Aircon in a Seven; from a commercial perspective, why not?
Discussion
I can see the appeal.
Not quite the same, but I used to have an MX5 without air-con. It was unbearable to drive on really hot days. We've had a lot of those in recent years - UK summer temperatures in the low to mid 30s.
I now have a Boxster, with air-con. Much more usable in the summer.
Not quite the same, but I used to have an MX5 without air-con. It was unbearable to drive on really hot days. We've had a lot of those in recent years - UK summer temperatures in the low to mid 30s.
I now have a Boxster, with air-con. Much more usable in the summer.
This reminds me of the issue Lord Sugar had when he introduced a PC that didn't need a cooling fan. He tried arguing with the customers that wanted fans, until he realised that he had forgotten the customer - if they want it and will buy it, let them have it - regardless of whether they need it!
Steve
Steve
My oh my. Why not add power assisted steering to make it easier for WAGs to park in Chelsea ? And a stereo with six speakers ? Sat-nav anyone ? Or why not just go out and buy a car with doors, electric windows, air bags, air con , a roof and all the other things that remove you from the sheer pleasure of driving ?
sjmmarsh said:
This reminds me of the issue Lord Sugar had when he introduced a PC that didn't need a cooling fan. He tried arguing with the customers that wanted fans, until he realised that he had forgotten the customer - if they want it and will buy it, let them have it - regardless of whether they need it!
Steve
Steve
Exactly. But 99.9% of Caterham customers wouldn't want air con. Lots don't even bother with a heater, carpets, even windscreens.
7s are already carrying too much middle aged spread.
(FWIW if we want comfortable open top motoring we take the SLK.........
)
REALIST123 said:
Exactly. But 99.9% of Caterham customers wouldn't want air con. Lots don't even bother with a heater, carpets, even windscreens.
I agree, but my point is that there might be additional set of less hardcore customers who could be tempted into a Caterham if A/C were added. If Caterham currently sell 500 Sevens a year to the existing 99.9%, my theory is that perhaps they could sell (say) another 50 if they added A/C as an option. Consequently, from a business perspective I still think there could be a market for a 'softer' Seven with A/C (and heater, and windscreen, and heated seats...), which would appeal to new customer groups, generating more sales and being beneficial for Caterham overall. As a result, unless there's a practical reason why they don't offer it (a compressor and pipework won't fit, for example) I'm surprised that they don't; it just seems like business sense to me.
For the record, I'm not saying I want A/C in a Seven, merely that I suspect the type of customer that the Harrods Signature Seven is aimed at probably would; I doubt very much that any of those models are going to see a track, for example!
chemistry said:
REALIST123 said:
Exactly. But 99.9% of Caterham customers wouldn't want air con. Lots don't even bother with a heater, carpets, even windscreens.
I agree, but my point is that there might be additional set of less hardcore customers who could be tempted into a Caterham if A/C were added. If Caterham currently sell 500 Sevens a year to the existing 99.9%, my theory is that perhaps they could sell (say) another 50 if they added A/C as an option. Consequently, from a business perspective I still think there could be a market for a 'softer' Seven with A/C (and heater, and windscreen, and heated seats...), which would appeal to new customer groups, generating more sales and being beneficial for Caterham overall. As a result, unless there's a practical reason why they don't offer it (a compressor and pipework won't fit, for example) I'm surprised that they don't; it just seems like business sense to me.
For the record, I'm not saying I want A/C in a Seven, merely that I suspect the type of customer that the Harrods Signature Seven is aimed at probably would; I doubt very much that any of those models are going to see a track, for example!
Maybe but I'm sure if there were even a small demand Caterham would do it. Then again with a six month and growing order book, maybe they wouldn't.
I don't know; thinking about my R400D, it's as noisy as sin, a hard ride and not really comfortable in any normal respect. Air con wouldn't begin to make it any more user friendly!
It's great fun on track though.........
I can say with absolute conviction that , along with a Bose sound system , roof rack , parking sensors and cruise control, in something like 2500 hours of driving Sevens the marque's inexplicable lack of aircon has not been uppermost , or indeed present at all , in my thoughts . Coming soon - double diffuser and DRS kit for your Dacia Stepway .....
Edited by coppice on Sunday 15th January 16:08
chemistry said:
For the record, I'm not saying I want A/C in a Seven, merely that I suspect the type of customer that the Harrods Signature Seven is aimed at probably would; I doubt very much that any of those models are going to see a track, for example!
Edited by bcr5784 on Sunday 15th January 08:18
chemistry said:
I'll probably get flamed for this, but from a commercial point of view I'm amazed that Caterham haven't found a way to get aircon into a Seven.
I fully appreciate that Sevens are all about 'adding lightness', but surely if they are targeting 'high end' customers with the Harrods signature model etc. then they must be losing sales to folks who see air-conditioning as a 'must have'. Surely folks like this chap would rather aircon than those unsightly chest patches http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2013/10/02/article-...
Ansar Ali has admitted that aircon is a deal breaker for many markets and would be an option in a new model (should that ever arrive!): "Ali says that means new customer requirements...you can tick a box for air-con...if we’re going to sell in the Far East, and India, and other emerging markets, no one’s going to buy a Seven...you’ll just die of heat exhaustion. We’ve got to be realistic about the opportunities and limitations of the Seven, and that’s where I see opportunities for new Caterham product." (http://www.carmagazine.co.uk/spy-shots/caterham/caterhams-new-sports-car-2015-the-full-scoop/).
So whilst I can see that aircon won't appeal to the purist, I am amazed that Catherham hasn't found a way to fit it into a standard S3/SV chassis and offer a 'soft, touring' Seven to customers who like the idea of a Caterham but don't want one if they can't have aircon.
Am I mad, or are Caterham missing out on a relatively quick and easy way to broaden the appeal of their car/brand and generate more sales?
chemistry
This isn't meant to come across rude or sarcastic - I'm just asking, but have you driven a seven?I fully appreciate that Sevens are all about 'adding lightness', but surely if they are targeting 'high end' customers with the Harrods signature model etc. then they must be losing sales to folks who see air-conditioning as a 'must have'. Surely folks like this chap would rather aircon than those unsightly chest patches http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2013/10/02/article-...
Ansar Ali has admitted that aircon is a deal breaker for many markets and would be an option in a new model (should that ever arrive!): "Ali says that means new customer requirements...you can tick a box for air-con...if we’re going to sell in the Far East, and India, and other emerging markets, no one’s going to buy a Seven...you’ll just die of heat exhaustion. We’ve got to be realistic about the opportunities and limitations of the Seven, and that’s where I see opportunities for new Caterham product." (http://www.carmagazine.co.uk/spy-shots/caterham/caterhams-new-sports-car-2015-the-full-scoop/).
So whilst I can see that aircon won't appeal to the purist, I am amazed that Catherham hasn't found a way to fit it into a standard S3/SV chassis and offer a 'soft, touring' Seven to customers who like the idea of a Caterham but don't want one if they can't have aircon.
Am I mad, or are Caterham missing out on a relatively quick and easy way to broaden the appeal of their car/brand and generate more sales?
chemistry
Aside from having to squeeze the air con system in, you're so exposed to the outside that it would be very little use. In a normal car you're sealed in with doors that have rubber sealing strips, in a seven there's no such thing. There's just a thin layer or metal between you and the engine, and the same to the outside. The heater to heat your legs, but it's not like having climate control in a tin-top, it works best at low speed and at high speeds you'll still get cold. The same would apply to air con.
The main point is, in warm weather you'd want to have the roof off! A seven is not a nice place to be in the heat with the roof on, not just because of the heat but also the vibrations and noise from the engine. Many people don't even bother with the full hood and end up with a half hood -leaving a gaping hole behind the driver for any air conditioned air to escape from.
For air con to be useful, you'd need something more Elise like, and I would certainly spec air con in one of those, but in a 7 it just wouldn't be practical.
If you want something civilised you just don't buy a 7. Heck, even with air con on a hot day, if you've got a Sigma 140 you're likely to have your feet cooked through the pedal box anything thanks to the position of the manifold, I think any air con would have to work overtime to solve that problem!
Edited by framerateuk on Monday 16th January 15:24
I can answer from the climate in Dubai, 48C in the summer and suicide in a Caterham! Heat exhaustion in 30 minutes max. Winter is great with temps at 20-25.
Fitting an aircon in this market would not help with sales at all, the people who do buy are hardcore enthusiasts and an aircon would not change that, Caterhams don't sell in large numbers here because they have no nose up value, no snob value in other words, no "look what I've got!
That's why there so many porkers, Ferraris, Astons, Veyrons, McLarens etc here, its a bling bling show off society.
Take a look at www.alainclass.com to see what I mean. Stacks and stacks of used supercars, and its very difficult to sell them here, there's not much nose up in a used car!
I would think China and the rest of South East Asia would be the same, I know it is in Singapore, those with funds want a showstopper, not a weird little "old fashioned" Caterham,
Fitting an aircon in this market would not help with sales at all, the people who do buy are hardcore enthusiasts and an aircon would not change that, Caterhams don't sell in large numbers here because they have no nose up value, no snob value in other words, no "look what I've got!
That's why there so many porkers, Ferraris, Astons, Veyrons, McLarens etc here, its a bling bling show off society.
Take a look at www.alainclass.com to see what I mean. Stacks and stacks of used supercars, and its very difficult to sell them here, there's not much nose up in a used car!
I would think China and the rest of South East Asia would be the same, I know it is in Singapore, those with funds want a showstopper, not a weird little "old fashioned" Caterham,
chemistry said:
So whilst I can see that aircon won't appeal to the purist, I am amazed that Catherham hasn't found a way to fit it into a standard S3/SV chassis and offer a 'soft, touring' Seven to customers who like the idea of a Caterham but don't want one if they can't have aircon.
Am I mad, or are Caterham missing out on a relatively quick and easy way to broaden the appeal of their car/brand and generate more sales?
chemistry
Mad to want air con in a 7 Am I mad, or are Caterham missing out on a relatively quick and easy way to broaden the appeal of their car/brand and generate more sales?
chemistry
whilst the 7 as pointed out gets very hot if you really need to keep cool http://www.fastraceproducts.com/cool-suit-shirts/r...
Gassing Station | Caterham | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff