2-Eleven v CSR 260
Discussion
Bafty_Crastard said:
mchammer89
"Oh and the KTM, come on, anyone who even thinks about that should get their head checked, can't believe its actually being compared here"
Having owned Caterhams for over 12 years can I suggest you need a re-think !!
Bafty
I'm not sure what price range the KTM is in, but i'm sure I would rather have a similarly priced Caterham, or maybe even an Atom. The KTM does have a lot of power, but its almost one and a half times the weight of the others which takes away quite a bit of that power. Also, I know it's a just an opinion but I think it looks horrible in comparison to the Cat."Oh and the KTM, come on, anyone who even thinks about that should get their head checked, can't believe its actually being compared here"
Having owned Caterhams for over 12 years can I suggest you need a re-think !!
Bafty
Bafty_Crastard said:
A style design award?…..I think not
Bafty
Perhaps it's just because I know what's in store when you get behind the wheel. But I like the way Caterhams look - good, solid, functional design.
I do find the KTM interesting - more so than, say, the Atom. But I suspect it'd ultimately be disappointing.
Pugsey said:
a corner like Coram is basically a matter of hanging on and how big you balls are - challenging yes, fun? not so sure - whereas the same corner in a Caterham is a never ending series of 'moments'. Great!!
Coram was OK - it's that bloody corner at the end of the pit straight that got me - late late late apex!...fantastic! rubystone said:
Coram was OK - it's that bloody corner at the end of the pit straight that got me - late late late apex!...fantastic!
All corners are worth it just to get to the bomb hole. That's great fun when hooked up properly.First track day I ever did was Snetterton and on my first laps I made a right old mess of Coram - nearly stuffed it (bad positioning, lack of commitment are killers on that corner and the run off seems much smaller when you have a few mph on
). One Tim Harvey set me straight. It's a very quick corner when done properly.
Murph7355 said:
rubystone said:
Coram was OK - it's that bloody corner at the end of the pit straight that got me - late late late apex!...fantastic!
All corners are worth it just to get to the bomb hole. That's great fun when hooked up properly.First track day I ever did was Snetterton and on my first laps I made a right old mess of Coram - nearly stuffed it (bad positioning, lack of commitment are killers on that corner and the run off seems much smaller when you have a few mph on
). One Tim Harvey set me straight. It's a very quick corner when done properly.
[quote]
You know what - I think that's one of the nicer automotive rear ends.
[/quote]
I can only describe styling as a little odd, a bit "quirky" derived from the 1950’s, completely over looked by it’s performance…but CC are getting left behind in the technology stakes moving the product forward
Good….not really….are we taking top of the range?...nope over priced !!
Solid….sorry more like fragile!!...bone of contention with me…beware use in the wet at your peril
Functional…well only just, but not as an every day ride
Bafty
You know what - I think that's one of the nicer automotive rear ends.
[/quote]
I can only describe styling as a little odd, a bit "quirky" derived from the 1950’s, completely over looked by it’s performance…but CC are getting left behind in the technology stakes moving the product forward
Good….not really….are we taking top of the range?...nope over priced !!
Solid….sorry more like fragile!!...bone of contention with me…beware use in the wet at your peril
Functional…well only just, but not as an every day ride
Bafty
Edited by Bafty_Crastard on Sunday 1st July 23:21
Mine was my only car for 5yrs. Got used in all weathers. Have done over 40k miles in it. Yup, it's being stripped now for some tlc (the car's 12yrs old) and a few mods (nothing essential, just because). But I don't really think that's too bad considering the hammer the car has received. I don't see them as that fragile.
As for moving the game on, I'm not convinced the "7-11" does that either tbh.
The KTM's interesting, but I'm at a loss to see why it should be so heavy. Much will undoubtedly be down to the choice of powerplant and the paraphernalia that goes with it I suspect. But moving the game on in my mind doesn't mean adding 50% to the weight of one of its competitors.
Styling - it's totally, 100% functional in my opinion. Looking at the rear:
1) Roll over bar - protection for the occupants. Could probably take a different shape I guess, but why bother?
2) Rear skin - hides the chassis tubes which are providing mounting points for rear suspension, diff, fuel tank etc.
3) Rear wings - cover the wheels. Track determined by chassis designers.
4) Lights - well needs something by law. It's one area I was sure could be done better, but the more I've looked at it, the more I've come to the conclusion that it looks right as it is.
5) There is no 5. That's it. Save the boot cover I guess (toyed with a hard one for my car's rebuild - too impractical when putting helmets etc in the boot so will be sticking to old faithful).
A number of the shapes could be done differently, but I suspect they'd add weight for nothing (it'd be more ali/tubing etc, and for what purpose).
We could argue that a spaceframe is outmoded, but the 7's chassis is very good at protecting its occupants whilst allowing those occupants to travel very quickly. I'm quite sure a glued ali tub is too, but it seems to cost in the weight stakes.
I think there's a reason the 7 has lasted as long as it has. And I'm not convinced the Elise/Exige/2-11/Europa/etc, KTM or the others will outlive it...regardless of its (many) shortcomings.
As for moving the game on, I'm not convinced the "7-11" does that either tbh.
The KTM's interesting, but I'm at a loss to see why it should be so heavy. Much will undoubtedly be down to the choice of powerplant and the paraphernalia that goes with it I suspect. But moving the game on in my mind doesn't mean adding 50% to the weight of one of its competitors.
Styling - it's totally, 100% functional in my opinion. Looking at the rear:
1) Roll over bar - protection for the occupants. Could probably take a different shape I guess, but why bother?
2) Rear skin - hides the chassis tubes which are providing mounting points for rear suspension, diff, fuel tank etc.
3) Rear wings - cover the wheels. Track determined by chassis designers.
4) Lights - well needs something by law. It's one area I was sure could be done better, but the more I've looked at it, the more I've come to the conclusion that it looks right as it is.
5) There is no 5. That's it. Save the boot cover I guess (toyed with a hard one for my car's rebuild - too impractical when putting helmets etc in the boot so will be sticking to old faithful).
A number of the shapes could be done differently, but I suspect they'd add weight for nothing (it'd be more ali/tubing etc, and for what purpose).
We could argue that a spaceframe is outmoded, but the 7's chassis is very good at protecting its occupants whilst allowing those occupants to travel very quickly. I'm quite sure a glued ali tub is too, but it seems to cost in the weight stakes.
I think there's a reason the 7 has lasted as long as it has. And I'm not convinced the Elise/Exige/2-11/Europa/etc, KTM or the others will outlive it...regardless of its (many) shortcomings.
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