RE: Caterham R500 Superlight Revealed
Discussion
Insane and all credit to the engineering!!
But £36k.......sorry no thanks.
Last November i went in a Westfield with a 4.3 V8 in. Ex Prescott Hill car. It was pushing out around 270 horses and had torque to match. It was quite easily pulling in the Gallardo that was also out doing the rounds that day. It was a life changing moment for me and by far the fastest accelerating car/best handling car i've ever been in (first car i've ever been slightly scared in.....LOVED IT!!) Apparently it had been weighed in at 650kilos. I have no reson to doubt it either.......Anyway, out of interest i asked the guy how much he paid for it, it was under £10k!!!!!!!
This is just my opinion but i'd pay £10k for a V8 Westfield/7 type car and keep the change, it makes no sense spending the extra £26k????. Nearly the same performance but with a much better soundtrack!!!!
But £36k.......sorry no thanks.
Last November i went in a Westfield with a 4.3 V8 in. Ex Prescott Hill car. It was pushing out around 270 horses and had torque to match. It was quite easily pulling in the Gallardo that was also out doing the rounds that day. It was a life changing moment for me and by far the fastest accelerating car/best handling car i've ever been in (first car i've ever been slightly scared in.....LOVED IT!!) Apparently it had been weighed in at 650kilos. I have no reson to doubt it either.......Anyway, out of interest i asked the guy how much he paid for it, it was under £10k!!!!!!!
This is just my opinion but i'd pay £10k for a V8 Westfield/7 type car and keep the change, it makes no sense spending the extra £26k????. Nearly the same performance but with a much better soundtrack!!!!
Wise words.
You will have 95% of the fun in *any* Caterfield as you will in that, without the expense.
Don't get me wrong I love the R500, it's cars like that, that push the development for others Se7ens. But, you've got to be seriously loaded to spend £36k on what, lets be honest, is a toy.
Dave81 said:
Insane and all credit to the engineering!!
But £36k.......sorry no thanks.
Last November i went in a Westfield with a 4.3 V8 in. Ex Prescott Hill car. It was pushing out around 270 horses and had torque to match. It was quite easily pulling in the Gallardo that was also out doing the rounds that day. It was a life changing moment for me and by far the fastest accelerating car/best handling car i've ever been in (first car i've ever been slightly scared in.....LOVED IT!!) Apparently it had been weighed in at 650kilos. I have no reson to doubt it either.......Anyway, out of interest i asked the guy how much he paid for it, it was under £10k!!!!!!!
This is just my opinion but i'd pay £10k for a V8 Westfield/7 type car and keep the change, it makes no sense spending the extra £26k????. Nearly the same performance but with a much better soundtrack!!!!
Ooohhhh, don't let the Caterham lot here you say things like that! They'll get all upset. But £36k.......sorry no thanks.
Last November i went in a Westfield with a 4.3 V8 in. Ex Prescott Hill car. It was pushing out around 270 horses and had torque to match. It was quite easily pulling in the Gallardo that was also out doing the rounds that day. It was a life changing moment for me and by far the fastest accelerating car/best handling car i've ever been in (first car i've ever been slightly scared in.....LOVED IT!!) Apparently it had been weighed in at 650kilos. I have no reson to doubt it either.......Anyway, out of interest i asked the guy how much he paid for it, it was under £10k!!!!!!!
This is just my opinion but i'd pay £10k for a V8 Westfield/7 type car and keep the change, it makes no sense spending the extra £26k????. Nearly the same performance but with a much better soundtrack!!!!
But it is a fair point for most people. Whilst I can appreciate the extra performance of the R500, I'd kill myself very quickly, as, along with most on here, I doubt I have the driving skills required to utilise much more than 75$% of it's true potential. If that much. I'll stick to the cheaper BEC stuff for now. More than rapid enough for me, ta muchly.
2.88 seconds......
Expensive, reliable?, old-school styling, blah, blah.
But, but- 2.88 seconds! sweet Geesus that is fast, like all these hyper-light-rocket ship this is a toy, maybe someone who can afford one (and you'd need to afford it with ease to consider owning one I'd imagine?) can tell me if Adrenaline via Accelration is your drug surely this will be seriously addictive, irrespective of the costs?
Expensive, reliable?, old-school styling, blah, blah.
But, but- 2.88 seconds! sweet Geesus that is fast, like all these hyper-light-rocket ship this is a toy, maybe someone who can afford one (and you'd need to afford it with ease to consider owning one I'd imagine?) can tell me if Adrenaline via Accelration is your drug surely this will be seriously addictive, irrespective of the costs?
Mars said:
I've never really understood why the factory ones needed their legendary "refresh", or whether it was just a rumour.
I was involved with a group of people who built their engines to higher outputs than the original K-series R500 engine, and some with technically lower specifications. They didn't need a refresh. Just a service at the usual intervals.
Perhaps you're right. Maybe the factory Ks were inferior but the K-series engine need not be. Spend the same amount of money as a factory K or Duratec on some carefully-chosen services to build your own K and you will have a reliable, powerful and very light K.
However, spend the same building your own Duratec and I suppose you'd end up with a more powerful engine still.
Well all I can say is I have now done 15000 miles in my R500 and its not needed a refresh yet. I was actually told by CC that it should be good for 20,000.I was involved with a group of people who built their engines to higher outputs than the original K-series R500 engine, and some with technically lower specifications. They didn't need a refresh. Just a service at the usual intervals.
Perhaps you're right. Maybe the factory Ks were inferior but the K-series engine need not be. Spend the same amount of money as a factory K or Duratec on some carefully-chosen services to build your own K and you will have a reliable, powerful and very light K.
However, spend the same building your own Duratec and I suppose you'd end up with a more powerful engine still.
The 3000 mile refrsh was for those people who were racing their R500s and using a lot of continued high revs.
The factory Ks were built by Minister (http://www.minister-power.com/) who have an excellent reputation and who also build Duratec engines
POORCARDEALER said:
my old 500 was mapped to around 240 bhp, and it was ferociously fast, after a 40 mile fast drive u got out ears ringing, body tingling and knackered......proper car, new one must be mental
Matt, did you sell it then?And as to all the other comments on here - just goes to show how many ill informed people there are - "much modifed Duratecs from a Mondeo" "Refreshes every 3,000 miles", "Rover V8 powered Westfields" (I bet that handles like a London bus)...
But then I guess I wouldn't know the first thing about a Citroen Saxo or an Escort 2000 Mk4!
I reckon Caterhham have got it just about right with the new R500 and with the enticing prospect of the optional 6 speed sequential at another £3k, that car is gonig to be nigh on unbeatable - I'd love to know how it fares against a Eurocup spec CSR in 2008 trim....
Snake the Sniper said:
Do those carbon winglets actually help? I thought most 7's suffered from rear lift, so having the nose pushing down won't help that much....
Still, will be mental fast, and hopefully a bit more longer lasting than the old R500, engine wise at any rate.
I always thought it was front end lift (about 50lbs if IIRC) that was the problem, generated partly by the wings, especially the swept wings, so i guess it makes sense to target the wings as they have done, i'd trust Caterham with issues like this, but maybe that's just me Still, will be mental fast, and hopefully a bit more longer lasting than the old R500, engine wise at any rate.
mchammer89 said:
Snake the Sniper said:
Do those carbon winglets actually help? I thought most 7's suffered from rear lift, so having the nose pushing down won't help that much....
Still, will be mental fast, and hopefully a bit more longer lasting than the old R500, engine wise at any rate.
I always thought it was front end lift (about 50lbs if IIRC) that was the problem, generated partly by the wings, especially the swept wings, so i guess it makes sense to target the wings as they have done, i'd trust Caterham with issues like this, but maybe that's just me Still, will be mental fast, and hopefully a bit more longer lasting than the old R500, engine wise at any rate.
I still maintain that clams give more lift - I experienced it in girlfriend's car...but others say this isn't true...Matt - £30k is superb money, no wonder you let it go!!!!!!did a Pher buy it?
I still have mine - don't think I'll ever sell it...although I do like the new R500.
rubystone said:
mchammer89 said:
Snake the Sniper said:
Do those carbon winglets actually help? I thought most 7's suffered from rear lift, so having the nose pushing down won't help that much....
Still, will be mental fast, and hopefully a bit more longer lasting than the old R500, engine wise at any rate.
I always thought it was front end lift (about 50lbs if IIRC) that was the problem, generated partly by the wings, especially the swept wings, so i guess it makes sense to target the wings as they have done, i'd trust Caterham with issues like this, but maybe that's just me Still, will be mental fast, and hopefully a bit more longer lasting than the old R500, engine wise at any rate.
I still maintain that clams give more lift - I experienced it in girlfriend's car...but others say this isn't true...Matt - £30k is superb money, no wonder you let it go!!!!!!did a Pher buy it?
I still have mine - don't think I'll ever sell it...although I do like the new R500.
Was shown the new R500s at the factory a few weeks ago when they were in build, under the bonnet etc. Very impressive attention to detail with the dry sump system, switches etc.
Regards the SEight Westfield I have heard that (as well as handling like a pig due to the massive weight over the front wheels) it is absolutely essential to heel-and-toe on every downchange because the huge inertia of the engine causes the rear wheels to lock up even at moderate revs. Is this true?
Regards the SEight Westfield I have heard that (as well as handling like a pig due to the massive weight over the front wheels) it is absolutely essential to heel-and-toe on every downchange because the huge inertia of the engine causes the rear wheels to lock up even at moderate revs. Is this true?
Edited by SimonY on Saturday 12th April 22:58
SimonY said:
Regards the SEight Westfield I have heard that (as well as handling like a pig due to the massive weight over the front wheels) it is absolutely essential to heel-and-toe on every downchange because the huge inertia of the engine causes the rear wheels to lock up even at moderate revs. Is this true?
Not quite. A pinto lump weighs more than the V8... Most V8 Westfield's acheive a 50/50, or damn close to it, weight dsitribution if built properly.Edited by SimonY on Saturday 12th April 22:58
I had a SBD Vauxhall 16 valve lump in a Westfield. Steve got 254hp out of it and the engine was pretty good for me and the friends who owned the car after. We got that down to 524kg and close to 50/50 C of G and it was pretty rapid. Made the S4 Esprit I had after seem slow upto about 120mph! Oversteer was never far away. I sold the car as I just did not want to die! The question was never 'did you have enough time to overtake' but rather 'how much to press the loud pedal to clear the car coming the other way'. Certainly pull out then accelerate rather than accelerate and pull out at the same time. If you use the latter approach you just risk going into the back of the car in front at high speed..
M400 NBL said:
sniff petrol said:
263bhp from 2 litres - will it be reliable? I remember reading that the K-series R500 needed refreshing every 3000 miles for £3000.
It's gonna last a lot longer than bike engine cars....which are getting more popular because of their ridiculous speeds and quick gear changes ( I assume the gear changes are the same as on a motorbike, ie no need to use the clutch!Regarding costs, £40k has been about par for the course in terms of extreme trackday toys for the last few years. Atom 300, original R500, supercharged Exiges, etc.
There is plenty wrong with Caterhams, but nothing that really matters on a trackday or proper road blat. They are superbly fit for purpose.
The great thing is that you're really not short changed with a cheaper one.
I hired a nicely set up Roadsport (115bhp AFAIK) at Anglesey on Friday, and it was (in conventional terms) fast and fun. In the morning (wet) I let everything past, driving like a granny, but when it dried out in the afternoon it was as quick as most.
I've often heard it said that an R300 is about the right power/weight, but if you have the cash for more dash, why not?
John
There is plenty wrong with Caterhams, but nothing that really matters on a trackday or proper road blat. They are superbly fit for purpose.
The great thing is that you're really not short changed with a cheaper one.
I hired a nicely set up Roadsport (115bhp AFAIK) at Anglesey on Friday, and it was (in conventional terms) fast and fun. In the morning (wet) I let everything past, driving like a granny, but when it dried out in the afternoon it was as quick as most.
I've often heard it said that an R300 is about the right power/weight, but if you have the cash for more dash, why not?
John
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