Am I Just a P_ssy?
Discussion
Without wanting to invite too many simply "Yes" reply posts 
here's why I'm asking:
I took the Chimaera (4 litre) for a 'hard' drive over the Snake Pass when it has p!ssing it down (and I mean really badly) this weekend. The surface of that road is very bad in places, both in terms of variable grip and lots of bumps. I got a bit of a shock when the back end let go at 50mph when I was applying only the slightest bit of throttle in 3rd gear! Fortunately I managed to catch it but the entire drive was a little bit scary in that I think I would have been able to do it faster in my Golf GTi! The car was very nervous whenever the road got bumpy and there was a lot of standing water, which is to be expected to a certain extent with this sort of car, but I was still a bit taken aback. I've cracked 100mph over there in a '85 1.3 Honda Civic Automatic but by the time I'd reached the section where I've done this in the past I didn't trust the car enough to do it, though I know in my mind that it would have been fine.
In the dry I fairly regularly crack 120mph and have beaten a reasonably well driven Elise on a high speed road (i.e. long, high speed corners) but this whole wet weather behaviour aspect of the car is relatively new to me as up until now I hadn't really driven it hard in the wet. With autumn/winter and months of rain looming I'm just wondering whether anyone has any comments to pass on similar experiences or whether I'm just being a big girls blouse?!
Before anyone suggests it, I am intending to do a wet weather and performance driving course once the funds are available as I think my skills need improving more than I thought!
(However, if you've got any recommendations for good places to do this I'd be happy to hear them). Also, the car has virtually new Bridgestones so it's not the tyres!
roadsweeper. :waitingforaverbalbeatingfrompistonheadscrew:
here's why I'm asking: I took the Chimaera (4 litre) for a 'hard' drive over the Snake Pass when it has p!ssing it down (and I mean really badly) this weekend. The surface of that road is very bad in places, both in terms of variable grip and lots of bumps. I got a bit of a shock when the back end let go at 50mph when I was applying only the slightest bit of throttle in 3rd gear! Fortunately I managed to catch it but the entire drive was a little bit scary in that I think I would have been able to do it faster in my Golf GTi! The car was very nervous whenever the road got bumpy and there was a lot of standing water, which is to be expected to a certain extent with this sort of car, but I was still a bit taken aback. I've cracked 100mph over there in a '85 1.3 Honda Civic Automatic but by the time I'd reached the section where I've done this in the past I didn't trust the car enough to do it, though I know in my mind that it would have been fine.
In the dry I fairly regularly crack 120mph and have beaten a reasonably well driven Elise on a high speed road (i.e. long, high speed corners) but this whole wet weather behaviour aspect of the car is relatively new to me as up until now I hadn't really driven it hard in the wet. With autumn/winter and months of rain looming I'm just wondering whether anyone has any comments to pass on similar experiences or whether I'm just being a big girls blouse?!
Before anyone suggests it, I am intending to do a wet weather and performance driving course once the funds are available as I think my skills need improving more than I thought!
(However, if you've got any recommendations for good places to do this I'd be happy to hear them). Also, the car has virtually new Bridgestones so it's not the tyres! roadsweeper. :waitingforaverbalbeatingfrompistonheadscrew:
I assume you mean the snakepass in the Peak District - Hathersage and then through to Glossop area? - A57 IIRC?
If so, I wouldn't worry about it too much. I've been over that way in Landie's, Scoobies and the old man's S3 - all of which have 4WD. At this time of year, you get a lot of mulch and the oil and sap from the leaves mix with the road surface and make it quite greasy... add this to rain and it isn't much fun!
Next time you're over that way, just stop and get out, it even feels slippy underfoot with shoes on. The rain just exacerbates this and it gets quite hairy.
I wouldn't worry about it mate, but driving course are useful anyway IMHO... but the snake pass is a dodgy road at this time of year.
>> Edited by Podie on Monday 12th August 11:26
If so, I wouldn't worry about it too much. I've been over that way in Landie's, Scoobies and the old man's S3 - all of which have 4WD. At this time of year, you get a lot of mulch and the oil and sap from the leaves mix with the road surface and make it quite greasy... add this to rain and it isn't much fun!
Next time you're over that way, just stop and get out, it even feels slippy underfoot with shoes on. The rain just exacerbates this and it gets quite hairy.
I wouldn't worry about it mate, but driving course are useful anyway IMHO... but the snake pass is a dodgy road at this time of year.
>> Edited by Podie on Monday 12th August 11:26
I would suggest you drive according to the conditions,your ability and the handling limits of the car.Remember as stated in the hand book you are driving a car with a high torque to weight ratio.Lesser cars with less torque and narrower tyres may well perform better on certain roads! Forget this macho image that you have to drive at 10/10ths because it is a TVR i.e I was chasing a ferrai at 180 into a bend so I changed down and overtook him under braking (courtesy EVO mag).Your car is their to enjoy .Nice cars,lousy coffins.
Hi Podie
That's exactly the section of road I mean. Cheers for the reassurance! I suppose that I shouldn't expect too much in those kind of conditions, but I would be interested to hear about any brave soul (not literally!) who's caned a Cerbera 4.5 or something even more hairy than my Chimaera in those conditions - I wonder how they found it?
P7LUG: Good point, but if I'm that bad a driver I'd like to know. I have a lot to learn for sure and I want to be able to get the most out of motor (where appropriate). If I was just into posing I'd probably have bought an Audi TT or something (apologies to anyone who has one and is offended by that!).
As for driving within my limits, that's a fair observation and I believe I did that. But it was still scary and I'm just trying to find out whether that's because my limits are low or because that kind of car on that kind of road is going to be a handful for most people.
Cheers for responses.
roadsweeper.
That's exactly the section of road I mean. Cheers for the reassurance!
I suppose that I shouldn't expect too much in those kind of conditions, but I would be interested to hear about any brave soul (not literally!) who's caned a Cerbera 4.5 or something even more hairy than my Chimaera in those conditions - I wonder how they found it? P7LUG: Good point, but if I'm that bad a driver I'd like to know. I have a lot to learn for sure and I want to be able to get the most out of motor (where appropriate). If I was just into posing I'd probably have bought an Audi TT or something (apologies to anyone who has one and is offended by that!
). As for driving within my limits, that's a fair observation and I believe I did that. But it was still scary and I'm just trying to find out whether that's because my limits are low or because that kind of car on that kind of road is going to be a handful for most people.
Cheers for responses.
roadsweeper.
You might just have hit some mud or diesel or something. I did the same in my s3 while trying to get away from a mate, the back end came hurtling around on a left hander and I only just caught it. I think it was just a patch of mud or something so put it down to experience, slowed down for a few days and then just carried on. My mate who was following me though I was toast and was amazed I caught it, therefore as I caught it and you did too then therefore we must both be great drivers and you should pat yourself on the back
Roadsweeper
Think you might be too critical of yourself! Its not a matter or being a good driver or a bad driver its about being A DRIVER.If you think of all the variables involved and how many you had control over.The secret is assesing the situation and responding acordingly.We would all like to think we are super drivers but there are very few Michael Schumachers in the world.Its like when people have had a massive accident and say the car went out of control, unless there was mechanical failure cars dont go out of control the driver puts them outside the limits of their control.
Think you might be too critical of yourself! Its not a matter or being a good driver or a bad driver its about being A DRIVER.If you think of all the variables involved and how many you had control over.The secret is assesing the situation and responding acordingly.We would all like to think we are super drivers but there are very few Michael Schumachers in the world.Its like when people have had a massive accident and say the car went out of control, unless there was mechanical failure cars dont go out of control the driver puts them outside the limits of their control.
mhibbins said:
That's a faultess example of logical deduction.
Right, I'm going to give that Schuey character a pounding!
quote:
My mate who was following me though I was toast and was amazed I caught it, therefore as I caught it and you did too then therefore we must both be great drivers and you should pat yourself on the back.
That's a faultess example of logical deduction.
Right, I'm going to give that Schuey character a pounding!
You should take it easy in a TVR in the wet.
My mate spun his on a dual carriage way with heavy rain
at 50~60 mph just by changing lanes.
They are looney car's in the dry but bite big time in the wet due to very light weight & wide tyres.
Forget the macho bit in the wet or it will end in tears !
My mate spun his on a dual carriage way with heavy rain
at 50~60 mph just by changing lanes.
They are looney car's in the dry but bite big time in the wet due to very light weight & wide tyres.
Forget the macho bit in the wet or it will end in tears !
Hi rev-erend.
I had a hairy moment on a dual carriageway in the wet very shortly after buying the TVR. I was doing about 40mph on a straight bit of dual carriageway with a good surface but it was somewhat damp (as opposed to standing water). I floored it in an attempt to impress my (female) passenger and succeeded only in provoking a full-on fishtail down the road as I tried to correct and initally mis-timed it. Fortunately I got it in the end and put that one down to me being a p!llock, but the one on the Snake Pass was more worrying in that I was doing 50mph in 3rd so thought the torque would be much less likely to get the back end to kick out. From what people are saying I think it's probably to be expected to a certain extent on roads like the Snake Pass, particularly when it's in the middle of a torrential downpour - visibility was so bad at times that I couldn't overtake the car in front because I couldn't see far enough ahead even on straight roads due to the amount of rain coming down and being kicked up by the car in front.
Still, we learn from these things I suppose and my driving is a lot smoother after buying the Chimaera. I guess I'm just used to hanging the tail out on things like Honda Civics and Golf GTis (yes, I'm serious, I used to get my '85 Civic Auto into 4 wheel drifts at 90mph) but I'm too scared to do it with the TVR!
One day I will be sipping at the golden chalice of Tiff-style controlled oversteer in a TVR, though I wouldn't be doing it on road!
I had a hairy moment on a dual carriageway in the wet very shortly after buying the TVR. I was doing about 40mph on a straight bit of dual carriageway with a good surface but it was somewhat damp (as opposed to standing water). I floored it in an attempt to impress my (female) passenger and succeeded only in provoking a full-on fishtail down the road as I tried to correct and initally mis-timed it. Fortunately I got it in the end and put that one down to me being a p!llock, but the one on the Snake Pass was more worrying in that I was doing 50mph in 3rd so thought the torque would be much less likely to get the back end to kick out. From what people are saying I think it's probably to be expected to a certain extent on roads like the Snake Pass, particularly when it's in the middle of a torrential downpour - visibility was so bad at times that I couldn't overtake the car in front because I couldn't see far enough ahead even on straight roads due to the amount of rain coming down and being kicked up by the car in front.
Still, we learn from these things I suppose and my driving is a lot smoother after buying the Chimaera. I guess I'm just used to hanging the tail out on things like Honda Civics and Golf GTis (yes, I'm serious, I used to get my '85 Civic Auto into 4 wheel drifts at 90mph) but I'm too scared to do it with the TVR!
One day I will be sipping at the golden chalice of Tiff-style controlled oversteer in a TVR, though I wouldn't be doing it on road!
roadsweeper
You have to very talented to drift a modern TVR in the dry, you have the following to contend with:-
Big Low Profile Tyres with loads of grip
Little Weight
and a short wheelbase
Get it wrong and you'll be part of the hedgerow.
In the wet, there are no medals awarded for driving like a nutter. The car must be treated with loads of respect, it will bite especially in standing water, uneven road surfaces, white lines, lorry grooves, etc. I suggest very strongly that you engage brain before right foot and be one gear higher than you normally would have been in the dry.
There are also times when you should seriously think about parking up and waiting for the worst of the rain to pass, I did this in a Griff500 in torrential rain on the M25, when the rain and spray meant that I felt uncomfortable driving it, and I'm not embarrassed that I did it, I know several people who have aquaplaned into accidents on the motorway.
I once went on a David Hendry circuit day at Castle Combe, in the afternoon it poured with rain and even their demobstrator WRX which I drove stepped out in a straight line round the back of the circuit. Bobby Verdon-Roe pronounced the conditions too dangerous for a Chimaera, but was happy to continue in a Cerbera (longer wheelbase), but the other instructors Steve Cole and Gerry Marshall (above average drivers in anyones book) decided to sit it out and just chat with us at the side of the circuit.
You must understand your limitations and that of the car, otherwise I'm afraid you are going to become another insurance company statistic.
davidy
You have to very talented to drift a modern TVR in the dry, you have the following to contend with:-
Big Low Profile Tyres with loads of grip
Little Weight
and a short wheelbase
Get it wrong and you'll be part of the hedgerow.
In the wet, there are no medals awarded for driving like a nutter. The car must be treated with loads of respect, it will bite especially in standing water, uneven road surfaces, white lines, lorry grooves, etc. I suggest very strongly that you engage brain before right foot and be one gear higher than you normally would have been in the dry.
There are also times when you should seriously think about parking up and waiting for the worst of the rain to pass, I did this in a Griff500 in torrential rain on the M25, when the rain and spray meant that I felt uncomfortable driving it, and I'm not embarrassed that I did it, I know several people who have aquaplaned into accidents on the motorway.
I once went on a David Hendry circuit day at Castle Combe, in the afternoon it poured with rain and even their demobstrator WRX which I drove stepped out in a straight line round the back of the circuit. Bobby Verdon-Roe pronounced the conditions too dangerous for a Chimaera, but was happy to continue in a Cerbera (longer wheelbase), but the other instructors Steve Cole and Gerry Marshall (above average drivers in anyones book) decided to sit it out and just chat with us at the side of the circuit.
You must understand your limitations and that of the car, otherwise I'm afraid you are going to become another insurance company statistic.
davidy
quote:Hey, I was there that day! Bobby was an absolute God in the wet that day - the Cerbera was tramping round the final bend before the start-finish straight in the torrential rain.
I once went on a David Hendry circuit day at Castle Combe, in the afternoon it poured with rain and even their demobstrator WRX which I drove stepped out in a straight line round the back of the circuit. Bobby Verdon-Roe pronounced the conditions too dangerous for a Chimaera, but was happy to continue in a Cerbera (longer wheelbase), but the other instructors Steve Cole and Gerry Marshall (above average drivers in anyones book) decided to sit it out and just chat with us at the side of the circuit.
I was there in the Corrado VR6 that day and managed to spin it in standing water. I'd been having a ball doing 4-wheel drifts up until that point and was a bit surprised to lose in on the straight. Spun off into the in-field with no damage fortunately.
I drove the WRX in the torrential rain. It was really quite awesome although I didn't push it too hard as it was after my spin that I got to take it out and I had lost a lot of confidence as a result.
This is going back a few years now though, isn't it? Unless there has been another David Hendry Castle Combe day with Bobby V-R and torrential rain?
quote:
There are also times when you should seriously think about parking up and waiting for the worst of the rain to pass, I did this in a Griff500 in torrential rain on the M25, when the rain and spray meant that I felt uncomfortable driving it, and I'm not embarrassed that I did it, I know several people who have aquaplaned into accidents on the motorway.
M25, Friday night just gone, round by the A10 junction. Absolutely peeing it down and there was a river across the anit-clockwise carriageway. I went thru at about 50 and it went a bit light at the front. There were three cars up the embankment and four in the central reservation.... they were just going too fast for the conditions... all FWD as well. ho hum
Sounds like it was the same day, we took two cars Griffith500 and Prodrive modded Impreza Turbo, but boy was it wet in the afternoon. My wife went with BV-R in the rain (at the time she was an airline pilot so not too much phases her) but she said that BV-R clipped all three cones (entry, apex and exit) on every corner but at no point was he pointing in the right direction!!!
davidy
davidy
Havent read all the posts BUT from experience of owning a chim 450 and now a cerb 4.5 I would suggest short shifting will cure your problem. You dont want the torque to build too much. Keep it smooth, maintain traction, slow in, etc etc You can then travel much faster than a forgiving front wheel drive car. But you cant do it with your brain disconnected. IMHO
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