Alarm Mines - legal or not?
Discussion
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Original-Alarm-Mine-Trip-Wire-from-Henry-Krank_W0QQitemZ150316079916QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_SportingGoods_Hunting_ShootingSports_ET?hash=item150316079916&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=72%3A1301
Are these devices legal or not? It says that they use a 12 guage shotgun blank but I know for a fact that in the old days, gamekeepers and the like used live cartridges - which even when detonated in the open, could cause injury... up to 16 feet away!
There is a design which restricts the length of the cartridge to a blank - but this one does not!
I did once ask a BiB, but he was not certain if it was illegal or not, as it didn't have a barrel or means of containment.
Mine doesn't look quite like this one but the principle is the same!
Are these devices legal or not? It says that they use a 12 guage shotgun blank but I know for a fact that in the old days, gamekeepers and the like used live cartridges - which even when detonated in the open, could cause injury... up to 16 feet away!
There is a design which restricts the length of the cartridge to a blank - but this one does not!
I did once ask a BiB, but he was not certain if it was illegal or not, as it didn't have a barrel or means of containment.
Mine doesn't look quite like this one but the principle is the same!
bimsb6 said:
i don't think they are legal ,not seen them advertised for some time now .
i do like the idea of scaring the s
t out of a burglar though . 
I have never seen them advertised, so was surprised to see them on ebay, since they dont allow firearms.i do like the idea of scaring the s
t out of a burglar though . I found them while googling a firework!
I half expected that scaring a burglar half to death would be frowned upon but can take comfort in the thought that at night in Cumbria, it would be some time before the police turned up - unless I was vandalising a speed camera - in which case they might never turn up!
I'm lucky - the druggies living in my street have all "moved" away!
I've used shotgun blanks, and found that they are not really that loud! Instead, get yourself some military grade thunderflashes, and do the following:
Ingredients: Military grade thunder flashes or similar, Swan Vestas matches (or, preferably waterproof matches), elastic bands, glue, fishing wire, thick tape.
1) Remove the striker from the Thunder Flash and glue some of the matches to the surround of the fuse.
2) Next, cut out the striker section from the match box.
3) Tape some of the elastic bands to the sides of the Thunderflash, place the match box striker section under the bands so that the tension holds them in place. Leave it with striker face up.
4) Attach the Thunderflash securely in the vicinity of your trap.
5) Attach fishing wire - one end to the match box striker, the other accross the trip wire section.
6) Finally, turn striker to face down. It is now armed!
And that was only one of the little ones...
(note, er, this is a work of fiction, and the above should not be tried by anyone, etc etc)
Ingredients: Military grade thunder flashes or similar, Swan Vestas matches (or, preferably waterproof matches), elastic bands, glue, fishing wire, thick tape.
1) Remove the striker from the Thunder Flash and glue some of the matches to the surround of the fuse.
2) Next, cut out the striker section from the match box.
3) Tape some of the elastic bands to the sides of the Thunderflash, place the match box striker section under the bands so that the tension holds them in place. Leave it with striker face up.
4) Attach the Thunderflash securely in the vicinity of your trap.
5) Attach fishing wire - one end to the match box striker, the other accross the trip wire section.
6) Finally, turn striker to face down. It is now armed!
And that was only one of the little ones...
(note, er, this is a work of fiction, and the above should not be tried by anyone, etc etc)
Cpn Jack Spanner said:
I've used shotgun blanks, and found that they are not really that loud! Instead, get yourself some military grade thunderflashes, and do the following:
Ingredients: Military grade thunder flashes or similar, Swan Vestas matches (or, preferably waterproof matches), elastic bands, glue, fishing wire, thick tape.
1) Remove the striker from the Thunder Flash and glue some of the matches to the surround of the fuse.
2) Next, cut out the striker section from the match box.
3) Tape some of the elastic bands to the sides of the Thunderflash, place the match box striker section under the bands so that the tension holds them in place. Leave it with striker face up.
4) Attach the Thunderflash securely in the vicinity of your trap.
5) Attach fishing wire - one end to the match box striker, the other accross the trip wire section.
6) Finally, turn striker to face down. It is now armed!
And that was only one of the little ones...
(note, er, this is a work of fiction, and the above should not be tried by anyone, etc etc)
Really, really don't do this. Think about it from the CPS point of view. A thunderflash contains explosives. You have adapted it and improvised a firing device. Thats an improvised explosive device, that is. Or in other words, a bomb. Nick nick.Ingredients: Military grade thunder flashes or similar, Swan Vestas matches (or, preferably waterproof matches), elastic bands, glue, fishing wire, thick tape.
1) Remove the striker from the Thunder Flash and glue some of the matches to the surround of the fuse.
2) Next, cut out the striker section from the match box.
3) Tape some of the elastic bands to the sides of the Thunderflash, place the match box striker section under the bands so that the tension holds them in place. Leave it with striker face up.
4) Attach the Thunderflash securely in the vicinity of your trap.
5) Attach fishing wire - one end to the match box striker, the other accross the trip wire section.
6) Finally, turn striker to face down. It is now armed!
And that was only one of the little ones...
(note, er, this is a work of fiction, and the above should not be tried by anyone, etc etc)
I'm sure someone got into trouble when one of these went off in the face of an officer who was checking a shed to see if it had been broken into.
That being said I have been tempted to rig a trip wire up to a pea grenade, but then I remembered how dozy I can be and how the peas would hurt.
I was also thinking about those air soft claymores, possibly filled with paint balls.
That being said I have been tempted to rig a trip wire up to a pea grenade, but then I remembered how dozy I can be and how the peas would hurt.
I was also thinking about those air soft claymores, possibly filled with paint balls.
Echo66 said:
Modification of pyrotechnics in any way is illegal unless you have a valid bang ticket. You can't alter them in any way from their original design.
I'm screwed then - in the past I've bought aerial fireworks and modified them to make them go higher & further - usually just by adding extra motors/thrusters on a delay.jeff m said:
Alarm mine just by its name would raise eyebrows.
Try "bird scarer" in conjuction with a motion detector.
Farm supply house.
Just as loud.
I prefer the trip wire method - it's more selective than the motion sensor, and you can run multiple wires to the same alarm. Plus the flash is an immediate deterrent - believe me they are effective... mine came complete with white plastic skull and crossbones warning signs to put up around the property... and yes they raise eyebrows!Try "bird scarer" in conjuction with a motion detector.
Farm supply house.
Just as loud.
Cpn Jack Spanner said:
I've used shotgun blanks, and found that they are not really that loud! Instead, get yourself some military grade thunderflashes, and do the following:
Ingredients: Military grade thunder flashes or similar, Swan Vestas matches (or, preferably waterproof matches), elastic bands, glue, fishing wire, thick tape.
1) Remove the striker from the Thunder Flash and glue some of the matches to the surround of the fuse.
2) Next, cut out the striker section from the match box.
3) Tape some of the elastic bands to the sides of the Thunderflash, place the match box striker section under the bands so that the tension holds them in place. Leave it with striker face up.
4) Attach the Thunderflash securely in the vicinity of your trap.
5) Attach fishing wire - one end to the match box striker, the other accross the trip wire section.
6) Finally, turn striker to face down. It is now armed!
And that was only one of the little ones...
(note, er, this is a work of fiction, and the above should not be tried by anyone, etc etc)
Try adding a smoke grenade and a Camping Gaz cylinder to the mixture. Rig the smoke grenade pin to the trip wire, and improvise a suitable valve on the Gaz. When triggered, lots of smoke, blinding flash, sheets of flame. Not lethal, but very, very scary.Ingredients: Military grade thunder flashes or similar, Swan Vestas matches (or, preferably waterproof matches), elastic bands, glue, fishing wire, thick tape.
1) Remove the striker from the Thunder Flash and glue some of the matches to the surround of the fuse.
2) Next, cut out the striker section from the match box.
3) Tape some of the elastic bands to the sides of the Thunderflash, place the match box striker section under the bands so that the tension holds them in place. Leave it with striker face up.
4) Attach the Thunderflash securely in the vicinity of your trap.
5) Attach fishing wire - one end to the match box striker, the other accross the trip wire section.
6) Finally, turn striker to face down. It is now armed!
And that was only one of the little ones...
(note, er, this is a work of fiction, and the above should not be tried by anyone, etc etc)
And, no, I've never made one. I used (20+ years ago) to make my own theatrical pyrotechnics, but the above recipe was passed on to me by military types
mmm-five said:
Echo66 said:
Modification of pyrotechnics in any way is illegal unless you have a valid bang ticket. You can't alter them in any way from their original design.
I'm screwed then - in the past I've bought aerial fireworks and modified them to make them go higher & further - usually just by adding extra motors/thrusters on a delay.Thundies bought over the counter in UK (i.e. non mil spec stuff) are also caveated with the disclaimer 'Do not throw'......sort of defeats the purpose but hey-ho......you can end up with a felt collar if you are therefore caught lobbing them. Legally speaking they should be used like a firework.........place on ground stand well back etc. Which is damned boring!!
Alarm mines are legal if used as designed & that is the crux of it. Modify anything like that in anyway & its illegal. Best way is to leave as is.
Some do not need to be modified to hold a normal length 12 gauge cartridge, while others restrict the length of cartridge which can be inserted.
This is usually achieved by having the arrangement where the plunger cannot be drawn back far enough to take a cartridge longer than the blanks, which are shorter than a regular 12 gauge.
The pattern I linked to on ebay grips the rim of the cartridge which is slid sideways into the mine. ANY length or type of cartridge will fit in such a device.
Imagine the effect of a 12 gauge cartridge being detonated with no barrel to contain the shot - it's like the shortest sawn-off ever (or so I am told!).
So are they illegal if they COULD be used in this way, or would you actually have to be using one to break the law?
I used to live in a rural location where when we were young enough to be still at school, the gamekeeper thought nothing of firing a 12 bore over your head if he caught you trespassing - that's if you avoided the "gin" traps! This device and use was quite common, but burglaries were not!
This is usually achieved by having the arrangement where the plunger cannot be drawn back far enough to take a cartridge longer than the blanks, which are shorter than a regular 12 gauge.
The pattern I linked to on ebay grips the rim of the cartridge which is slid sideways into the mine. ANY length or type of cartridge will fit in such a device.
Imagine the effect of a 12 gauge cartridge being detonated with no barrel to contain the shot - it's like the shortest sawn-off ever (or so I am told!).
So are they illegal if they COULD be used in this way, or would you actually have to be using one to break the law?
I used to live in a rural location where when we were young enough to be still at school, the gamekeeper thought nothing of firing a 12 bore over your head if he caught you trespassing - that's if you avoided the "gin" traps! This device and use was quite common, but burglaries were not!
Mill Wheel said:
That's a little more advanced than aluminium flash powder from Rank Strand!
Indeed Just in case anybody is wondering, all of this was 20+ years ago. The resultant "bangs" and "flashes" were used in school theatrical productions.
Used to make maroons by wrapping increasingly-large quantities of flash powder inside increasingly-large amounts of gaffer tape, with simple electrical fuse wire inside to act as a detonator. Large bangs were available if you got the burst pressure to flash powder ratio about right.
Mix in varying amounts of different-coloured smoke powders to provide the right, err, theatricality, or just use in a maroon tank (tuned for resonance by the addition of water in the bottom) for the most satisfying bang.
skwdenyer said:
Try adding a smoke grenade and a Camping Gaz cylinder to the mixture. Rig the smoke grenade pin to the trip wire, and improvise a suitable valve on the Gaz. When triggered, lots of smoke, blinding flash, sheets of flame. Not lethal, but very, very scary.
And, no, I've never made one. the above recipe was passed on to me by military types
Military types are not allowed to lash together their own pyrotechnics like this. Yes, I know they sometimes do, because part of my job is investigating the accidents that occur when they get it wrong - which they usually do. Very few people in the army are trained to a high level with explosives. Even a lot who think they are 'experts' - indeed are told they are - have a little knowledge limited to their specific role. And you know the saying about a little knowledge being dangerous...And, no, I've never made one. the above recipe was passed on to me by military types
BruceV8 said:
skwdenyer said:
Try adding a smoke grenade and a Camping Gaz cylinder to the mixture. Rig the smoke grenade pin to the trip wire, and improvise a suitable valve on the Gaz. When triggered, lots of smoke, blinding flash, sheets of flame. Not lethal, but very, very scary.
And, no, I've never made one. the above recipe was passed on to me by military types
Military types are not allowed to lash together their own pyrotechnics like this. Yes, I know they sometimes do, because part of my job is investigating the accidents that occur when they get it wrong - which they usually do. Very few people in the army are trained to a high level with explosives. Even a lot who think they are 'experts' - indeed are told they are - have a little knowledge limited to their specific role. And you know the saying about a little knowledge being dangerous...And, no, I've never made one. the above recipe was passed on to me by military types
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