Speeding whilst overtaking

[blueg33]

I got 3 points and a £60m fine in August from a policeman for speeding whilst overtaking. I was caught by a laser and pulled over by an un-marked car. They wouldnt take the "I was overtaking" as a defence.

[bryan35]

vonhosen said:

bryan35 said:

oldsoak said:

Unless they were travelling slowly ALL THE TIME thus holding you up, why would you need to overtake at all?
Is it the 'red mist' we hear about that insists we MUST be in front...what?
Is there some sort of prize for getting in front of a line of traffic?
Genuine question, as there is a road near me B1230 (partial D/C)where it drops from a NSL 60 to a 50 then 40 until finally a 30 through a village where there is a school that fronts the main road. Now people almost break their necks and the 30mph limit to get in front of a steadily moving line of traffic on this road only to turn off a little way past the school...I have never understood why.

well, to be fair I didn't mention a line of traffic, just someone driving very slow who's impossible to overtake, then speeds up on the overtaking bits.
These drivers also tend to a bit unpredictable with their braking, creating stress.

So, the prize is making progress, saving fuel, and lower stress levels.

What's wrong with being slower in the bends than the straights ?
Perhaps they think they are driving at an appropriate & legal speed for both & it's you that's trying to out drive the limit point on the bends.

Edited by vonhosen on Sunday 13th September 18:42

I can understand that Von, however there always seems to be the assumtion that people are trying to drive to the limit, which isn't always so. I'm talking about people who's driving would still be considered cautious even if on black ice in thick fog, and roads that go on for miles and miles with few overtaking oportunities, speeding right up when they occur.
A paranoid person might come to the conclusion that they do it on purpose.

[Zod]

vonhosen said:

bryan35 said:

oldsoak said:

Unless they were travelling slowly ALL THE TIME thus holding you up, why would you need to overtake at all?
Is it the 'red mist' we hear about that insists we MUST be in front...what?
Is there some sort of prize for getting in front of a line of traffic?
Genuine question, as there is a road near me B1230 (partial D/C)where it drops from a NSL 60 to a 50 then 40 until finally a 30 through a village where there is a school that fronts the main road. Now people almost break their necks and the 30mph limit to get in front of a steadily moving line of traffic on this road only to turn off a little way past the school...I have never understood why.

well, to be fair I didn't mention a line of traffic, just someone driving very slow who's impossible to overtake, then speeds up on the overtaking bits.
These drivers also tend to a bit unpredictable with their braking, creating stress.

So, the prize is making progress, saving fuel, and lower stress levels.

What's wrong with being slower in the bends than the straights ?
Perhaps they think they are driving at an appropriate & legal speed for both & it's you that's trying to out drive the limit point on the bends.

Edited by vonhosen on Sunday 13th September 18:42

You know full well that he's not talking about people driving to the limit point but people who brake for any hint of a curve and brake to a very low speed. You know it, but you still post this.

[vonhosen]

Zod said:

vonhosen said:

bryan35 said:

oldsoak said:

Unless they were travelling slowly ALL THE TIME thus holding you up, why would you need to overtake at all?
Is it the 'red mist' we hear about that insists we MUST be in front...what?
Is there some sort of prize for getting in front of a line of traffic?
Genuine question, as there is a road near me B1230 (partial D/C)where it drops from a NSL 60 to a 50 then 40 until finally a 30 through a village where there is a school that fronts the main road. Now people almost break their necks and the 30mph limit to get in front of a steadily moving line of traffic on this road only to turn off a little way past the school...I have never understood why.

well, to be fair I didn't mention a line of traffic, just someone driving very slow who's impossible to overtake, then speeds up on the overtaking bits.
These drivers also tend to a bit unpredictable with their braking, creating stress.

So, the prize is making progress, saving fuel, and lower stress levels.

What's wrong with being slower in the bends than the straights ?
Perhaps they think they are driving at an appropriate & legal speed for both & it's you that's trying to out drive the limit point on the bends.

You know full well that he's not talking about people driving to the limit point but people who brake for any hint of a curve and brake to a very low speed. You know it, but you still post this.

There isn't anything wrong with a driver not driving exactly to the limit point (it's better to be a little under, than a little over). Of course neither you nor I know to what degree this other driver was driving in relation to the limit point. We know the OP's interpretation of it, but we don't know that if you or I witnessed it we would agree with the OP's assessment.

Edited by vonhosen on Sunday 13th September 23:13

[rs1952]

vonhosen said:

There isn't anything wrong with a driver not driving exactly to the limit point (it's better to be a little under, than a little over). .

P'raps you ought to remind your colleague Pedmeister of this over on the "unmarked plod" thread, as he seems to think that doing 28 on a 30-limited DC is unreasonable


(smilie aimed at Ped, not you )

[Zod]

vonhosen said:

Zod said:

vonhosen said:

bryan35 said:

oldsoak said:

Unless they were travelling slowly ALL THE TIME thus holding you up, why would you need to overtake at all?
Is it the 'red mist' we hear about that insists we MUST be in front...what?
Is there some sort of prize for getting in front of a line of traffic?
Genuine question, as there is a road near me B1230 (partial D/C)where it drops from a NSL 60 to a 50 then 40 until finally a 30 through a village where there is a school that fronts the main road. Now people almost break their necks and the 30mph limit to get in front of a steadily moving line of traffic on this road only to turn off a little way past the school...I have never understood why.

well, to be fair I didn't mention a line of traffic, just someone driving very slow who's impossible to overtake, then speeds up on the overtaking bits.
These drivers also tend to a bit unpredictable with their braking, creating stress.

So, the prize is making progress, saving fuel, and lower stress levels.

What's wrong with being slower in the bends than the straights ?
Perhaps they think they are driving at an appropriate & legal speed for both & it's you that's trying to out drive the limit point on the bends.

You know full well that he's not talking about people driving to the limit point but people who brake for any hint of a curve and brake to a very low speed. You know it, but you still post this.

There isn't anything wrong with a driver not driving exactly to the limit point (it's better to be a little under, than a little over). Of course neither you nor I know to what degree this other driver was driving in relation to the limit point. We know the OP's interpretation of it, but we don't know that if you or I witnessed it we would agree with the OP's assessment.

Edited by vonhosen on Sunday 13th September 23:13

You've never seen one of those drivers who brakes down to a very low speed for any bend, however slight and holds the foot on the brake until the steering is unwound? That is what he was referring to.

And, of course, one doesn't go driving exactly to the limit point most of the time. I like to have a safety margin, as do most sensible drivers.

[vonhosen]

Zod said:

vonhosen said:

Zod said:

vonhosen said:

bryan35 said:

oldsoak said:

Unless they were travelling slowly ALL THE TIME thus holding you up, why would you need to overtake at all?
Is it the 'red mist' we hear about that insists we MUST be in front...what?
Is there some sort of prize for getting in front of a line of traffic?
Genuine question, as there is a road near me B1230 (partial D/C)where it drops from a NSL 60 to a 50 then 40 until finally a 30 through a village where there is a school that fronts the main road. Now people almost break their necks and the 30mph limit to get in front of a steadily moving line of traffic on this road only to turn off a little way past the school...I have never understood why.

well, to be fair I didn't mention a line of traffic, just someone driving very slow who's impossible to overtake, then speeds up on the overtaking bits.
These drivers also tend to a bit unpredictable with their braking, creating stress.

So, the prize is making progress, saving fuel, and lower stress levels.

What's wrong with being slower in the bends than the straights ?
Perhaps they think they are driving at an appropriate & legal speed for both & it's you that's trying to out drive the limit point on the bends.

You know full well that he's not talking about people driving to the limit point but people who brake for any hint of a curve and brake to a very low speed. You know it, but you still post this.

There isn't anything wrong with a driver not driving exactly to the limit point (it's better to be a little under, than a little over). Of course neither you nor I know to what degree this other driver was driving in relation to the limit point. We know the OP's interpretation of it, but we don't know that if you or I witnessed it we would agree with the OP's assessment.

Edited by vonhosen on Sunday 13th September 23:13

You've never seen one of those drivers who brakes down to a very low speed for any bend, however slight and holds the foot on the brake until the steering is unwound? That is what he was referring to.

And, of course, one doesn't go driving exactly to the limit point most of the time. I like to have a safety margin, as do most sensible drivers.

Yes I know how the OP says he sees it, but I don't know (as I haven't seen it) that I'd agree with his interpretation in this particular case. I might, I might not. An allegation is just that, an allegation, without going further evidence we can't say that is a just allegation.

[Zod]

Forget your eternal mission to remind us that we don't have all the facts on the case in question and just agree or disagree that there is a phenomenon such as I have described. It is not exactly difficult to spot, so your doubt of bryan35's (not the OP's) premise is difficult to regard as helpful.

[dangerous brain]

I have the constant joy of sitting behind what I will only class as complete berks on a daily basis on a major A road with lots of sequential bends and very few straights (most of which are actually in 40 limits). Its 17-18 miles long and can stretch my working day by half an hour easily. Thats very frustrating.

Justification for calling them berks??? Well my rule of thumb is if there's a car holding up a lorry or in fact many lorries, said individual driving that car is a berk plain as. More justification, individuals that drive at 40 and less in the NSL portions of the road and then speed up to 50 plus in the 40's I would also place in the berk category. Individuals that drive through the sweeping bends at 40 and less and then speed up on the only overtaking sections to 5 mph of the NSL and then speed up as you overtake them (fair point you shouldn't exceed the NSL but you know the instant you get to the next hint of a corner you'll be back to 40 and below again for 10 more miles) would fit nicely into the berk category. And to answer the limit point before its raised, I have experienced close to 3 figure speeds along most of the NSL sections of that road without stepping over the limit point so 40 just isn't limit point, even for a hoofing great truck on slicks in the rain.

[vonhosen]

Zod said:

Forget your eternal mission to remind us that we don't have all the facts on the case in question and just agree or disagree that there is a phenomenon such as I have described. It is not exactly difficult to spot, so your doubt of bryan35's (not the OP's) premise is difficult to regard as helpful.

And taking it at face value doesn't mean it's exactly how it happened, or would you have it that I'd castigate you on the word of anyone on the internet who criticised your driving ?

Yep we all know there are bad drivers out there, but we also know that a lot of the time the greater problem is those who perceive others as bad drivers rather than themselves & we can't tell from here what's what. The OP can of course vent his spleen but it changes nothing. I myself don't worry about the driving of others, I deal with it & just continue on my way, that's far less stressful.

As it happens if I had witnessed the described event I may have agreed with the OP or I may not. I'm not going to waste time wondering or worrying about it though, because there is too little to form an accurate opinion on. I'm going for a drive instead, whilst doing my best not to worry about the driving of others & also doing my best not to get into any conflict with them.

Edited by vonhosen on Monday 14th September 06:51

[p1esk]

vonhosen said:

bryan35 said:

oldsoak said:

Unless they were travelling slowly ALL THE TIME thus holding you up, why would you need to overtake at all?
Is it the 'red mist' we hear about that insists we MUST be in front...what?
Is there some sort of prize for getting in front of a line of traffic?
Genuine question, as there is a road near me B1230 (partial D/C)where it drops from a NSL 60 to a 50 then 40 until finally a 30 through a village where there is a school that fronts the main road. Now people almost break their necks and the 30mph limit to get in front of a steadily moving line of traffic on this road only to turn off a little way past the school...I have never understood why.

well, to be fair I didn't mention a line of traffic, just someone driving very slow who's impossible to overtake, then speeds up on the overtaking bits.
These drivers also tend to a bit unpredictable with their braking, creating stress.

So, the prize is making progress, saving fuel, and lower stress levels.

What's wrong with being slower in the bends than the straights ?
Perhaps they think they are driving at an appropriate & legal speed for both & it's you that's trying to out drive the limit point on the bends.

Edited by vonhosen on Sunday 13th September 18:42

'They' probably don't know anything about limit points.

I'm not sure that I'm fully up to speed with them either. I have my own strange version, but it seems to work!

Best wishes all,
Dave.

[p1esk]

Zod said:

vonhosen said:

bryan35 said:

oldsoak said:

Unless they were travelling slowly ALL THE TIME thus holding you up, why would you need to overtake at all?
Is it the 'red mist' we hear about that insists we MUST be in front...what?
Is there some sort of prize for getting in front of a line of traffic?
Genuine question, as there is a road near me B1230 (partial D/C)where it drops from a NSL 60 to a 50 then 40 until finally a 30 through a village where there is a school that fronts the main road. Now people almost break their necks and the 30mph limit to get in front of a steadily moving line of traffic on this road only to turn off a little way past the school...I have never understood why.

well, to be fair I didn't mention a line of traffic, just someone driving very slow who's impossible to overtake, then speeds up on the overtaking bits.
These drivers also tend to a bit unpredictable with their braking, creating stress.

So, the prize is making progress, saving fuel, and lower stress levels.

What's wrong with being slower in the bends than the straights ?
Perhaps they think they are driving at an appropriate & legal speed for both & it's you that's trying to out drive the limit point on the bends.

Edited by vonhosen on Sunday 13th September 18:42

You know full well that he's not talking about people driving to the limit point but people who brake for any hint of a curve and brake to a very low speed. You know it, but you still post this.

Perhaps Von has a mischievous streak.

....but I know what you mean about people who are forever touching the brakes at the mere sight of a bend, even when they are already driving quite slowly.

Best wishes all,
Dave.

[Johnnytheboy]

dangerous brain said:

I have the constant joy of sitting behind what I will only class as complete berks on a daily basis on a major A road with lots of sequential bends and very few straights (most of which are actually in 40 limits). Its 17-18 miles long and can stretch my working day by half an hour easily. Thats very frustrating.

Justification for calling them berks??? Well my rule of thumb is if there's a car holding up a lorry or in fact many lorries, said individual driving that car is a berk plain as. More justification, individuals that drive at 40 and less in the NSL portions of the road and then speed up to 50 plus in the 40's I would also place in the berk category. Individuals that drive through the sweeping bends at 40 and less and then speed up on the only overtaking sections to 5 mph of the NSL and then speed up as you overtake them (fair point you shouldn't exceed the NSL but you know the instant you get to the next hint of a corner you'll be back to 40 and below again for 10 more miles) would fit nicely into the berk category. And to answer the limit point before its raised, I have experienced close to 3 figure speeds along most of the NSL sections of that road without stepping over the limit point so 40 just isn't limit point, even for a hoofing great truck on slicks in the rain.

I had a very frustrating journey across the Mendips today following a guy in a (wait for it...) Zafira, who drove all the way up Cheddar Gorge at an utter crawl (20 max), then set off at exactly 60 when the road straightened out, but then slowed to an utter crawl round every subsequent bend.

[EU_Foreigner]

In that case I would be done for tailgating trying to push him along and speeding when I would be doing 80 or so to make sure I got rid of him.

Maybe wrong in the eyes of the law, but right in my eyes so sod the law.

[Davidonly]

vonhosen said:

Zod said:

vonhosen said:

bryan35 said:

oldsoak said:

Unless they were travelling slowly ALL THE TIME thus holding you up, why would you need to overtake at all?
Is it the 'red mist' we hear about that insists we MUST be in front...what?
Is there some sort of prize for getting in front of a line of traffic?
Genuine question, as there is a road near me B1230 (partial D/C)where it drops from a NSL 60 to a 50 then 40 until finally a 30 through a village where there is a school that fronts the main road. Now people almost break their necks and the 30mph limit to get in front of a steadily moving line of traffic on this road only to turn off a little way past the school...I have never understood why.

well, to be fair I didn't mention a line of traffic, just someone driving very slow who's impossible to overtake, then speeds up on the overtaking bits.
These drivers also tend to a bit unpredictable with their braking, creating stress.

So, the prize is making progress, saving fuel, and lower stress levels.

What's wrong with being slower in the bends than the straights ?
Perhaps they think they are driving at an appropriate & legal speed for both & it's you that's trying to out drive the limit point on the bends.

You know full well that he's not talking about people driving to the limit point but people who brake for any hint of a curve and brake to a very low speed. You know it, but you still post this.

There isn't anything wrong with a driver not driving exactly to the limit point (it's better to be a little under, than a little over). Of course neither you nor I know to what degree this other driver was driving in relation to the limit point. We know the OP's interpretation of it, but we don't know that if you or I witnessed it we would agree with the OP's assessment.

Edited by vonhosen on Sunday 13th September 23:13

Does not the 'better a little under than over' highlight the idea that the limits MIGHT be wrong in the first place? Speed limits are a dangerous generalistion!

[fluffnik]

Davidonly said:

Does not the 'better a little under than over' highlight the idea that the limits MIGHT be wrong in the first place? Speed limits are a dangerous generalistion!

Speed limits do indeed provide dangerous disinformation.

We must destroy the evil gangsters who profit by them.

[vonhosen]

Davidonly said:

vonhosen said:

Zod said:

vonhosen said:

bryan35 said:

oldsoak said:

Unless they were travelling slowly ALL THE TIME thus holding you up, why would you need to overtake at all?
Is it the 'red mist' we hear about that insists we MUST be in front...what?
Is there some sort of prize for getting in front of a line of traffic?
Genuine question, as there is a road near me B1230 (partial D/C)where it drops from a NSL 60 to a 50 then 40 until finally a 30 through a village where there is a school that fronts the main road. Now people almost break their necks and the 30mph limit to get in front of a steadily moving line of traffic on this road only to turn off a little way past the school...I have never understood why.

well, to be fair I didn't mention a line of traffic, just someone driving very slow who's impossible to overtake, then speeds up on the overtaking bits.
These drivers also tend to a bit unpredictable with their braking, creating stress.

So, the prize is making progress, saving fuel, and lower stress levels.

What's wrong with being slower in the bends than the straights ?
Perhaps they think they are driving at an appropriate & legal speed for both & it's you that's trying to out drive the limit point on the bends.

You know full well that he's not talking about people driving to the limit point but people who brake for any hint of a curve and brake to a very low speed. You know it, but you still post this.

There isn't anything wrong with a driver not driving exactly to the limit point (it's better to be a little under, than a little over). Of course neither you nor I know to what degree this other driver was driving in relation to the limit point. We know the OP's interpretation of it, but we don't know that if you or I witnessed it we would agree with the OP's assessment.

Edited by vonhosen on Sunday 13th September 23:13

Does not the 'better a little under than over' highlight the idea that the limits MIGHT be wrong in the first place? Speed limits are a dangerous generalistion!

The limit point isn't wrong & being within it is better than being too quick for it.

[fluffnik]

vonhosen said:

The limit point isn't wrong & being within it is better than being too quick for it.

Yes. The arbitrary number on the stick serves only to confuse matters.

[vonhosen]

fluffnik said:

vonhosen said:

The limit point isn't wrong & being within it is better than being too quick for it.

Yes. The arbitrary number on the stick serves only to confuse matters.

It's not confusing at all, it's pretty clear.

[fluffnik]

vonhosen said:

fluffnik said:

vonhosen said:

The limit point isn't wrong & being within it is better than being too quick for it.

Yes. The arbitrary number on the stick serves only to confuse matters.

It's not confusing at all, it's pretty clear.

The posted limit may be stark and unambiguous but it does not inform nor clarify.

There is no consistent relationship between posted limits and the speed required to drive within the limit point.

The arbitrary number on the stick serves only to confuse matters.

The law is petty and worthy only of contempt.