RE: Caterham R500 Superlight Revealed
Discussion
mrclav said:
Having now ridden in a Caterham I really don't get the appeal of these cars, especially aesthetically - sure, they are very fast and they handle well enough but... I guess all I could think about is "I'll be dead if I ever crash in this"! Hmmm, horses for courses I suppose? If I HAD to choose such a car to drive/race I think I'd prefer the Atom myself, I much prefer the looks and obviously they go like stink too (even though they seem to leave on even more exposed!).
Really? That surprises me coming from a PHer. I actually don't think there could be a more pure driving experience than in something like a Caterham. Not just because they're fast, but because you're so close to the floor, to the engine, to the space around you. I'll still have to wait and see though..Sharief said:
M400 NBL said:
sniff petrol said:
263bhp from 2 litres - will it be reliable? I remember reading that the K-series R500 needed refreshing every 3000 miles for £3000.
It's gonna last a lot longer than bike engine cars....which are getting more popular because of their ridiculous speeds and quick gear changes ( I assume the gear changes are the same as on a motorbike, ie no need to use the clutch!Sharief said:
mrclav said:
Having now ridden in a Caterham I really don't get the appeal of these cars, especially aesthetically - sure, they are very fast and they handle well enough but... I guess all I could think about is "I'll be dead if I ever crash in this"! Hmmm, horses for courses I suppose? If I HAD to choose such a car to drive/race I think I'd prefer the Atom myself, I much prefer the looks and obviously they go like stink too (even though they seem to leave on even more exposed!).
Really? That surprises me coming from a PHer. I actually don't think there could be a more pure driving experience than in something like a Caterham. Not just because they're fast, but because you're so close to the floor, to the engine, to the space around you. I'll still have to wait and see though..
Nothing beats a Caterham for feel and handling 
Many people forget that there's more to a great sports car than how it looks or how fast it goes. 7 replicas look like sevens, but they're nowhere near as good; and many other cars boast similar power to weight ratios, but they aren't as well developed.
I wonder if this one will be too loud for trackdays though
That kind of removed the point of the original R500, the fact that you couldn't take it on most track days because of the noise 
Martin Keene said:
...
You will have 95% of the fun in *any* Caterfield as you will in that, without the expense.
...
As with most things in life, the last 5% often costs the most. But often is the most rewarding in terms of experience and at times is absolutely vital. We share 95% of our make up with monkeys for example You will have 95% of the fun in *any* Caterfield as you will in that, without the expense.
...
If you're happy with 95%, fair enough.
btw, V8 Rover engined 7 type cars are notoriously poor. They make a good noise, and the engine's a cracker in other applications (SD1, Triumph Stag, TVR, Marcos, Morgan etc etc). But it doesn't suit a 7. Being driven at speed in a Westfield with one would likely scare me s
tless too.[quote=WTFWT?!]Why has it got the ugly CSR type vent on top of the nose cone?
They should have the CSR 260 (with vents and ugly cycle wings etc) for those who want the updated model and then offer the classic styling with the R500 IMO
[/quote]
It isn't for looks - it is for the cooling package - 263bhp takes some cooling i guess.
I think it looks the nuts!
They should have the CSR 260 (with vents and ugly cycle wings etc) for those who want the updated model and then offer the classic styling with the R500 IMO
[/quote]
It isn't for looks - it is for the cooling package - 263bhp takes some cooling i guess.
I think it looks the nuts!
atom-ick said:
It isn't for looks - it is for the cooling package - 263bhp takes some cooling i guess.
I think it looks the nuts!
Does anyone know where the radiator is on this car? I'd have thought it was was in the usual position - i.e. to the rear of the nosecone and thus behind that vent in the top. I do know that the drysump tank is in the nosecone too...I think it looks the nuts!
RobM77 said:
Many people forget that there's more to a great sports car than how it looks or how fast it goes. 7 replicas look like sevens, but they're nowhere near as good; and many other cars boast similar power to weight ratios, but they aren't as well developed.
I'd disagree slightly with that. Caterhams tend to be better finished "out of the box", which includes suspension setup. "Non-Caterham" sevens need a bit more fine-tuning.Give a broadly equivalent Westfield and Caterham to some race engineers, and you'll end up with something equally fast.
Arguably, since non-Caterhams are better value, you can use the extra cash to buy a higher spec and expert setup, and end up with something significantly faster.
There was a green ZX10-R powered seven (MNR?) at Anglesey, and it was bloody quick.
Still, Caterhams have nice paint, and that's worth a couple of seconds a lap subjectively
John
JohnLatham said:
RobM77 said:
Many people forget that there's more to a great sports car than how it looks or how fast it goes. 7 replicas look like sevens, but they're nowhere near as good; and many other cars boast similar power to weight ratios, but they aren't as well developed.
I'd disagree slightly with that. Caterhams tend to be better finished "out of the box", which includes suspension setup. "Non-Caterham" sevens need a bit more fine-tuning.Give a broadly equivalent Westfield and Caterham to some race engineers, and you'll end up with something equally fast.
Arguably, since non-Caterhams are better value, you can use the extra cash to buy a higher spec and expert setup, and end up with something significantly faster.
There was a green ZX10-R powered seven (MNR?) at Anglesey, and it was bloody quick.
Still, Caterhams have nice paint, and that's worth a couple of seconds a lap subjectively
John
I think we should just all take a moment to salute the pure lunacy of this car. There may be guys in sheds producing one of specials, but whilst there are cars like this being produced by manufacturers we should all be thanking the piston-gods.
Long live the R500!
I need one.:cloud9
I'd definitely agree with that.
Caterhams generally have a better setup out of the factory, but i've driven some westy's that have out handled caterhams. The equivalent used caterham can be double that of the westfield.
If the prices were equal, i'd rather have the caterham (purely down to the bodywork), but given I paid £8k, for a 2.0 Westfield with 210bhp I can't see the logic when you're budget is limited (this is the real world after all - how many people saying "they'd pay the extra" have actually paid the extra). At the end of the day, it is a toy. I had to sell my "proper" car to afford my toy.
Oh, and V8 westfields can be made to handle. As a car nut, surely you can see the attraction of a V8 with it's noise and torque.
Caterhams generally have a better setup out of the factory, but i've driven some westy's that have out handled caterhams. The equivalent used caterham can be double that of the westfield.
If the prices were equal, i'd rather have the caterham (purely down to the bodywork), but given I paid £8k, for a 2.0 Westfield with 210bhp I can't see the logic when you're budget is limited (this is the real world after all - how many people saying "they'd pay the extra" have actually paid the extra). At the end of the day, it is a toy. I had to sell my "proper" car to afford my toy.
Oh, and V8 westfields can be made to handle. As a car nut, surely you can see the attraction of a V8 with it's noise and torque.
bobalog said:
...As a car nut, surely you can see the attraction of a V8 with it's noise and torque.
Absolutely. In a different car. Or a different V8.Sticking a big lump up front that really wasn't designed to go in there is amusing but not much more.
A decent 4-pot can sound terrific. And personally I think having something that needs to be revved is more in keeping with a 7.
atom-ick said:
I think we should just all take a moment to salute the pure lunacy of this car. There may be guys in sheds producing one of specials, but whilst there are cars like this being produced by manufacturers we should all be thanking the piston-gods.
Long live the R500!
I need one.:cloud9
Caterham are great at taking what's been done by blokes in sheds and productionising it. It's more the blokes in sheds you should thanking than the piston-gods. Long live the R500!
I need one.:cloud9
If it wasn't for blokes in sheds building specials you can be sure Caterham wouldn't be making cars like the new R500.
JohnLatham said:
RobM77 said:
Many people forget that there's more to a great sports car than how it looks or how fast it goes. 7 replicas look like sevens, but they're nowhere near as good; and many other cars boast similar power to weight ratios, but they aren't as well developed.
I'd disagree slightly with that. Caterhams tend to be better finished "out of the box", which includes suspension setup. "Non-Caterham" sevens need a bit more fine-tuning.Give a broadly equivalent Westfield and Caterham to some race engineers, and you'll end up with something equally fast.
Arguably, since non-Caterhams are better value, you can use the extra cash to buy a higher spec and expert setup, and end up with something significantly faster.
There was a green ZX10-R powered seven (MNR?) at Anglesey, and it was bloody quick.
Still, Caterhams have nice paint, and that's worth a couple of seconds a lap subjectively
John
Piers917 said:
Murph7355 said:
A decent 4-pot can sound terrific. And personally I think having something that needs to be revved is more in keeping with a 7.
Spot on Murph 
Certainly suits the character of the 7 well.In purely technical terms there may not be much different between a well set up Caterham, and a well set up Westfield. I have tried good and bad versions of both.Even met an Ex Westfield owner who now had a Caterham, and reckons the handling on the Caterham was much better, but that could just be down to the set up, he had on his Westfield.
Its also fair to say that Westfield do some `bits' better than Caterham, and Caterham other `bits' better than Westfield.
There are some who see the Caterham as the real deal, and all others sevens as later copies of the marque, and it may be for that reason that they are prepared to pay the (sometimes very large) extra amount.
With regard to performance I have seen an Ultralite (Texan version of a Seven) with a turbocharged Honda 2 litre engine, which wiped out both Caterhams and Westfields on the road and on race tracks. So theres allways someone with something that`s faster.
Much as I like Caterhams, not sure I could blow that sort of cash on what others have rightly described as a toy, not many people I know use them as a daily driver. But if performance per pound is what is being looked at, they wipe out many supercars.
Read recently about a Libdem Euro MP campaigning to get ALL cars in Europe limited to a max 100mph (Heaven help Piston Header`s if they ever get into power!)
which ironically would make cars like the R500 make more sense. No point of having cars that do 200mph then, I guess, but having one that gets to 60 in 2.88 seconds regardless of aerodynamics sounds sort of worthwhile (untill of course they bring in laws whichs stop people from doing even that too!)
Its also fair to say that Westfield do some `bits' better than Caterham, and Caterham other `bits' better than Westfield.
There are some who see the Caterham as the real deal, and all others sevens as later copies of the marque, and it may be for that reason that they are prepared to pay the (sometimes very large) extra amount.
With regard to performance I have seen an Ultralite (Texan version of a Seven) with a turbocharged Honda 2 litre engine, which wiped out both Caterhams and Westfields on the road and on race tracks. So theres allways someone with something that`s faster.
Much as I like Caterhams, not sure I could blow that sort of cash on what others have rightly described as a toy, not many people I know use them as a daily driver. But if performance per pound is what is being looked at, they wipe out many supercars.
Read recently about a Libdem Euro MP campaigning to get ALL cars in Europe limited to a max 100mph (Heaven help Piston Header`s if they ever get into power!)
which ironically would make cars like the R500 make more sense. No point of having cars that do 200mph then, I guess, but having one that gets to 60 in 2.88 seconds regardless of aerodynamics sounds sort of worthwhile (untill of course they bring in laws whichs stop people from doing even that too!)
Wow, i've just come over from the "Caterham vs. Westfield (and the other replicas)" thread and it turns out you guys are having exactly the same conversation over here!
http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&t=225134&i=200
Why don't you all come over to the other thread and hear about, amongst other interesting comments, how Caterhams don't have any heritage at all and are a totally different car to a Lotus 7?
(also you will be astounded to hear that apparently a Porsche 997 is miles better than an original 60's 911 which means the two are completely unrelated and Porsche has no heritage)
Who says replica owners don't know what they're talking about!?!?
Come over and join the fun!
http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&t=225134&i=200
Why don't you all come over to the other thread and hear about, amongst other interesting comments, how Caterhams don't have any heritage at all and are a totally different car to a Lotus 7?
(also you will be astounded to hear that apparently a Porsche 997 is miles better than an original 60's 911 which means the two are completely unrelated and Porsche has no heritage)
Who says replica owners don't know what they're talking about!?!?
Come over and join the fun!
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