Car nicked - lawyer needed!
Discussion
Ok, to clarify - the debt owed is only for the rent of the garage, nothing else at all and there is no other dispute or indeed connection between her and I.
She did drop a letter through my door giving me 21 days notice and I was indeed out of the country for 2 weeks. As someone said that leaves a week unaccounted for. When I called her on my return she told me about the letter which I then found in a pile of post which I had yet to go through from when I was away. Neither her or I can prove the date it was delivered.
As a little back story - I had said some 3 months ago approx that I no longer wanted the garage but would continue to rent it from her until she or I found a person to take it over. Obviously, I was happy to pay rent over that period assuming that the rent remained the same and that she gave me good notice. To facilitate this, we agreed to stop paying on a monthly basis and to pay a daily rate. This rate was based on a pro-rata rent which was fine. Nothing exists in writing as there was never any contract between us.
She claims to have called and emailed me. She does not have my email address and if she found it somewhere I simply never received her email so I find that somewhat odd. As for phone calls, she claims to have called me, I think it strange I have no missed calls or messages from her.
She took such extreme action for reasons I simply don't understand. The new tenant of the garage is the same chap who removed the car and has yet to start using it, nor was he in any rush to do so. In fact, I understand that she offered him the garage afterwards.
As for the legalities of the car removal and crushing - I understand there was a letter from her lawyer (who is her son-in-law so no cost) but I have not seen it yet.
Both her and her husband have something of a reputation, one I was unaware of, of being fairly unpleasant people to deal with.
All of those of you who have commented that you want more info - fair enough! I think this covers everything but as I am asking for lawyers and of course any advice, please ask away! If my summation above comes across as a little terse it is only as it is meant to be factual and I do infact appreciate all comments and opinions (unless they disagree with me obviously ;-) ).
And what is TWOC?!
She did drop a letter through my door giving me 21 days notice and I was indeed out of the country for 2 weeks. As someone said that leaves a week unaccounted for. When I called her on my return she told me about the letter which I then found in a pile of post which I had yet to go through from when I was away. Neither her or I can prove the date it was delivered.
As a little back story - I had said some 3 months ago approx that I no longer wanted the garage but would continue to rent it from her until she or I found a person to take it over. Obviously, I was happy to pay rent over that period assuming that the rent remained the same and that she gave me good notice. To facilitate this, we agreed to stop paying on a monthly basis and to pay a daily rate. This rate was based on a pro-rata rent which was fine. Nothing exists in writing as there was never any contract between us.
She claims to have called and emailed me. She does not have my email address and if she found it somewhere I simply never received her email so I find that somewhat odd. As for phone calls, she claims to have called me, I think it strange I have no missed calls or messages from her.
She took such extreme action for reasons I simply don't understand. The new tenant of the garage is the same chap who removed the car and has yet to start using it, nor was he in any rush to do so. In fact, I understand that she offered him the garage afterwards.
As for the legalities of the car removal and crushing - I understand there was a letter from her lawyer (who is her son-in-law so no cost) but I have not seen it yet.
Both her and her husband have something of a reputation, one I was unaware of, of being fairly unpleasant people to deal with.
All of those of you who have commented that you want more info - fair enough! I think this covers everything but as I am asking for lawyers and of course any advice, please ask away! If my summation above comes across as a little terse it is only as it is meant to be factual and I do infact appreciate all comments and opinions (unless they disagree with me obviously ;-) ).
And what is TWOC?!
Pappa Lurve said:
Ok, to clarify - the debt owed is only for the rent of the garage, nothing else at all and there is no other dispute or indeed connection between her and I.
She did drop a letter through my door giving me 21 days notice and I was indeed out of the country for 2 weeks. As someone said that leaves a week unaccounted for. When I called her on my return she told me about the letter which I then found in a pile of post which I had yet to go through from when I was away. Neither her or I can prove the date it was delivered.
As a little back story - I had said some 3 months ago approx that I no longer wanted the garage but would continue to rent it from her until she or I found a person to take it over. Obviously, I was happy to pay rent over that period assuming that the rent remained the same and that she gave me good notice. To facilitate this, we agreed to stop paying on a monthly basis and to pay a daily rate. This rate was based on a pro-rata rent which was fine. Nothing exists in writing as there was never any contract between us.
She claims to have called and emailed me. She does not have my email address and if she found it somewhere I simply never received her email so I find that somewhat odd. As for phone calls, she claims to have called me, I think it strange I have no missed calls or messages from her.
She took such extreme action for reasons I simply don't understand. The new tenant of the garage is the same chap who removed the car and has yet to start using it, nor was he in any rush to do so. In fact, I understand that she offered him the garage afterwards.
As for the legalities of the car removal and crushing - I understand there was a letter from her lawyer (who is her son-in-law so no cost) but I have not seen it yet.
Both her and her husband have something of a reputation, one I was unaware of, of being fairly unpleasant people to deal with.
All of those of you who have commented that you want more info - fair enough! I think this covers everything but as I am asking for lawyers and of course any advice, please ask away! If my summation above comes across as a little terse it is only as it is meant to be factual and I do infact appreciate all comments and opinions (unless they disagree with me obviously ;-) ).
And what is TWOC?!
YHM mail, see if you can use any part of it and go to the police.She did drop a letter through my door giving me 21 days notice and I was indeed out of the country for 2 weeks. As someone said that leaves a week unaccounted for. When I called her on my return she told me about the letter which I then found in a pile of post which I had yet to go through from when I was away. Neither her or I can prove the date it was delivered.
As a little back story - I had said some 3 months ago approx that I no longer wanted the garage but would continue to rent it from her until she or I found a person to take it over. Obviously, I was happy to pay rent over that period assuming that the rent remained the same and that she gave me good notice. To facilitate this, we agreed to stop paying on a monthly basis and to pay a daily rate. This rate was based on a pro-rata rent which was fine. Nothing exists in writing as there was never any contract between us.
She claims to have called and emailed me. She does not have my email address and if she found it somewhere I simply never received her email so I find that somewhat odd. As for phone calls, she claims to have called me, I think it strange I have no missed calls or messages from her.
She took such extreme action for reasons I simply don't understand. The new tenant of the garage is the same chap who removed the car and has yet to start using it, nor was he in any rush to do so. In fact, I understand that she offered him the garage afterwards.
As for the legalities of the car removal and crushing - I understand there was a letter from her lawyer (who is her son-in-law so no cost) but I have not seen it yet.
Both her and her husband have something of a reputation, one I was unaware of, of being fairly unpleasant people to deal with.
All of those of you who have commented that you want more info - fair enough! I think this covers everything but as I am asking for lawyers and of course any advice, please ask away! If my summation above comes across as a little terse it is only as it is meant to be factual and I do infact appreciate all comments and opinions (unless they disagree with me obviously ;-) ).
And what is TWOC?!
You need professional advice, but from what you've said her lawyer chap would appear to be along the lines of you having a contract (to hire the garage) that she terminated and gave notice that if you didn't remove your stuff so she did.
I'd say your defence was that you didn't get the notice that a) the contract was terminated, *and* (not or) b) her warning that she would dispose of your stuff.
Ie. if you had received a letter / email / phone call saying "I'm going to crush your car" you'd be round there and remove it yourself.
One thing my solicitor told me (from my experience a few posts up) was that I had to be VERY sure he had the notice, hence when he returned the recorded delivery I sent email/fax/letter each day for 7 days.
I'd say your defence was that you didn't get the notice that a) the contract was terminated, *and* (not or) b) her warning that she would dispose of your stuff.
Ie. if you had received a letter / email / phone call saying "I'm going to crush your car" you'd be round there and remove it yourself.
One thing my solicitor told me (from my experience a few posts up) was that I had to be VERY sure he had the notice, hence when he returned the recorded delivery I sent email/fax/letter each day for 7 days.
Dupont666 said:
can the argument be used that since it was not recorded delivery its her word that she gave you enough time and if it was recorded delivery she would have known that you were away?
DVLA/Police use that all the time, so does ebay with faulty items....
Certainly.DVLA/Police use that all the time, so does ebay with faulty items....
The contract was in force until it is terminated.
The bottom line is in court you need to have acted reasonably. She was being paid for the rent on a daily rate. It would be reasonable to give notice of termination, however, to remove someone's property and dispose of it, to have acted reasonably you would have had to take every step possible to cover for the fact that you are disposing of someone's goods.
IMHO writing once, and then disposing of goods a matter of days later is simply not good enough.
To give an idea, I had a client ignore an invoice. TO give an idea of reasonableness before asking someone to be out of pocket (over court fees) I wrote once, once again two weeks later, and then a final warning by Special Delivery to have proof of delivery.
IMHO a court will find the same. Considering that she would have to spend no more than £5 to give a fair and irrefutable warning would have been the minimum expected.
I certainly would not dispose of any goods until the matter had gone on months rather than weeks without contact, and only after I make a personal visit and sent a letter by Special Delivery.
She'll be personally liable for the goods. My advice to the OP is that I am 90% sure that this will end up in court as she won't pay. You don't need a hotshot lawyer for this one, it is pretty simple, and logistically if they are local and you file in your local court this will cut down on the costs of coming to court for hearings.
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