit clearer. Do you not know how to spot unmarked BiB?! It's not difficult. Well, hopefully it'll just be three points and a lesson learnt. If you're going to hoon USE THOSE MIRRORS!!
HW
the bit i am genuinly feeling bad about!!
fully marked up 5 series.
they said they were in a layby with a set speed trap, i don't know if they were obscured but i did not see them untill they were on the move.
i am worried that i did not see them, every time i drive something will make me think, "i could have done that better" or "i should have spotted that earlier"
this has got me thinking, but the officers words did reassure me.
unfortunately i do drive at relatively high speed, but i do not drive fast if you understand. I never push on because i am in a hurry or because i need to show off.
Hard luck KB, that's a cruel one.
You sound like a clued-up observant driver, so I'm sure you would have seen the fully marked plod car had it been simply parked in a lay-by. Perhaps they were in an entrance to a field or something? If that's the case it could have been any one of us caught, including HW
Was it a local road, ever seen plod there before?
Anyway, I hope it's no more than 3 points for you, and don't give up, we don't wanna lose all the sensible drivers to policy!
Sound like they were "basking" to coin my cousin's words (He say his patch are like basking sharks on their stretch of A1.... ist Durham .... They sit just out of view und observe... you were unlucky...
84 mph? Would not think this ist DD?
Was it heavy rain? Sudden heavier downpour? A 60 mph dual or a 70 mph dual? But in any case... DD will have to be proven ...und the officers will have to supply evidence that this standard fell far below that of competency. Since they do not say the driving was dangerous ... look on the brighter positive side. Ist more likely to be 3 points, standard fine - upped by costs.
WildCat said:
84 mph? Would not think this ist DD?
It's north of the border though - down here in sassenach territory it has already been established in Court that speeds much higher than 86 mph are not of themselves dangerous driving, we're talking of ~ 140 on a m-way and into three figures on a dc.
Paul at SafeSpeed is based in Scotland iirc and he might well know about relevant case law?
turbobloke said:
84 mph? Would not think this ist DD?
It's north of the border though - down here in sassenach territory it has already been established in Court that speeds much higher than 86 mph are not of themselves dangerous driving, we're talking of ~ 140 on a m-way and into three figures on a dc.
Paul at SafeSpeed is based in Scotland iirc and he might well know about relevant case law?
Ach.. ist different legal system.... but perhaps KB need to get some decent legal advice on matter. I forget ,,, did they not do a cop trainer on his way home.. he was at 120 mph as I recall... he got 3 month ban....
Cannot remember .. they were basking on motorway slip when he blat by. He'd been training at 120 mph all day... perhaps it seemed "normal" to him...
Occur in early 2004.... offence was in September 2003 - if memory serve correct...
But ist not the same as 84 mph....?
bryan35 said:
Jesus, the road I drive to work I've been clogging 90+ in a 60 almost everyday for the last 4 years. - bad old me.
The trouble with that is that at 30 over the limit you're in instant ban territory. A laser gun a mile away, an unmarked police car, and you're stuffed.
>> Edited by deva link on Saturday 8th April 11:17
KB_S1 said:
On the way home i was for the first time in a while concious of my measured speed and my driving suffered. .... realised that if i am being punished for driving safely, what is the point?
think i will sell the car
I know how you feel. But don't give up, fight back.
Treat the scameras as another nasty hazard to be detected and overcome, like grease on the road or a hooligan driver behind you.
If you spot them in time, you take the appropriate action and 'win'.
If you don't spot them, accept that either a) it really was bad luck or b) you could improve you observation skills.
Yes, I know these extra hazards make driving harder and more dangerous, but that is the state of things today.
Don't give up
Sounds like you were a little shaken by it, I would have been as well. Speed related ban and a fine? Well it's bullshit but not a surprise in the nanny state quango scum hole Britain has become. DD? For 86 in a 60 (I assume)? FFS!!
We're going to have a lot more people banned under the shit that found it's way into the new road safety bill, and that is all that these bastard policies are trying to achieve.
Even if your observations on this day could have been improved, at least you have the kind of attitude that admits it and is prepared to think about this. It is a brutally flawed policy that
s drivers like you off the road.
Sounds like you were a little shaken by it, I would have been as well. Speed related ban and a fine? Well it's bullshit but not a surprise in the nanny state quango scum hole Britain has become. DD? For 86 in a 60 (I assume)? FFS!!
We're going to have a lot more people banned under the shit that found it's way into the new road safety bill, and that is all that these bastard policies are trying to achieve.
Even if your observations on this day could have been improved, at least you have the kind of attitude that admits it and is prepared to think about this. It is a brutally flawed policy that
s drivers like you off the road.I think the poster has been a bit 'scared' by the officers involved.
According to the magistrates guidelines, exceeding a 60 or 70 limit by 21-30 mph should be a sentence of 4-5 points. As you were closer to the lower part of the guideline, at a guess it should be 4 points.
i suppose the reason why they dealt with this in the way they did because it sounds like it was wet. But, it is ridiculous to think that a speeding charge which should be dealt with with 4 points, at most 5 should be having DD added. After all the DD charge is usually added for the speeds far in excess of the 6 point area.
If the officers statements say that you were driving safely, not dangerously then there should be no reason whatsoever that they should add a charge of DD. After all, they would have no evidence to suggest it, in fact the evidence they have been given will state otherwise.
According to the magistrates guidelines, exceeding a 60 or 70 limit by 21-30 mph should be a sentence of 4-5 points. As you were closer to the lower part of the guideline, at a guess it should be 4 points.
i suppose the reason why they dealt with this in the way they did because it sounds like it was wet. But, it is ridiculous to think that a speeding charge which should be dealt with with 4 points, at most 5 should be having DD added. After all the DD charge is usually added for the speeds far in excess of the 6 point area.
If the officers statements say that you were driving safely, not dangerously then there should be no reason whatsoever that they should add a charge of DD. After all, they would have no evidence to suggest it, in fact the evidence they have been given will state otherwise.
KB_S1 said:
Still support more trafpol on the road and their words were at least reassuring... both officers stated that i was driving safely and this is why they gave me a bit of a break, yet i will be fined and endorsed...
I'm afraid you fit perfectly the profile of the vast majority of those caught for exceeding our stupid and largely irrelevant speed limits.
A pathetic and what a way to create a division between the law and the public.
I saw an ariticle in a local paper recently where a jeweller had to wait for over an hour for BIB to attend to his shop which was broken into at 4am. The BIB had just stopped someone for speeding at the same time in the same town minutes away. Priorities? Easy income? Easy results?
deva link said:
Jesus, the road I drive to work I've been clogging 90+ in a 60 almost everyday for the last 4 years. - bad old me.
The trouble with that is that at 30 over the limit you're in instant ban territory. A laser gun a mile away, an unmarked police car, and you're stuffed.
>> Edited by deva link on Saturday 8th April 11:17
Do you know why i do it though?
Not to be dangerous, as I don't really think this particular road is at that speed, it's because driving into hull where I work is usually infested with talivans, and it makes me feel alive to hoon it down this particular road, usually with the windows down for best effect, before joining the laser drenched, carnival procession, speedo staring bunch of tailgaters into Hull city centre.
KB_S1 said:
Bloody hell mate, give up easily don't you?
....my approach to driving is incompatible with the modern political climate.
Mine too. It has been for nigh on 40 years, and the disparity is now increasing rapidly.
Don't give up though Keith if you really enjoy driving. We all just need to be a bit more careful. I hope things go right for you.
Best wishes all,
Dave.
>> Edited by TripleS on Saturday 8th April 19:07
Boosted LS1 said:
I spent 25 years keeping a clean license. Now it's been endorsed it's worth somewhat less to me. So, I now drive quicker at almost every given opportunity just to stick 2 fingers up em So much for a decent road safety policy.
Boosted.
I just wonder what the long-term effects of these 'Ban em all for any excuse' policies will be - IMO it will only lead to MORE people driving while banned as they'll have little choice if they want to keep their jobs, homes etc.
Pointless saying that they'll just be sent to prison - there aren't enough spaces to house 'hardened' crims.
Talk about criminalising the majority
BB
Speeding is very much frowned upon in Scotland. This was the only place I've ever been stopped. 97mph on an empty motorway (apart from the unmarked vectra in a dip on the hardshoulder) cost me £250 and 6 points.
Thing was, even though they were mostly obscured, I did see the car and just though "they could have picked a better place to stop if they've broken down". Only after that thought went through my head did I think "
".
Red scooby doo and perfect driving conditions. Still, we all know red cars go fast.
Thing was, even though they were mostly obscured, I did see the car and just though "they could have picked a better place to stop if they've broken down". Only after that thought went through my head did I think "
". Red scooby doo and perfect driving conditions. Still, we all know red cars go fast.
KB_S1 said:
No excuses but on the spot they got me it is very easy to get up to very high speed without realising, i was surpised when they told me the number.
they also pointed out the speed they had to sustain to catch me. it was BIG!
What you need is a classic car like a Triumph Spitfire or a mini.
In these vehicles there is absolutely no way that you can get up to very high speeds without realising it.
You can still have bags of fun in them though
That's really bad luck mate 
It always seems that those of us who take a pride in our driving and do our best to drive to the conditions are the ones who end up taking the flak.
84(?) in a 60 does not sound too bad - there are stretches of the road where that's absolutely fine, weather conditions notwithstanding. If the BiB thought your driving was good and safe generally then how can a DD charge apply?
It makes me cross though.
Couple of examples from yesterday.
Firstly, I was driving down a long stretch of twisty NSL A road downhill, double whites all the way, but very wide (probably 4 car widths). Came up behind a car doing 30 on the nose. For about a mile. Huge queue of traffic built up. I could easily have overtaken the car as some of the straights were long enough, visibility was great, bags of space, etc. But I didn't as I knew it would be an instant 3 points on my license for crossing a double white. Who's driving badly, the person who does the easy overtake, or the person who is obviously totally unaware of the speed limit and the road around them?
Likewise, overtaking somebody who was wandering around 10-20mph below the limit later on, it occurred to me that a proportion of my observational skills were looking out for scameras or speed traps as I momentarily crept over the limit to execute a quick safe overtake, and that if I saw one my instant reaction would be to anchor on and abandon the maneovre. It adds a whole new dimension of danger (locking up under braking on gravel/cats' eyes in centre of road, car behind following me on overtake, etc.). It's just so unnecessary, and there is no grey area - it's all black and white
Don't let the bastards grind you down. I have to say that A road NSLs are when I ignore the speedo totally and drive to conditions. Things change so quickly if you look at the speedo you can miss stuff, and also get lulled into thinking "I'll be fine as long as I stay under 60". We all know there are bits of NSL roads where 20 is too fast, and other bits where 100 is fine.
Of course the next logical step is for the government to remove these dangerous judgements we have to make from us and nanny us further with a speed limit for each corner. Then we ca stop bothering with a driving test as all we have to to is match the speed on the dial with the speed on the stick
It always seems that those of us who take a pride in our driving and do our best to drive to the conditions are the ones who end up taking the flak. 84(?) in a 60 does not sound too bad - there are stretches of the road where that's absolutely fine, weather conditions notwithstanding. If the BiB thought your driving was good and safe generally then how can a DD charge apply?
It makes me cross though.
Couple of examples from yesterday.
Firstly, I was driving down a long stretch of twisty NSL A road downhill, double whites all the way, but very wide (probably 4 car widths). Came up behind a car doing 30 on the nose. For about a mile. Huge queue of traffic built up. I could easily have overtaken the car as some of the straights were long enough, visibility was great, bags of space, etc. But I didn't as I knew it would be an instant 3 points on my license for crossing a double white. Who's driving badly, the person who does the easy overtake, or the person who is obviously totally unaware of the speed limit and the road around them?
Likewise, overtaking somebody who was wandering around 10-20mph below the limit later on, it occurred to me that a proportion of my observational skills were looking out for scameras or speed traps as I momentarily crept over the limit to execute a quick safe overtake, and that if I saw one my instant reaction would be to anchor on and abandon the maneovre. It adds a whole new dimension of danger (locking up under braking on gravel/cats' eyes in centre of road, car behind following me on overtake, etc.). It's just so unnecessary, and there is no grey area - it's all black and white
Don't let the bastards grind you down. I have to say that A road NSLs are when I ignore the speedo totally and drive to conditions. Things change so quickly if you look at the speedo you can miss stuff, and also get lulled into thinking "I'll be fine as long as I stay under 60". We all know there are bits of NSL roads where 20 is too fast, and other bits where 100 is fine.
Of course the next logical step is for the government to remove these dangerous judgements we have to make from us and nanny us further with a speed limit for each corner. Then we ca stop bothering with a driving test as all we have to to is match the speed on the dial with the speed on the stick
Boosted LS1 said:
I spent 25 years keeping a clean license. Now it's been endorsed it's worth somewhat less to me. So, I now drive quicker at almost every given opportunity just to stick 2 fingers up em
Boosted.
this sums up exactly how i feel. i kept a clean driving license for 14 years, but soon to get 3 points. driving dangerously in any way? 100% hand-on-my-heart no. failing to spot a scamera - guilty. over the years, i have improved my driving in various ways. doing the IAM test being one of them, because i did drive badly in the past.
KB, don't give up driving just for 6 points - this is exactly what they want.
try to plead for 3 points, and perhaps drive more 'carefully' (=keep a careful eye for scameras and trafpol) in the future. you now know the penalties, so play along with the game. takes the fun out of driving i must admit.
criminalising the tax-paying and otherwise law-abiding citizen seems a bad way to go
>> Edited by fido on Monday 10th April 10:55
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