No MOT hit a bus at 17yrs old
Discussion
Hi all,
wondered if anyone can tell me what the likely outcome of this is. My son (17yrs old) has hit a bus, not much damage to bus but written his car off. Police involved and got a producer. Just got home and relaised the MOT ran out on the 7th March! Will he get points for this? I beleive if he gets 6 he will lose his licence, he only passed test 2 weeks ago,
thanks for any help,
Phil
>>> Edited by daxtojeiro on Monday 15th March 10:33
wondered if anyone can tell me what the likely outcome of this is. My son (17yrs old) has hit a bus, not much damage to bus but written his car off. Police involved and got a producer. Just got home and relaised the MOT ran out on the 7th March! Will he get points for this? I beleive if he gets 6 he will lose his licence, he only passed test 2 weeks ago,
thanks for any help,
Phil
>>> Edited by daxtojeiro on Monday 15th March 10:33
You have to inform your insurers as the police were involved. Whether or not you make a claim is up to you, but your insurers have to be notified of the accident. If no claim for repairs is submitted (by either party), the report stays on file as "for info only".
However, I don't suppose your average bus company will entertain the idea of not going through insurance. Companies normally have to go through official channels in the event of an accident.
As far as the MOT is concerned, there've been a couple of threads on this of late - you could do a search.
FWIW, someone I know hit a bus within weeks of passing his test - going too fast in a 30, tried to overtake stationary bus, bus pulled out. He got 6 points for that one.
I hope it all works out for your son. Best of luck.
However, I don't suppose your average bus company will entertain the idea of not going through insurance. Companies normally have to go through official channels in the event of an accident.
As far as the MOT is concerned, there've been a couple of threads on this of late - you could do a search.
FWIW, someone I know hit a bus within weeks of passing his test - going too fast in a 30, tried to overtake stationary bus, bus pulled out. He got 6 points for that one.
I hope it all works out for your son. Best of luck.
Your son will almost definately lose his license and have to take his tests again.
They seem to like throwing the book at younger drivers, maybe due to the 'boy-racer' image given them. I had to resit my test after an accident I caused (1.5 years after passing my first test).
Causing an accident, not having an MOT and posssibly invalid insurance will not be easy to shake
>> Edited by dick dastardly on Monday 15th March 11:58
They seem to like throwing the book at younger drivers, maybe due to the 'boy-racer' image given them. I had to resit my test after an accident I caused (1.5 years after passing my first test).
Causing an accident, not having an MOT and posssibly invalid insurance will not be easy to shake
>> Edited by dick dastardly on Monday 15th March 11:58
I would do a search on previous threads about expired MOTs,
I would also not worry too much about the lack of insurance for the moment.
The only thing you can do is take the documents to the police station and see what happens. Whose name was the car owned in? Yours or his? My suspicion is that if the car was owned and insured in your name with him as a named driver he might fare better than if it was in his name.
In this case the insurance would appear to be invalid as a technicality rather than delibaretly uninsured so it might be treated mre leniently.
However I suspect it will be better for all concerned if you see the Police sooner rather than later so at least know what, if any, action they are going to take.
However I would have thought there is a danger they could prosecute for driving without due car or similar. Assuming the buses brake lights were working of course!
I would also not worry too much about the lack of insurance for the moment.
The only thing you can do is take the documents to the police station and see what happens. Whose name was the car owned in? Yours or his? My suspicion is that if the car was owned and insured in your name with him as a named driver he might fare better than if it was in his name.
In this case the insurance would appear to be invalid as a technicality rather than delibaretly uninsured so it might be treated mre leniently.
However I suspect it will be better for all concerned if you see the Police sooner rather than later so at least know what, if any, action they are going to take.
However I would have thought there is a danger they could prosecute for driving without due car or similar. Assuming the buses brake lights were working of course!
I actually own an accident repair company, whatever the legal rights and wrongs are - the reality is different;
Unless your son is requested to produce his documents at the local plod station then the insurance company is unlikely to ever know the vehicle is MOT-less. If he submits a claim to the ins company then he will be invited to get an estimate/repair at their approved repairer. We as a repairer will not ask to see MOT's/tax discs or driving licence (licence only required if you have a courtesy vehicle) most ins companies now work on imaging (Norwich Union, Provident, RoyalSunAlliance etc) so in most instances an engineer will never see the vehicle either.
Contrary to popular belief ins company do NOT try and wriggle out of every claim. Eg we've just done a 2.5k repair on an MG ZR. The rear tyres were down to the canvass, a contributory cause of the accident - the CIS assesor saw the vehicle and the claim was agreed straight away. We repair 25 cars a week and we have never had an insurance company turn down a claim due to lack of MOT, tax, dodgey tyres etc. They won't turn down a claim due to lack of MOT unless they can prove that the accident was caused by a defect that the MOT would have picked up on. This is notoriously difficult to prove and is just not cost/time effective.
Unless your son is requested to produce his documents at the local plod station then the insurance company is unlikely to ever know the vehicle is MOT-less. If he submits a claim to the ins company then he will be invited to get an estimate/repair at their approved repairer. We as a repairer will not ask to see MOT's/tax discs or driving licence (licence only required if you have a courtesy vehicle) most ins companies now work on imaging (Norwich Union, Provident, RoyalSunAlliance etc) so in most instances an engineer will never see the vehicle either.
Contrary to popular belief ins company do NOT try and wriggle out of every claim. Eg we've just done a 2.5k repair on an MG ZR. The rear tyres were down to the canvass, a contributory cause of the accident - the CIS assesor saw the vehicle and the claim was agreed straight away. We repair 25 cars a week and we have never had an insurance company turn down a claim due to lack of MOT, tax, dodgey tyres etc. They won't turn down a claim due to lack of MOT unless they can prove that the accident was caused by a defect that the MOT would have picked up on. This is notoriously difficult to prove and is just not cost/time effective.
go get a mot fast
the insharance will have to pay for the damage to the bus wether hes got a mot or not
the only thing the could tenicaly riggel out of is the damage to the car.
so dont tell the insharance about the no mot.
as for mot go get one fast and go down the station when there real busy.
some time they dont look too close at the desk and theres a chance they wont notice the date on the mot
flod it up and abuse the mot and make it a bit dog eared, so the the date on the crease line and dont show up to good
its worth a try.
the insharance will have to pay for the damage to the bus wether hes got a mot or not
the only thing the could tenicaly riggel out of is the damage to the car.
so dont tell the insharance about the no mot.
as for mot go get one fast and go down the station when there real busy.
some time they dont look too close at the desk and theres a chance they wont notice the date on the mot
flod it up and abuse the mot and make it a bit dog eared, so the the date on the crease line and dont show up to good
its worth a try.
If Plod attended and raised an accident report have they reported son for due care for running into bus? If they did and prosecuted then he could pick up 3 to 11 points and as stated at 6 points, as a new driver, would have to go back to learner status.
The offence of using a vehicle without an MOT certificate does not attract any points in the penalty, merely a fine. Now in view of the recent expiry of the MOT if one was taken out almost immediately then many CPS would not pursue the offence. As the vehicle is a "write off" then it looks as if you will have to take an offence on board.
Neither does it mean that the expiry of the MOT invalidates Insurance and as far as I am aware not many Insurance Companies query as to whether one is in force. This is because, at law, they cannot invalidate third party Insurance in relation to "the condition of the vehicle". But at civil, whilst they have to pay out to the third party, with defects they may try and claim back from your driver on the proviso in the policy that vehicle to be kept in good mechanical condition.
DVD
>> Edited by Dwight VanDriver on Monday 15th March 14:45
The offence of using a vehicle without an MOT certificate does not attract any points in the penalty, merely a fine. Now in view of the recent expiry of the MOT if one was taken out almost immediately then many CPS would not pursue the offence. As the vehicle is a "write off" then it looks as if you will have to take an offence on board.
Neither does it mean that the expiry of the MOT invalidates Insurance and as far as I am aware not many Insurance Companies query as to whether one is in force. This is because, at law, they cannot invalidate third party Insurance in relation to "the condition of the vehicle". But at civil, whilst they have to pay out to the third party, with defects they may try and claim back from your driver on the proviso in the policy that vehicle to be kept in good mechanical condition.
DVD
>> Edited by Dwight VanDriver on Monday 15th March 14:45
I crashed my car just shy of a year after passing my test. I was told i may be prosecuted for 'without due care' but they said they might offer me the 'Driver Improvement Scheme' course instead. I was interviewed by a copper and he deduced that my accident was down to lack of experience rather than driving like a loon, so i was offered the course.
It cost me £140 and was very informative. IMHO its far better to provide a driver with extra training rather than just send him/her back out onto the road with a few penalty points.
It cost me £140 and was very informative. IMHO its far better to provide a driver with extra training rather than just send him/her back out onto the road with a few penalty points.
Not necessarily so although should have been told he would be reported. Not a crucial requirement.
Details will have recorded and sent back to the Officer issuing the Producer, who is presumably the Officer dealing with the accident. If he puts a due care file into CPS may well add No MOT and then in the lap of the Gods.
DVD
Details will have recorded and sent back to the Officer issuing the Producer, who is presumably the Officer dealing with the accident. If he puts a due care file into CPS may well add No MOT and then in the lap of the Gods.
DVD
Hi, Quite a few conflicting pieces of advice on this tread. Firstly, once an insurance cert has been issued by an insurance company it will cover the policy holder and named drivers for third party risks until the point where the company contacts you and cancels the policy, even if you have made a false declaration to obtain it. This is why the offence of making a false declaration to obtain insurance exists. If the insurance policy was fully comp they would have a reason for refusing to compensate for damage to the policy holders vehicle but they can't get out of third party claims. As far as the MOT is concerned they are still liable for third party risks MOT'd or not.
If you decide to settle the claim without involving your Ins Co you would still technically have to declare the accident to the Ins co.
If the accident were atributable to a mechanical defect which would have been an MOT fail point they could as far as I am aware make a claim through the civil courts to recover their costs from the policy holder.
The driver improvement scheme (DIS)has also been mentioned, this scheme, certainly in my area is only available when the only offence commited is careless driving (also known as Due Care and Attention) if the MOT offence is picked up on then this would be ruled out. A few threads have mentioned getting the car MOT'd. This would be impossible due to the accident damage, but do not be tempted by offers of "I can get you one for £50 no questions asked", no MOT is not endorsable and is just a fine, producing false docs is a criminal offence.
The points made by Dick Dastardly are not exactly correct , all new drivers are subject to a probationary period of 2 years if they aquire 6 or more points in the first 2 years the revert back to provisional licence status, ie they have to be accompanied and display 'L' plates they do not get 'banned' or loose their licence. This was brought in due to the high number of accidents caused by new and usually, young, drivers. It was aimed at identifying the ones which needed further training at an early stage, hopefully before they went on to get involved in more serious or fatal accidents. I for one think it is a good system, not just a means of throwing the book at young driver because of their 'boy racer' image.
If in doubt as to what is happening contact the officer dealing, his details will be at the bottom of the producer (HO/RT/1). Contry to popular belief most Traffic cops are quite helpful and willing to assist, just treat them as normal human beings.
>> Edited by john robson on Monday 15th March 22:22
>> Edited by john robson on Monday 15th March 22:38
If you decide to settle the claim without involving your Ins Co you would still technically have to declare the accident to the Ins co.
If the accident were atributable to a mechanical defect which would have been an MOT fail point they could as far as I am aware make a claim through the civil courts to recover their costs from the policy holder.
The driver improvement scheme (DIS)has also been mentioned, this scheme, certainly in my area is only available when the only offence commited is careless driving (also known as Due Care and Attention) if the MOT offence is picked up on then this would be ruled out. A few threads have mentioned getting the car MOT'd. This would be impossible due to the accident damage, but do not be tempted by offers of "I can get you one for £50 no questions asked", no MOT is not endorsable and is just a fine, producing false docs is a criminal offence.
The points made by Dick Dastardly are not exactly correct , all new drivers are subject to a probationary period of 2 years if they aquire 6 or more points in the first 2 years the revert back to provisional licence status, ie they have to be accompanied and display 'L' plates they do not get 'banned' or loose their licence. This was brought in due to the high number of accidents caused by new and usually, young, drivers. It was aimed at identifying the ones which needed further training at an early stage, hopefully before they went on to get involved in more serious or fatal accidents. I for one think it is a good system, not just a means of throwing the book at young driver because of their 'boy racer' image.
If in doubt as to what is happening contact the officer dealing, his details will be at the bottom of the producer (HO/RT/1). Contry to popular belief most Traffic cops are quite helpful and willing to assist, just treat them as normal human beings.
>> Edited by john robson on Monday 15th March 22:22
>> Edited by john robson on Monday 15th March 22:38
Gassing Station | Speed, Plod & the Law | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff