F**King livid.
Discussion
toad_oftoadhall said:
You forgot the 3rd: Anyonewit earning enough money can drive any speed he likes becasue he can afford any fine that the court gives him.
Erm we mangage before cameras with the police patrolling our roads the world didn't end then!
Police could still issue points as they alaways had. Cameras could collect revenue as they do now.
Only difference would be would be nobody got banned!
Quite true Mr Toad, but I think the only way that would work is if more police are going to be put back out on the roads to deal with ALL motoring offences rather than just speeding. Obviously that would happen if YOU or I were implementing it but it's the muppets that are in charge unfortunately!
Toad,
From my understanding of this thread he just needs to sit tight.
He doesn't know he has been done does he? If the camera was for speed and not tax etc did it get him?
He doesn't know what speed he was doing - he should be aware. When I did my performance driving course I was taught to stick to the limits at all times (no defence if caught in a posted limit) and treat NSL as 'proceed as you see fit'. If he booted it in the 40mph then he's a bit daft.
If he is done then it may just be three points - if he is convinced of a ban then there may be something he's not telling you.
If he's banned and loses his job due to lack of licence then he'll need to get a different type of job - no need to claim the dole (by the way we all fund that not the government).
And to answer another point burglars often would lose their job.
I've been caught a couple of times (inc hidden scamera on a 40 mph dual carriageway) but it's been my fault not the cops who caught me.
I'm not sure where this thread is going now - perhaps enough has been said.
From my understanding of this thread he just needs to sit tight.
He doesn't know he has been done does he? If the camera was for speed and not tax etc did it get him?
He doesn't know what speed he was doing - he should be aware. When I did my performance driving course I was taught to stick to the limits at all times (no defence if caught in a posted limit) and treat NSL as 'proceed as you see fit'. If he booted it in the 40mph then he's a bit daft.
If he is done then it may just be three points - if he is convinced of a ban then there may be something he's not telling you.
If he's banned and loses his job due to lack of licence then he'll need to get a different type of job - no need to claim the dole (by the way we all fund that not the government).
And to answer another point burglars often would lose their job.
I've been caught a couple of times (inc hidden scamera on a 40 mph dual carriageway) but it's been my fault not the cops who caught me.
I'm not sure where this thread is going now - perhaps enough has been said.
He's not convinced of a ban this morning. He's calmed down a lot. The hysteria has drained out of the situaiton. Should be ok. In cold light of day it was highly unlikely he was at banable speeds.
He has a pretty specific skill set in engineering but I take your point. He lives in the sticks so a move to his new place of employment (Macdonalds) would be required.
As far as I'm aware burglars don't lose their job! For a first offence they wouldnt' even go inside! In the million to one chance that they did it wouldn't be longer than their leave allowance!
My bro accepts the time he's been caught in the past he was full on speeding. (86 in a 70) However a nudge in speed on a dual carriageway as it becomes a 70 is entirely the fault of the person that caught him.
Agree the thread has served it's purpose.
I was angry and worried. I've calmed down, a number of options have been identified if he is banned. Job done.
>> Edited by toad_oftoadhall on Saturday 1st November 15:00
He has a pretty specific skill set in engineering but I take your point. He lives in the sticks so a move to his new place of employment (Macdonalds) would be required.
As far as I'm aware burglars don't lose their job! For a first offence they wouldnt' even go inside! In the million to one chance that they did it wouldn't be longer than their leave allowance!
My bro accepts the time he's been caught in the past he was full on speeding. (86 in a 70) However a nudge in speed on a dual carriageway as it becomes a 70 is entirely the fault of the person that caught him.
Agree the thread has served it's purpose.
I was angry and worried. I've calmed down, a number of options have been identified if he is banned. Job done.
>> Edited by toad_oftoadhall on Saturday 1st November 15:00
centurion07 said:
And if you can't do the time, don't do the crime, i.e. if your job depends on your driving licence, don't do anything to jeopardise it. I've had a few points on mine in the past (only 3 at the mo), so I'm not taking a holier than thou stance, just saying if it means that much to you, why risk it?
The point that seems to be constantly overlooked is that the people who are being caught these days are those who suffer a momentary lapse in concentration or who feel they are in a perfectly safe situation and can see no scameras (hiding behind signs/bushes etc) and use their judgement.
My 'harsh' rebuke was aimed at those among us who think they are above such misdemeanors and believe anyone foolish enough to be caught speeding must have been hooning around 'max muppet' stylee. This attitude stems directly from govt brainwashing and their attempt to smear the motorist as a pariah and a speeder no less than a kiddy fiddler. I'm frankly amazed to see it on Pistonheads
Apache said:
The point that seems to be constantly overlooked is that the people who are being caught these days are those who suffer a momentary lapse in concentration
My father made exactly this point yesterday.
Scameras have made the average driver much slower. He's noticed that yuo can get away as slow as 80mph on the motorway without someone tailgating and flashinng you.
The reaction of the scamera partnerships to this loss of business has been to:
a) Lower speed limits on dual carriageways that were previously NSL.
b) Introduce grading on Dual Carriagway - NSL-40-NSL for no reason beyond revenue raising.
c) Put ambiguous signing up. (M25 roadworks: Fixed limit of 40 while the gantries show 60.) Only one reason for that!
d) Hide near transitions.
Most high milage drivers now stick to limits like glue. They still get done as bro toad has proved.
Chrisgr31 said:
I agree that this is more about money than safety but you do have to be so careful.
As for the locus of the vans. Our scameraship people put little camera on the road side and the van is parked out of site. That could be what this was. Camera was in 40 zone so that when you see van, it's too late.
As a matter of interest where does this happen, and how big is the camera?
This is Dorset
The camera unit (not including stand) is about the size of a large microwave oven.
But for the scamera operators defence, they do put the locations of the scamera in the local newspaper and they also have a web site telling which roads they will be on each week. So there really is no defence to getting your picture taken.
318 said:
This is Dorset
The camera unit (not including stand) is about the size of a large microwave oven.
Saw this near Bear Wood/Wallsidown.
40 limit dual carriageway, limited access to the road for pedestrians. Pure revenue raiser.
Bet it's never been in the town centre.
>> Edited by toad_oftoadhall on Saturday 1st November 15:48
Apache said:
And if you can't do the time, don't do the crime, i.e. if your job depends on your driving licence, don't do anything to jeopardise it. I've had a few points on mine in the past (only 3 at the mo), so I'm not taking a holier than thou stance, just saying if it means that much to you, why risk it?
The point that seems to be constantly overlooked is that the people who are being caught these days are those who suffer a MOMENTARY LAPSE IN CONCENTRATION I'm frankly amazed to see it on Pistonheads
From what Toad said originally, this wasn't a momentary lapse seeing as he said his brother thought he was somewhere around 30MPH over the limit. Secondly, be honest, are you really incapable of keeping your car under the limit? A momentary lapse resulting in going too fast would suggest to me that either it was a bit longer than momentary in allowing your speed to creep up Xmph over the limit to get caught, or that you didn't see the limit sign, either way, I think that's quite a serious lapse of concentration. When I've been legitimately done for speeding, I was fully aware of both the posted limit AND the speed I was travelling. I chose to ignore them & got caught.
As I've said elsewhere on this site, 20MPH limts can kiss my butt & 30 limits aren't that much better, and I regularly ignore both (when safe to do so obviously!!!), however, if I get caught, although I'll try every trick in the book to get off the charge (if it's possible, why not?), I won't whine that it's unfair that I got caught. I was breaking the law, end of story.
(I hope this comes across as I've meant it. The meaning gets lost sometimes when stuff's typed rather than spoken!
)centurion07 said:
centurion07 said:
And if you can't do the time, don't do the crime, i.e. if your job depends on your driving licence, don't do anything to jeopardise it. I've had a few points on mine in the past (only 3 at the mo), so I'm not taking a holier than thou stance, just saying if it means that much to you, why risk it?
The point that seems to be constantly overlooked is that the people who are being caught these days are those who suffer a MOMENTARY LAPSE IN CONCENTRATION I'm frankly amazed to see it on Pistonheads
From what Toad said originally, this wasn't a momentary lapse seeing as he said his brother thought he was somewhere around 30MPH over the limit. Secondly, be honest, are you really incapable of keeping your car under the limit? A momentary lapse resulting in going too fast would suggest to me that either it was a bit longer than momentary in allowing your speed to creep up Xmph over the limit to get caught, or that you didn't see the limit sign, either way, I think that's quite a serious lapse of concentration. When I've been legitimately done for speeding, I was fully aware of both the posted limit AND the speed I was travelling. I chose to ignore them & got caught.
As I've said elsewhere on this site, 20MPH limts can kiss my butt & 30 limits aren't that much better, and I regularly ignore both (when safe to do so obviously!!!), however, if I get caught, although I'll try every trick in the book to get off the charge (if it's possible, why not?), I won't whine that it's unfair that I got caught. I was breaking the law, end of story.
(I hope this comes across as I've meant it. The meaning gets lost sometimes when stuff's typed rather than spoken!
Ok maybe I should've omitted the momentary bit, one of my cars is a Saab 9000 and it is absolutely silent at 60/70/80 and it is very easy to underestimate your speed. The human brain assesses risk continually and if it feels the speed is appropriate for the conditions based on the information it gets then, yes, you can find yourself speeding. (cruise is pretty invaluable in a car like this)
Funnily enough the Griff makes such a racket and is so involving that you are much more aware of your speed. The solution therefor is simple go and buy a Griff
I have been clocked recently and didn't whine about it (I did however remark to the Chief Constable how efficient my subsequent fine and endorsment was compared to their performance regarding my sons carjacking), although I can sympathise with others who are caught in more underhand situations such as between a 30 and NSLI see this little gadget of theirs around Dorset most weeks & I must say it's usually somewhere near a hazard.
Except
1) the A35 50mph Limit which is complete b******s that makes the road hazardous because no-one adjusts their speed at the junctions
2) C13 Blandford/Shaftsbury the big straight bit
They've not got me yet but I see it enough times to poetentially lose my licence several times over. As a rule I'm not speeding about the towns etc.
I have spoken to a very helpful couple of lads oeperating such bit of kit up the road from my house, told me all about it & all about their other bits of kit too.
Except
1) the A35 50mph Limit which is complete b******s that makes the road hazardous because no-one adjusts their speed at the junctions
2) C13 Blandford/Shaftsbury the big straight bit
They've not got me yet but I see it enough times to poetentially lose my licence several times over. As a rule I'm not speeding about the towns etc.
I have spoken to a very helpful couple of lads oeperating such bit of kit up the road from my house, told me all about it & all about their other bits of kit too.
aaah the A449 kiddy road.. I know it well! It used to be 70mph all the way along, this may they build pinch points, single lane sections, 40mph sections and suprise, they now put talivans on it.
a year ago this was a perfectly fine "bypass" to get you to worcester. now its a hell of a drive due to a copule of junctions where old people forgot to stop at the crossroads and got killed. was it speed that killed them, well yes, that and there 20 foot visibility that meant they couldnt see on coming cars...
a year ago this was a perfectly fine "bypass" to get you to worcester. now its a hell of a drive due to a copule of junctions where old people forgot to stop at the crossroads and got killed. was it speed that killed them, well yes, that and there 20 foot visibility that meant they couldnt see on coming cars...
Hi guys,
First off, allow me to apologise for what may seem like blatant advertising. It isn't, but is offered purely as information.
I have a deal with an insurance company that enables me to sell a 'disqualification insurance' policy with every Snooper or Morpheous product I sell. Essentially, this means that if you lose your licence through the totting up of points or a straight ban the company will pay you up to £6000 during the year for your travel expenses. Thats for getting to work and back, taking the kids to school, going on holiday - whatever you would ordinarily do had you not been banned.
This could be vital to people who rely on their licences to get to work. It is indeed a sad idictment of the state of things today where an insurance company can make money from providing such a policy.
I can also sell the policy as a seperate item, the cost is £59.95 for 12 months. Though would be happy to discount for a group purchase!
Basically, providing you have 6 points or less at the time of application, are over 18 and have never been refused a licence on medical grounds you are eligible to apply.
Apologies again, but thought I should proffer the information.
www.tyrekickers.com
Thanks, and I hope none of you will ever need it!
Mark
First off, allow me to apologise for what may seem like blatant advertising. It isn't, but is offered purely as information.
I have a deal with an insurance company that enables me to sell a 'disqualification insurance' policy with every Snooper or Morpheous product I sell. Essentially, this means that if you lose your licence through the totting up of points or a straight ban the company will pay you up to £6000 during the year for your travel expenses. Thats for getting to work and back, taking the kids to school, going on holiday - whatever you would ordinarily do had you not been banned.
This could be vital to people who rely on their licences to get to work. It is indeed a sad idictment of the state of things today where an insurance company can make money from providing such a policy.
I can also sell the policy as a seperate item, the cost is £59.95 for 12 months. Though would be happy to discount for a group purchase!
Basically, providing you have 6 points or less at the time of application, are over 18 and have never been refused a licence on medical grounds you are eligible to apply.
Apologies again, but thought I should proffer the information.
www.tyrekickers.com
Thanks, and I hope none of you will ever need it!
Mark
stooz said:
now its a hell of a drive due to a copule of junctions where old people forgot to stop at the crossroads and got killed. was it speed that killed them, well yes, that and there 20 foot visibility that meant they couldnt see on coming cars...
point of order mr chairman.
quote from AIB evidence in recent inquest to fatac where old biddy crossed the carriageway and failed to see oncoming vehicle due to being dazzled by low sun
" the excess speed (78 in a 70) of the vehicle driven by [snipped for obvious reasons]in no way contributed to the cause or the outcome of the collision." end quote
Had an e-mail discussion with Toad including a site visit. ToTH has the background to the 40 limit and why it was introduced.
Can I suggest let's leave this thread for a while until we know for sure the outcome for brother Toad and that we do have both the site and situation correctly identified.
If we have, I stand by my comment earlier up this thread that if this was a speed check in the location we think then IMHO it's a total disgrace. [1]
Personally I think it wasn't but was an ANPR check, but let's wait & see eh?
At that I'm leaving this thread alone.
[1] cue for a post from 316Ti etc etc if you can't do the time etc etc.
I drive this section almost every day and do not press the go pedal till completely after the NSL sign. Believe me it takes will power, a supremely LOT of will power to do so with a completely open dual in front.
>> Edited by flat in fifth on Tuesday 4th November 16:21
markla said:
Hi guys,
First off, allow me to apologise for what may seem like blatant advertising. It isn't, but is offered purely as information.
I have a deal with an insurance company that enables me to sell a 'disqualification insurance' policy with every Snooper or Morpheous product I sell. Essentially, this means that if you lose your licence through the totting up of points or a straight ban the company will pay you up to £6000 during the year for your travel expenses. Thats for getting to work and back, taking the kids to school, going on holiday - whatever you would ordinarily do had you not been banned.
This could be vital to people who rely on their licences to get to work. It is indeed a sad idictment of the state of things today where an insurance company can make money from providing such a policy.
I can also sell the policy as a seperate item, the cost is £59.95 for 12 months. Though would be happy to discount for a group purchase!
Basically, providing you have 6 points or less at the time of application, are over 18 and have never been refused a licence on medical grounds you are eligible to apply.
Apologies again, but thought I should proffer the information.
www.tyrekickers.com
Thanks, and I hope none of you will ever need it!
Mark
Cheers Mark, Ive put the site in my favourites. Ill be in touch soon.
If you consider someone who drives a very high mileage for a living and they lose their licence through a few minor speeding convictions they will, in all probability, continue to drive whilst banned. I know I would as I live in a village with virtually no public transport and run a small business.
There will soon be thousands of disqual drivers on the road who just want to continue to provide for their families, pay their mortgages, bring up their children and make a success of their chosen careers.
If banned they might as well take the risk.
Disqual for drunk driving was readily accepted, but this cash-camera scam won't ever be accepted in the same way.
This week in Luton a doctor was fined and got 3 points for 50 in a 40 at 01-30 hours. He is appealing the sentance, apparently, as he is so incensed - and rightly so. Now we have another professional person who is seriously anti-police.
When will they learn?
There will soon be thousands of disqual drivers on the road who just want to continue to provide for their families, pay their mortgages, bring up their children and make a success of their chosen careers.
If banned they might as well take the risk.
Disqual for drunk driving was readily accepted, but this cash-camera scam won't ever be accepted in the same way.
This week in Luton a doctor was fined and got 3 points for 50 in a 40 at 01-30 hours. He is appealing the sentance, apparently, as he is so incensed - and rightly so. Now we have another professional person who is seriously anti-police.
When will they learn?
318ti said:
If someone has a job that depends on them having a clean licence then they shouldn't be speeding
You have a choice in life...to speed or not to speed, that is the question
Brilliant.
No. That isn't brilliant. It's true, but sad. Very very sad. And I was hoping not to read such tat here on PH. May you be NIP'd soon for such heresy. Not all choices are easy, and sometimes the law is wrong. Sometimes it is safe to speed. So please don't preach garbage.
hertsbiker said:
ledfoot said:
If someone has a job that depends on them having a clean licence then they shouldn't be speeding
You have a choice in life...to speed or not to speed, that is the question
Brilliant.
No. That isn't brilliant. It's true, but sad. Very very sad. And I was hoping not to read such tat here on PH. May you be NIP'd soon for such heresy. Not all choices are easy, and sometimes the law is wrong. Sometimes it is safe to speed. So please don't preach garbage.
Oh dear, we are off again.........!
No we aren't! I was just incensed at reading it. I think a few other people are too. I can't post much these days, but it was enough that I had to write something. And how do you think ordinary people make up time lost to the go slow brigade? easy - go faster for a while. Got a life to lead, and spending it at 70mph dead on the m-way because someone said so, is not how I see Britain moving forward. I wasn't suggesting running down granny & the kids in town! Oh and by the way, Toads generalisation was wrong for the most part, but there are some despicable people out there, either side of the blue line. Thankfully none of 'em are in here.
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