Dead market or what?
Discussion
Well, after various tyre kickers and time wasters, my Wedge is still up for sale as I try to clear my workshop of at least one car.
Question is, am I being unrealistic with the price?
I thought it was fair but it's obvious that the buying public don't - or maybe people just don't want SE's anymore?
What do you think?
See the ad here
Question is, am I being unrealistic with the price?
I thought it was fair but it's obvious that the buying public don't - or maybe people just don't want SE's anymore?
What do you think?
See the ad here
Depends who youre trying to sell it to - but the general public (or as near as you'll get trying to buy a TVR) are going to say, you can get a Chimeara or even an early Griffith for that kind of dough.
I'd also want to know a lot about the credentials of who carried out the conversion.
I'd also want to know a lot about the credentials of who carried out the conversion.
Tell me about it !!!!! I have had my 460i for sale for months and not even one person has come to see it. Its strange because if you buy an older wedge you will have to do work to keep it in top condition, yet mine has had everything done,at great expense plus the best engine you can get. I had no intension of ever selling it, but as I am moving abroad it will have to go, but I'm sure the first person who is genuine, actually see's it will buy.
Thanks chaps. Ironically, my brother is a car trader so he's going to have a go at shifting it. He thinks that it will go no problem.
To be fair, it's only been advertised on Pistonheads so a punt in Top Marques or the TVT would make sense.
FYI - the engine was prepared by Ray Webb at V8 Developments.
To be fair, it's only been advertised on Pistonheads so a punt in Top Marques or the TVT would make sense.
FYI - the engine was prepared by Ray Webb at V8 Developments.
quote:
Tell me about it !!!!! I have had my 460i for sale for months and not even one person has come to see it. Its strange because if you buy an older wedge you will have to do work to keep it in top condition, yet mine has had everything done,at great expense plus the best engine you can get. I had no intension of ever selling it, but as I am moving abroad it will have to go, but I'm sure the first person who is genuine, actually see's it will buy.
Where are you moving to? When I get a wedge (again) I am intending bringing it out to Hungary. I may have a problem with importing it officially, in which case I keep it UK registered, taxed and insured. This would mean an annual run across Europe
. I would have said your asking price is a bit high..
following reasons ..
its a G plate .... 10K is H/J plate country.
secondly, whilst i second your performance upgrade (4.6) and very professional it looks too, its not standard / origional. a 400SE should be 4 litres, a 450 ... well you guessed it.
TVR didnt make a 4.6 ( just playing devils advocate. If I was looking, thats what I would be saying ).
Also, when it comes to insurance, its also a non standard tasmin.
I know you can argue that mine isnt standard.. (Steve Heath will probably point that out anyway!!)
Its like Sean's 460 SEAC, Peter H's 460 V8S, Steve H's 520 (390SE!!!)
as a specialist vehicle, they all are well made to the highest standards, and in the racing arena they perform brilliantly. Retail though they are all non standard.
but i suppose would you buy a corsa with a V6 engine in it ? Probably not.
following reasons ..
its a G plate .... 10K is H/J plate country.
secondly, whilst i second your performance upgrade (4.6) and very professional it looks too, its not standard / origional. a 400SE should be 4 litres, a 450 ... well you guessed it.
TVR didnt make a 4.6 ( just playing devils advocate. If I was looking, thats what I would be saying ).
Also, when it comes to insurance, its also a non standard tasmin.
I know you can argue that mine isnt standard.. (Steve Heath will probably point that out anyway!!)
Its like Sean's 460 SEAC, Peter H's 460 V8S, Steve H's 520 (390SE!!!)
as a specialist vehicle, they all are well made to the highest standards, and in the racing arena they perform brilliantly. Retail though they are all non standard.
but i suppose would you buy a corsa with a V6 engine in it ? Probably not.
I think the trouble is that private prices for wedges are just too high. I know alot have had much money spent on them but you never get that money back when you sell. I started to look for a wedge to buy at the end of last year. To give an example in December, Hawthorn's tvr dealer were selling a very nice 1990 400se 29,000 miles, tvr history, tower view roll bar fitted and a 12 month warranty for £10,999. Someone beat me to buying it. I ended up buying a 1990 350se from an independent dealer some £2000 less than another 350se (similar spec) was being advertised through this website!
quote:
I think the trouble is that private prices for wedges are just too high. I know alot have had much money spent on them but you never get that money back when you sell. I started to look for a wedge to buy at the end of last year. To give an example in December, Hawthorn's tvr dealer were selling a very nice 1990 400se 29,000 miles, tvr history, tower view roll bar fitted and a 12 month warranty for £10,999. Someone beat me to buying it. I ended up buying a 1990 350se from an independent dealer some £2000 less than another 350se (similar spec) was being advertised through this website!
I see what you are saying but i think a car that has had the work done on it well is worth the money. I'm restoring mine at the moment and it's taking a lot of time and all those little jobs add up money wise. I've lost track of what I've spent on it and I still have a long list of things to buy.
I have seen mild2wild's 460i and it's very, very nice, believe me to get it like that would have cost a lot more than he's asking for it!
There seems to be a lot of good cars for sale at the moment from some genuine enthusiasts, If your in the market for a wedge go look at one of the good ones, they might seem a bit more expensive but you'll save a lot in the long run.
Big things to look for are a sorted chassis (check outriggers its a big job to take it all back to shiney metal/ possibly replace bits and repaint, undamaged body (those little cracks can't just be filled over, needs grinding out and strengthening from behind plus probably a complete respray if they are in all the usual places, plus most bolts will have rusted up and take a lot of time, sweat and blood to remove).
You could already have spent £3k and theres still the engine (new 4.6l £3k to 6k and up??) , gearbox (new £1400??), UJ's, suspension (new springs, poly bushes and shocks could be £800+) and the interior £???.
I think most of these cars will eventually end up with the 4.6 litre as you can still buy these new, and are a reasonable proposition price wise when compared to a total rebuild, but check the insurance costs?.
GF.
I would rather have a well sorted Wedge than a cheap Chim or Griff. From what I have seen that is the comparison money wise. Some of the older Griffs and Chims need major work mainly in the chassis and suspension area, even to the point that the body needs removing. I guess at the end of the day Joe Public does not see this and sees the shiny body and later styling.
quote:
I would rather have a well sorted Wedge than a cheap Chim or Griff. From what I have seen that is the comparison money wise. Some of the older Griffs and Chims need major work mainly in the chassis and suspension area, even to the point that the body needs removing. I guess at the end of the day Joe Public does not see this and sees the shiny body and later styling.
Same thought for me, a well-sorted wedge is better 'value' than en un-sorted early Griff or Chimaera. I recently looked at the prices for converting a standard 400SE to 460 complete with brakes and suspension and ended up with a figure of about 16K, starting with a 8-9K 400SE. 'Investment' in upgrades such as these are never recovered on sale, maybe a premium of 2K over a standard car. (In the past I spent shedloads on a 240Z which ended up as a 265bhp monster, eventually sold it for the same price I bought it
Agree with the concensus here; it takes another enthusiast to appreciate what you've done and be prepared to pay for it.
When I bought my 390 I was taken in by the list of things that had been done and thought it would be a bargain. That hasn't turned out to be the case as things have still needed doing, some still do and more undoubtedly will.
As well as the inevitable loss on sale, you have to remember that most of us use some form of credit to buy our cars, so in the long run the cost is even higher. My £6500 will probably be more like ten grand, but I doubt I'd get more than 4K for the car as it stands now due to cosmetics, mileage, age etc., even from a keen wedge fan, and despite the £1K engine rebuild a few months back. And 4K wouldn't pay off what I still owe.
I saw one car on here recently (may be the one under discussion) at £7.5K that looks to me to be an absolute steal. But that sort of money to a lot of people takes them into Imprezza/ Porshe 944/ Integrale territory, so you have to find a Wedgeaholic. Now a lot of the IT types with lots of disposable income are gibbering about their salaries falling off, and anyway they tend to want the newer models, so maybe you need an older, wiser guy. But then he'll have to convince the wife..... ;-)
So what you REALLY need is someone like me; middle-aged, Wedgeaholic, divorced(ish).... oh shit, I'm skint.
Ian
When I bought my 390 I was taken in by the list of things that had been done and thought it would be a bargain. That hasn't turned out to be the case as things have still needed doing, some still do and more undoubtedly will.
As well as the inevitable loss on sale, you have to remember that most of us use some form of credit to buy our cars, so in the long run the cost is even higher. My £6500 will probably be more like ten grand, but I doubt I'd get more than 4K for the car as it stands now due to cosmetics, mileage, age etc., even from a keen wedge fan, and despite the £1K engine rebuild a few months back. And 4K wouldn't pay off what I still owe.
I saw one car on here recently (may be the one under discussion) at £7.5K that looks to me to be an absolute steal. But that sort of money to a lot of people takes them into Imprezza/ Porshe 944/ Integrale territory, so you have to find a Wedgeaholic. Now a lot of the IT types with lots of disposable income are gibbering about their salaries falling off, and anyway they tend to want the newer models, so maybe you need an older, wiser guy. But then he'll have to convince the wife..... ;-)
So what you REALLY need is someone like me; middle-aged, Wedgeaholic, divorced(ish).... oh shit, I'm skint.
Ian
At the risk of sounding repetitive I also agree with most of the comments here. A car modified like stig's wouldn't worry me as long as I could confirm that the work had been carried out professionally (as Stig's has).
I would also choose a sorted V8 wedge / V8S over a Chim or Griff (I did with my own car).
I love the V8S but am very taken with the big Wedges, if I had the money and space I buy one to have alongside the S.
I hope Stig gets what he wants, I saw his 460 in a petrol station in Sonning Common a while back - its a stunning car.
I would also choose a sorted V8 wedge / V8S over a Chim or Griff (I did with my own car).
I love the V8S but am very taken with the big Wedges, if I had the money and space I buy one to have alongside the S.
I hope Stig gets what he wants, I saw his 460 in a petrol station in Sonning Common a while back - its a stunning car.
Lets face it. A wedge is more special than an early Griff or Chim. Mainly that the wedges were built in Hundreds (350's, 400SE's) or much smaller specialised batches (2+2 coupes, 350SE, SEAcs, 430, 450SE). There are thousands of Chimps and Griffs around and nice as they are, are not the proper TVR's that the wedges represent. It was real sports car enthusiasts that bought our cars from TVR brand new while TVR was still a very small manufacturer and not well known. It was only after the "S" was introduced and then the Griff that the company began to get noticed and then more people jumped on the band wagon.
So the main reason for buying a wedge especially a late one is that they were the best ones made quality wise as the factory knew how to screw them together (that may be being generous !!) Early versions of any TVR model will be beset by teething problems and production techniques that will be improved over subsequent years.
Also the wedge is not fitted with cat converters allowing the wonderful V8 noise we all know and love. You either love or hate the wedge. All those people who have never driven one will never know what they are missing and for them I feel truly sorry.
I hope to never part with my 450SE as I think it an important car in TVR history and rare as one of thirty five made, you cannot have that sort of rarity with a griff or chim (with the very odd "one off" exceptions that TVR inevitably make for favoured customers).All wedges are special and none so special as the one you own !!
Can I get off my box now ? I am getting dizzy
Broadside
So the main reason for buying a wedge especially a late one is that they were the best ones made quality wise as the factory knew how to screw them together (that may be being generous !!) Early versions of any TVR model will be beset by teething problems and production techniques that will be improved over subsequent years.
Also the wedge is not fitted with cat converters allowing the wonderful V8 noise we all know and love. You either love or hate the wedge. All those people who have never driven one will never know what they are missing and for them I feel truly sorry.
I hope to never part with my 450SE as I think it an important car in TVR history and rare as one of thirty five made, you cannot have that sort of rarity with a griff or chim (with the very odd "one off" exceptions that TVR inevitably make for favoured customers).All wedges are special and none so special as the one you own !!
Can I get off my box now ? I am getting dizzy
Broadside
quote:
Broadside, spot on. Same with my 400 (420). Hope never to part with it. Monster in sheeps clothing. Duxford was interesting with the opposition.
I don't know what kind of sheep you have seen! but if I saw and heard you car pulling up next to me at some traffic lights I would assume I was about to inhale a lot of burning rubber fumes.
How about a monster in wolfs clothing.
The rarity of these cars is attractive though, as is the fact you can insure it as a classic. £400 for a group 20 fully comp anyone? 0-60 in 6 odd seconds for a 350i - a 460i must be very fast.
>> Edited by gf350 on Saturday 7th September 20:10
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