Overtaking courtesy
Discussion
quote:
I've often been pleasantly surprised by the way that the sight of my Chimaera coming up behind them causes micro-car drivers to lurch towards the verge, sometimes dangerously near the limit of adhesion of their two-inch wide tyres. Which shows that some at least are awake and paying attention.
I am one of those that always moves out of the way if I see someone closing very fast - not because of *what* you drive, just a fear of being hit by a fast moving object!
I wish more people would look in their mirrors as I seem to be invisible on my bike, and usually have to "make my own lane".
Funny enough, Max Power types are MORE likely to get out of my way than anyone else.
My "micro car" has 8-9 inch wide tyres on the back, and 6 inch on the front !! but does wobble a bit if you throw the steering wheel about... but not as much as SUV's.
Edited by hertsbiker on Thursday 6th December 10:10
quote:
Well I would say the Institute of Advanced Motorists (IAM) would be a pretty strong arguement supporting JonRB !!!!
Mel, I remain unclear on this point: how exactly is flow through the constriction increased by use of this technique?
Edited by Neville Turner on Thursday 6th December 12:46
Not necessarily increased flow through the obstruction. However length of q is decreased, obstruction of junctions less likely, and if utilised by everybody stress levels, impatients, and the likelyhood of road rage incidents decreased. It is also the reason that the cones are sited where they are as that is the START of the traffic controls not the warning signs a few miles back down the road.
For what its worth Neville I agree with the courteous approach over the arrogant "b**ger you I'm important" approach.
A bit more thought for others and common courtesy on the roads would be wonderful, whether it increased flow or not.
Getting from A to B as fast as possible is not everyone's sole aim in life.
Phil
A bit more thought for others and common courtesy on the roads would be wonderful, whether it increased flow or not.
Getting from A to B as fast as possible is not everyone's sole aim in life.
Phil
quote:
If I am honest M five, guys like you really piss me off!
Fair enough if there is little or no warning of the need to merge lanes, but a 3 mile warning? Come on M5, when you passed all those cars patiently queueing didn't you think they were trying to get somewhere today as well? I know we all like to leave it till the last minute to merge if we can but when the queue is as long as you said it was it's just plain arse behaviour to sail along down the outside of a queue thats miles long and expect the guys at the front to let you in. I'm not surprised the lorry tried to force you off the road, I expect he had been patiently rolling along at 5mph for 10 minutes whilst guys like you make the queue ahead of him longer than it was when he started ( I know thats not possible, but you know what I mean)
It's a pet hate of mine I'm afraid.
I am sorry, this doesnt wash with me, if u are trying to get somewhere, use the other lanes. Its not his fault that everyone else is too stupid to use the other lanes.
I think that in general there is a science to the art of "coning" and it hasnt been perfected yet. In the case of uncongested road works any filtering system works well - no issues and loads of space.
When it starts to get a little more busy then you get the three lane scenario. The outside is free, the middle is stationary and the inside is flowing slowly. Gits fly down the outside and push in at the last minute. Very annoying to all involved - but hey, this is human nature.
Finally when the traffic is really busy then it works the other way. The outside tends to be slower than the other two. They are blocked and forced to merge in turn. However, because everyone goes to fast, they end up braking harder and this creates a longer tailback in the outside lane.
So, if we can create an adapting contraflow system that can alter depending on the traffic situation - then I am afraid that we are all stuffed...
Sorry.
Paul
When it starts to get a little more busy then you get the three lane scenario. The outside is free, the middle is stationary and the inside is flowing slowly. Gits fly down the outside and push in at the last minute. Very annoying to all involved - but hey, this is human nature.
Finally when the traffic is really busy then it works the other way. The outside tends to be slower than the other two. They are blocked and forced to merge in turn. However, because everyone goes to fast, they end up braking harder and this creates a longer tailback in the outside lane.
So, if we can create an adapting contraflow system that can alter depending on the traffic situation - then I am afraid that we are all stuffed...
Sorry.
Paul
quote:
[I am sorry, this doesnt wash with me, if u are trying to get somewhere, use the other lanes. Its not his fault that everyone else is too stupid to use the other lanes.
Suggest you read the rest of the thread before you pass a final judgement. There is strong evidence that the guys who fly down the outside actually make the queue longer for everyone. Besides, the actual length of the queue means nothing, its the number of cars in it that counts and that is the same if they are strung out in a line or side by side. Queue jumpers interrupt the flow of the one lane that can move - ie the one that is lined up with the open lane in the constriction. By causing people to have to stop to let them in they make everyone in that line stop.
The reaction times for all those people to stop and restart adds up over hundred of cars, in other words it ADDS to the delay!
However its done, and there have been many good ideas put on this thread) the central premise would have to be that the traffic should be kept moving at all times, even slowly, and queue jumping plainly stops that happening.
Andy
the French seem to have a slightly different approach to coning off. They give you no indication until there is about 5 yards (sorry metres) till the lane closes, then put up one farting little sign. 10 metres later there is a big hole and then a big truck. Traffic seems to merge in quite well with occasional French peasants pram (2cv) found in hole. It seems to be a thrown in the deep end approch to improving driver skills.
quote:
queue jumping plainly stops that happening.
Andy
There you go, problem solved. Merge at the cones and you dont leave 1 mile of perfectly good road. So nobody can be accused of queue jumping as there is no 'free lane' to do it.
At the end of the day every vehicle has to get through the section of reduced lanes and there is no point making this length longer than is needed be by mergering before required.
Marv
Here's a thought. I haven't put any effort into thinking *hard* about this, but hey, it's late, OK?
When closing a motorway down from three lanes to one, what do people think the effect would be of closing the inside two lanes, rather than the outside two?
Would it have the effect, with our rather barmy national idea of lane discipline, of slowing the outside lane right down, and leaving the people who would normally queue for ever to gently shuffle up the inside and merge in turn?
Or would it just lead to smoking disaster?
I find myself getting twitchy with ideas of writing some software to simulate this. Once a sad techie programmer, always a...
When closing a motorway down from three lanes to one, what do people think the effect would be of closing the inside two lanes, rather than the outside two?
Would it have the effect, with our rather barmy national idea of lane discipline, of slowing the outside lane right down, and leaving the people who would normally queue for ever to gently shuffle up the inside and merge in turn?
Or would it just lead to smoking disaster?
I find myself getting twitchy with ideas of writing some software to simulate this. Once a sad techie programmer, always a...
quote:
the French seem to have a slightly different approach to coning off. They give you no indication until there is about 5 yards (sorry metres) till the lane closes, then put up one farting little sign. 10 metres later there is a big hole and then a big truck. Traffic seems to merge in quite well with occasional French peasants pram (2cv) found in hole. It seems to be a thrown in the deep end approch to improving driver skills.
This would seem to result in the merge-in technique advocated by the M5 crowd (and apparently the Institute of Advanced Motorists).
During busy periods, one suspects that this would result in the outside lane moving considerably more slowly than the other two.
Ultimately, I do not feel that M5 et al would be too impressed.
I suppose this is one situation where we must all agree to disagree such that the M5 crowd may continue to burn past, cutting in at the last moment, with the rest of us sitting quietly in our queue tutting.
Edited by Neville Turner on Sunday 9th December 08:31
ummm.
I thought it was your moral obligation to let someone on the right pull in.
This comes from the normal overtaking rules, so that Max Power isn't forced into a head on 'cos he over cooked it.
So not letting them merge, infact puts you in the wrong?? dunnow, anyone else KNOW the law here?
C
I thought it was your moral obligation to let someone on the right pull in.
This comes from the normal overtaking rules, so that Max Power isn't forced into a head on 'cos he over cooked it.
So not letting them merge, infact puts you in the wrong?? dunnow, anyone else KNOW the law here?
C
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