seat belts

[freebee]

My series 3 2006 Supersport has saloon car type retractable seat belts which I would like to change. Its mostly for road use but I might do the odd track day what should I fit in its place 4, 5,or 6 point harnesses??

I notice on fleabay a few harnesses that are out of date- if they are in good condition does that matter??

[Fatrat]

Its your life (and your passengers)

Buy new!

I have got 4 point harnesses and would not have anything less. Certainly a good call to replace the standard seat belt. If you have a significant frontal impact by the time an ordinary seat belt realises what is happening your face will be in the steering wheel boss and then you will be picking your teeth out of the footwell

Edited by Fatrat on Tuesday 23 April 15:28

[DCL]

Being out of date isn't particularly an issue for non competitive use. But buying second you just don't know the history of the seat belt and any accident damage may not be obvious. Best to buy new as they don't cost that much.

[framerateuk]

I think a 4 point is certainly fine for a Caterham. As Fatrat said, I wouldn't want anything less.

You're held in well with a 4 point, the only reason I can imagine wanting a 6 point is if you had to have one for competition use.

I'd like to get some new seatbelts for mine, they're looking pretty tatty and since the car was a demo car I think a lot of people have been in and out of them. Some nice new red ones would do very nicely .

[anonymous-user]

freebee said:

I notice on fleabay........

No, just no.
Three things to never scrimp on: parachutes, lifeboats and harnesses.

[V7SLR]

Interesting how negative some people are about buying s/h harnesses .... and therefore when buying a s/h car with them already fitted must undoubtedly rush out to buy replacements!

[Fatrat]

V7SLR said:

Interesting how negative some people are about buying s/h harnesses .... and therefore when buying a s/h car with them already fitted must undoubtedly rush out to buy replacements!

That's a fair point but if I was in the same position as the OP I would buy new.

[freebee]

Points well made 2 new 4 point it is

[BertBert]

Also out of interest, why 6 points for competition use and 4 for road? Surely a big road impact is the same as a big competition impact?
Bert

[anonymous-user]

V7SLR said:

Interesting how negative some people are about buying s/h harnesses .... and therefore when buying a s/h car with them already fitted must undoubtedly rush out to buy replacements!

The big difference is, if they're fitted to a road worthy car with an MOT there's a fair chance they're ok.
Loose s/h belts could've come out of any old smashed up wreck in a scrappy and thus been subjected to terminally damaging forces.

[SLR400]

Bob don't forget climbing rope
Definitely new 4 point harnesses

[V7SLR]

Crossflow Kid said:

The big difference is, if they're fitted to a road worthy car with an MOT there's a fair chance they're ok.
Loose s/h belts could've come out of any old smashed up wreck in a scrappy and thus been subjected to terminally damaging forces.

Obviously depends upon the particular harness! This of course is the advantage of the date tag ... my passenger harness was less than 12 months old when I bought the car, and the drivers harness I bought myself ... but both have now "expired" according to the date. I'd put more trust in them though than a harness only a couple of years old that's been in a smash!

Also, if you can stretch to the extra cost, buy the Caterham 6-point competition harness - http://www.caterhamparts.co.uk/product.php?id_prod...
6-point is better on both road and track, just a bit more faff to do up, but noticeably more comfy and secure when tightened to the level you would for track use, and it can be used as a 4-point if you want to. Additionally the competition harness has far superior shoulder strap adjusters which not only make adjusting much easier put also reduce the damage on the webbing due to adjustment - buckle damage is one of the most common forms of wear on a harness.

[TeflonTurd]

Crossflow Kid said:

The big difference is, if they're fitted to a road worthy car with an MOT there's a fair chance they're ok.
Loose s/h belts could've come out of any old smashed up wreck in a scrappy and thus been subjected to terminally damaging forces.

New harnesses could be Hong Kong fakes.

If buying 2nd hand harnesses, you should evaluate their condition and suitability before fitting. You should also ensure the correct fixings are used.

To be honest, 4 point harnesses are dangerous as they provide no protection against "submarining" where the occupant can slide under the waste belt. The submarining is exacerbated by the fact that tightening the shoulder straps lifts the waist belts. This does not happen with a conventional seat belt, which is also helped by the shape and surface texture of a conventional car seat. 4 points with Tillets = dangerous.

[Guy Lowe]

TeflonTurd said:

4 points with Tillets = dangerous.

I have Tillets and never drive without all 6 points 'dun up' & the same goes for my passengers. Because of the terrible leg injuries that can be caused by "submarining", I would always use 6 point harnesses in a Seven type car whatever seats I had fitted.
Guy

[anonymous-user]

TeflonTurd said:

New harnesses could be Hong Kong fakes.

...which is another reason not to buy safety critical stuff on eBay, new or not.

[Shaun_E]

These are good value, UK made and FIA approved: http://www.meteormotorsport.com/hardware/harnesses...

[framerateuk]

Guy Lowe said:

I have Tillets and never drive without all 6 points 'dun up' & the same goes for my passengers. Because of the terrible leg injuries that can be caused by "submarining", I would always use 6 point harnesses in a Seven type car whatever seats I had fitted.
Guy

How would you fit a 6 point with the standard leather seats? Don't you need additional holes in them?

[Aeroscreens]

6 point for me and passenger as I've always been concerned about the possibility of submarining.

6 point will work on standard S-type seats as the crotch strap comes through between the seat back and the seat squab and sits on the squab IYSWI6

[Guy Lowe]

framerateuk said:

How would you fit a 6 point with the standard leather seats? Don't you need additional holes in them?

Wot he said , thanks Chris. I have to say they are far easier to adjust with the standard seat than they are with Tillets

[framerateuk]

Been having a quick read around the topic and these seem to be a good choice too:

http://www.demon-tweeks.co.uk/motorsport/harnesses...

They're a 4 point but have an anti submarining mechanism where the shoulder straps release slightly on impact, lessening the chance of submarining.

I may consider them when I get around to replacing my harnesses over the winter.