Csr 260 advice
Discussion
Johnny7 (that was a great gun)
I have had a de Dion SV 150bhp and now own a CSR 260. I don't fit in an S3, so can't give you a direct comparison, but can give you an idea.
There are two main differences for me - power and suspension.
The CSR has more power than you need on the road - I rarely give it full beans (and never in the wet), but to it has loads of torque, even compared to the VVC engine I had previously, which means you can pull away in any gear at any speed (more or less). On a level road, without touching the accelerator, I can go through the gears from 1 to 6, by which time I am doing about 30mph in 6th. From there you can put your foot down and it will pull all the way to its terminal velocity. This means you can drive the car using the revs if you are in full attack mode, or leave it in 6th and cruise, depending on how you feel.
The IRS suspension is much better than the de Dion. You will be used to the way the rear of your car moves independently of the front of the car when going through a corner, but the IRS the CSR uses means the car feels more planted when pushing on - it sort of pitted-patters over the surface of the road, giving a much smoother ride.
The best thing I can advise is get yourself in obe!
Steve
I have had a de Dion SV 150bhp and now own a CSR 260. I don't fit in an S3, so can't give you a direct comparison, but can give you an idea.
There are two main differences for me - power and suspension.
The CSR has more power than you need on the road - I rarely give it full beans (and never in the wet), but to it has loads of torque, even compared to the VVC engine I had previously, which means you can pull away in any gear at any speed (more or less). On a level road, without touching the accelerator, I can go through the gears from 1 to 6, by which time I am doing about 30mph in 6th. From there you can put your foot down and it will pull all the way to its terminal velocity. This means you can drive the car using the revs if you are in full attack mode, or leave it in 6th and cruise, depending on how you feel.
The IRS suspension is much better than the de Dion. You will be used to the way the rear of your car moves independently of the front of the car when going through a corner, but the IRS the CSR uses means the car feels more planted when pushing on - it sort of pitted-patters over the surface of the road, giving a much smoother ride.
The best thing I can advise is get yourself in obe!
Steve
I have a CSR with the flat carbon dash. I spent quite a while looking for this when I was buying as personally I much prefer it to the swoopy dash that appears to be more common. With the flat dash you don't get the control stalks for indicators etc so you have to use dash mounted switches. I have also heard that the swoopy dash cars can be hotter in the footwells but as I have only had test drives I can't confirm this.
I agree with what has been posted by others about the ride and feel of the car. Personally I find mine to be geared too low and it is not much fun on a motorway. I'm currently investigating changing the diff ratio but I don't want to make it difficult to drive in traffic by having first too high. There are numerous threads covering the pros and cons of the six speed versus the five speed gearbox choice.
I agree with what has been posted by others about the ride and feel of the car. Personally I find mine to be geared too low and it is not much fun on a motorway. I'm currently investigating changing the diff ratio but I don't want to make it difficult to drive in traffic by having first too high. There are numerous threads covering the pros and cons of the six speed versus the five speed gearbox choice.
Johnny7 - I have the flat dash as the swoopy one takes too much knee room away (I am 6'5") and I quite like the flat dash, having got used to its quirks in my previous car.
Regarding the final drive ratio, it is a matter of taste - I have the 6 speed box as I like its rifle bolt action and the ability to select the right gear anywhere, but 70mph = 3500 rpm, although you do get used to it, (whilst it seems high, the Corsa 1.4 and Mini Cooper have similar ratios - although both have a bit more sound insulation admittedly).
Steve
Regarding the final drive ratio, it is a matter of taste - I have the 6 speed box as I like its rifle bolt action and the ability to select the right gear anywhere, but 70mph = 3500 rpm, although you do get used to it, (whilst it seems high, the Corsa 1.4 and Mini Cooper have similar ratios - although both have a bit more sound insulation admittedly).
Steve
just to balance up the arguemnt I have a dedion SV (on my 2nd one now) and like Mr Marsh, I cant fit in an S3 car as I am 6ft 5...
I drove my mates CSR for about 25miles on some nice b-roads around here and concur with all the comments made about power and ride quality... it was really really quick and the way it handled the bumps was amazing. I am in no doubt it would be the fastest caterham of the range on a bumpy scottish backroad..
BUT...
I did not prefer it to a de-dion car. One of the key aspects I love about the de-dion cars is you do not have to be doign warp factor 9 to have the car feel alive and moving around a little. I felt the CSR was too capable, too good and that actually took away some of the enjoyment for me. It actually did not feel as fast as I expected considering it had 100hp more than my SV at the time, but when you looked at the speedo you were shocked. 100mph in a CSR feels like nothing compared to an SV. I think I'd get done for speeding/locked up in no time in a CSR!!
My humble advise, take an extended drive in both on all sorts of roads. They might look the same but they drive like completely different beasts.
Just to really kick the hornets nest, I reckon a BGH/SPC 5speed box would be better in a CSR than a 6speed box. There is so much torque and power and the CSR is so well suited to longer journeys I would choose a 5sp for the overdrive 5th and long distance ability. 1st will still do 55mph but you'll be able to cruise at 80mph a lot more comfortably.
Cheers
Mike
I drove my mates CSR for about 25miles on some nice b-roads around here and concur with all the comments made about power and ride quality... it was really really quick and the way it handled the bumps was amazing. I am in no doubt it would be the fastest caterham of the range on a bumpy scottish backroad..
BUT...
I did not prefer it to a de-dion car. One of the key aspects I love about the de-dion cars is you do not have to be doign warp factor 9 to have the car feel alive and moving around a little. I felt the CSR was too capable, too good and that actually took away some of the enjoyment for me. It actually did not feel as fast as I expected considering it had 100hp more than my SV at the time, but when you looked at the speedo you were shocked. 100mph in a CSR feels like nothing compared to an SV. I think I'd get done for speeding/locked up in no time in a CSR!!
My humble advise, take an extended drive in both on all sorts of roads. They might look the same but they drive like completely different beasts.
Just to really kick the hornets nest, I reckon a BGH/SPC 5speed box would be better in a CSR than a 6speed box. There is so much torque and power and the CSR is so well suited to longer journeys I would choose a 5sp for the overdrive 5th and long distance ability. 1st will still do 55mph but you'll be able to cruise at 80mph a lot more comfortably.
Cheers
Mike
Thanks for the replys-- I do prefer the old flat dash-- it's what I'm used too and been a 5ft 10" 12 stone type I don't need the extra leg -room.
Mike has a point that has crossed my mind in that the csr is so capable that to grab- it by the scruff of the neck and feel like your really ragging it you would end-up driving at such a speed that you would end up in a lot of trouble--tempting but the rose tinted glasses have to come off- and I'm no Senna.
Mike has a point that has crossed my mind in that the csr is so capable that to grab- it by the scruff of the neck and feel like your really ragging it you would end-up driving at such a speed that you would end up in a lot of trouble--tempting but the rose tinted glasses have to come off- and I'm no Senna.
Many people wonder at the differences between both the CSR and the standard DD Sevens. Steve has summed up the differences perfectly.
I would only add, that, having owned a flat dash CSR 260 for a number of years, and now a swoopy dash 200 you will get used to either, and they both have their pros and cons, fitting in if you are a big lad, is obviously the most important thing. The swoopy dash tubes do get quite warm though, which is great for most of the year, but over the top on hot summer days.
The other thing worth thinking about in relation to how the car feels on the road, is that changing the rear wheels and tyres to narrower ones makes for a lot more fun. I've been playing around with 195's for the last couple of years, instead of the 245's which come with the car, these make the back end easier to boot out of shape, should you want that, but without ruining the great ride, although I don't think many CSR owners have been down this path, it does work though.
I would only add, that, having owned a flat dash CSR 260 for a number of years, and now a swoopy dash 200 you will get used to either, and they both have their pros and cons, fitting in if you are a big lad, is obviously the most important thing. The swoopy dash tubes do get quite warm though, which is great for most of the year, but over the top on hot summer days.
The other thing worth thinking about in relation to how the car feels on the road, is that changing the rear wheels and tyres to narrower ones makes for a lot more fun. I've been playing around with 195's for the last couple of years, instead of the 245's which come with the car, these make the back end easier to boot out of shape, should you want that, but without ruining the great ride, although I don't think many CSR owners have been down this path, it does work though.
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