New TVR still under wraps!
Discussion
I was a depositor but got refunded many pages of this thread ago.
Main reason was that I didn't love the styling, there was little in the way of communication and the delays added up. If they had just made it look like that green Autocar render I would have likely held in there [the one with the white writing on the tyres].
re: a Launch Edition; for the first 500 new cars out of a new factory I think I would pass; you want to be on Revision 2 or maybe 1.2 at a push; look at the first McLarens and all the rapid changes which happened there. There will be a lot of return visits to the factory for those who are the most faithful and want the car earliest.
The real shame is that by the time it is actually on sale the styling will have dated along with the technology and engine.
I really do wish them well and likely will buy one if they get here and they change the styling a little.
I also share the despair at the poorly managed communications. I am sure they could have put out an article every three months with a progress report and maybe a little deep dive on a bit of the car (Q1 aero, Q2 engine, Q3 seats, Q4 infotainment) or something like that. Minimal effort and would get them a lot in return. There is a lot of love for the TVR brand out there but I fear it is dissipating, at least for the "New TVR".
Main reason was that I didn't love the styling, there was little in the way of communication and the delays added up. If they had just made it look like that green Autocar render I would have likely held in there [the one with the white writing on the tyres].
re: a Launch Edition; for the first 500 new cars out of a new factory I think I would pass; you want to be on Revision 2 or maybe 1.2 at a push; look at the first McLarens and all the rapid changes which happened there. There will be a lot of return visits to the factory for those who are the most faithful and want the car earliest.
The real shame is that by the time it is actually on sale the styling will have dated along with the technology and engine.
I really do wish them well and likely will buy one if they get here and they change the styling a little.
I also share the despair at the poorly managed communications. I am sure they could have put out an article every three months with a progress report and maybe a little deep dive on a bit of the car (Q1 aero, Q2 engine, Q3 seats, Q4 infotainment) or something like that. Minimal effort and would get them a lot in return. There is a lot of love for the TVR brand out there but I fear it is dissipating, at least for the "New TVR".
GetCarter said:
I don't know how much money he has or whether he has started building the cars...I didn't go into detail with GM, but he mentioned the plethora of tests (NCAP etc) all of which take (lots of) time and money. He's still looking forward to getting his car, so it can't be that bad.
NCAP.....taking that at face value (rather than Euro NCAP) very strongly suggests that they’re trying to type approve it for the US market. Big news right there people.dvs_dave said:
GetCarter said:
I don't know how much money he has or whether he has started building the cars...I didn't go into detail with GM, but he mentioned the plethora of tests (NCAP etc) all of which take (lots of) time and money. He's still looking forward to getting his car, so it can't be that bad.
NCAP.....taking that at face value (rather than Euro NCAP) very strongly suggests that they’re trying to type approve it for the US market. Big news right there people.NRS said:
Tyre Smoke said:
Maybe I'm being naive, but I wouldn't be announcing to the world that I was going to start building TVRs without the necessary finance in place.
I certainly wouldn't be wasting what money I did have putting stickers on a Rebellion LMP1 car.
I also wouldn't be making promises I can't ever hope to keep about when the car is going to appear.
It's just never going to happen.
The problem with that is if you have nothing then you're then trying to sell a complete dream to investors, and they're likely to see loads of these all the time so not be interested. By having the deposits etc then you can show you have people interested (we have xyz who have "confirmed" to buy). Advertising would help get more interest and hopefully deposit holders etc. It also builds brand awareness. Le Mans is likely a great place for targeted advertising to raise more funds - with all the millionaire/ billionaires pay drivers who are interested in cars, and have been willing to put money into car companies (at least racing ones). I certainly wouldn't be wasting what money I did have putting stickers on a Rebellion LMP1 car.
I also wouldn't be making promises I can't ever hope to keep about when the car is going to appear.
It's just never going to happen.
It seems you have to be in the right place at the right time, have the right design, and get lucky. Even then a lot of companies show once you start building the cars then a few years later it still doesn't work (financially) anyway. Hence the likely difficulty in getting backing.
Edit: give it the PlayStation arches and another 150hp so that it can give the big players a run for their money in terms of drama and performance and then maybe people will sit up and notice. And bring TVR back with some credibility. IMO
Edited by FarmyardPants on Wednesday 24th April 00:24
I had hoped a lot more from the guys running the new TVR. The brand had a good will following, which when the new car was promised, resulted in,I guess a lot of deposits. That loyal following and interest must have provided some confidence to the business case and also potential investors. However, even 500 deposits of between £ 2.5 and £ 5k was probably never going to make a real dent in the finance to set up and build 500 LE cars, so perhaps in the grand scheme of things, for the new TVR, the deposit holders are not really that relevent to the success or otherwise of the new car....may be that is why the deposit holders are no better informed than they were 3 to 4 months ago and no nearer knowing when a car will be delivered.
That the new TVR chooses not to communicate better with desposit holders is in my opinion a huge oversight. With a brand like TVR, in the past, it had a two fingers up to other manufactures approach - a plucky Brit manufacturer taking on the big boys, that attracted customers and it had a loyal following. That loyal following put cars on the road and show cased cars to other customers and so on.
In my opinion those loyal followeres from way back will form a significant number of current deposit holders. They will be putting TVRs on the road....TVRs on the road will be the best form of marketing they can have (not a bloke on mobile phone with a selfie stick). If deposit holders turn away, the curent delays continue, no news is provided - well wont interest be lost? If the loyal followers loose interest who will fill the gap? I appreciate that the new TVR guys are not experienced in building new cars, I get that. I get that there are going to be delays (delays that should have been foreseen and overcome). But what I dont get is failing to communicate. If the new TVR can provide regular updates then at least we can plan and stay informed. Many on this forum who put depoists down did not expect delivery in 2020...I had hoped to have my car by know. I want a car for this summer and it wont be a TVR....it may never be a TVR becuase I am not prepared to wait for what may or may not be.
In my view unless this car blows the socks off the competition it will remain a specialist brand with a limited customer base and following, and even it does blow the socks off - will it develop much beyond a brand with a limited following? If is going to be more than that and an assembler of someone elses design - then surely the first wave of customers who put cars on the road are part of that success. Pity the new TVR dont see that and provide updates more often.
That the new TVR chooses not to communicate better with desposit holders is in my opinion a huge oversight. With a brand like TVR, in the past, it had a two fingers up to other manufactures approach - a plucky Brit manufacturer taking on the big boys, that attracted customers and it had a loyal following. That loyal following put cars on the road and show cased cars to other customers and so on.
In my opinion those loyal followeres from way back will form a significant number of current deposit holders. They will be putting TVRs on the road....TVRs on the road will be the best form of marketing they can have (not a bloke on mobile phone with a selfie stick). If deposit holders turn away, the curent delays continue, no news is provided - well wont interest be lost? If the loyal followers loose interest who will fill the gap? I appreciate that the new TVR guys are not experienced in building new cars, I get that. I get that there are going to be delays (delays that should have been foreseen and overcome). But what I dont get is failing to communicate. If the new TVR can provide regular updates then at least we can plan and stay informed. Many on this forum who put depoists down did not expect delivery in 2020...I had hoped to have my car by know. I want a car for this summer and it wont be a TVR....it may never be a TVR becuase I am not prepared to wait for what may or may not be.
In my view unless this car blows the socks off the competition it will remain a specialist brand with a limited customer base and following, and even it does blow the socks off - will it develop much beyond a brand with a limited following? If is going to be more than that and an assembler of someone elses design - then surely the first wave of customers who put cars on the road are part of that success. Pity the new TVR dont see that and provide updates more often.
Reading the latest EVO mag and Richard Meaden writes about how 'enough is enough' with regards to the modern cars ability to be driven extremely quickly, but taking some of the joy out of the process.
This is for me where TVR can excel. Although it will be very fast, if ever actually built, it will be a more analogue experience which should excite the driver, while hitting your senses. Whether it's through the seat, the steering, through the GEAR LEVER, through the exhaust pipes, or simply enjoying the interior or exterior looks. This car should be able to be give you a buzz just by looking at it parked up.
So many of the modern monsters simply weigh too much and numb the thrill because they're too well built, too heavy, don't need as much commitment to drive fast due to their clever 4WD systems and clever gearboxes. They have fake exhaust sounds, fake pops and bangs etc..
The prices of modern classics, which are lighter, N/A, have basic RWD and manual boxes, less fussy infotainment systems, which just give you a simpler more analogue drive seem to be rising in value, for a good reason. The car world needs TVR in my opinion and it does not need to be the fastest or best at anything, technically. Just make you WANT to drive for no other reason than enjoying your car.
C'maaan TVR, GET THE BUGGER BUILT!!!
This is for me where TVR can excel. Although it will be very fast, if ever actually built, it will be a more analogue experience which should excite the driver, while hitting your senses. Whether it's through the seat, the steering, through the GEAR LEVER, through the exhaust pipes, or simply enjoying the interior or exterior looks. This car should be able to be give you a buzz just by looking at it parked up.
So many of the modern monsters simply weigh too much and numb the thrill because they're too well built, too heavy, don't need as much commitment to drive fast due to their clever 4WD systems and clever gearboxes. They have fake exhaust sounds, fake pops and bangs etc..
The prices of modern classics, which are lighter, N/A, have basic RWD and manual boxes, less fussy infotainment systems, which just give you a simpler more analogue drive seem to be rising in value, for a good reason. The car world needs TVR in my opinion and it does not need to be the fastest or best at anything, technically. Just make you WANT to drive for no other reason than enjoying your car.
C'maaan TVR, GET THE BUGGER BUILT!!!
wanacoop said:
Reading the latest EVO mag and Richard Meaden writes about how 'enough is enough' with regards to the modern cars ability to be driven extremely quickly, but taking some of the joy out of the process.
This is for me where TVR can excel. Although it will be very fast, if ever actually built, it will be a more analogue experience which should excite the driver, while hitting your senses. Whether it's through the seat, the steering, through the GEAR LEVER, through the exhaust pipes, or simply
enjoying the interior or exterior looks.This car should be able to be give you a buzz just by looking at it parked up.
So many of the modern monsters simply weigh too much and numb the thrill because they're too well built, too heavy, don't need as much commitment to drive fast due to their clever 4WD systems and clever gearboxes. They have fake exhaust sounds, fake pops and bangs etc..
The prices of modern classics, which are lighter, N/A, have basic RWD and manual boxes, less fussy infotainment systems, which just give you a simpler more analogue drive seem to be rising in value, for a good reason. The car world needs TVR in my opinion and it does not need to be the fastest or best at anything, technically. Just make you WANT to drive for no other reason than enjoying your car.
C'maaan TVR, GET THE BUGGER BUILT!!!
If it's built, I think success will depend on the bold part above, other than that, I agree wholeheartedly with you - TVR can do this, IF they just wake up and smell the coffee, the car is just not something I would covet - they should either bring it to a 50k price point or 150k, at 90k it is just too bland for the money, at 50k it still ain't no looker but neither are its competitors, at 150k with 600bhp, sitting low with wide arches, fat rubber etc. - it's perfect This is for me where TVR can excel. Although it will be very fast, if ever actually built, it will be a more analogue experience which should excite the driver, while hitting your senses. Whether it's through the seat, the steering, through the GEAR LEVER, through the exhaust pipes, or simply
enjoying the interior or exterior looks.This car should be able to be give you a buzz just by looking at it parked up.
So many of the modern monsters simply weigh too much and numb the thrill because they're too well built, too heavy, don't need as much commitment to drive fast due to their clever 4WD systems and clever gearboxes. They have fake exhaust sounds, fake pops and bangs etc..
The prices of modern classics, which are lighter, N/A, have basic RWD and manual boxes, less fussy infotainment systems, which just give you a simpler more analogue drive seem to be rising in value, for a good reason. The car world needs TVR in my opinion and it does not need to be the fastest or best at anything, technically. Just make you WANT to drive for no other reason than enjoying your car.
C'maaan TVR, GET THE BUGGER BUILT!!!
Edited by Testarossa on Thursday 25th April 22:41
how would say such lovely AMG GT(s etc) compare to the 'new' (already old) TVR Griffith?
I mean, if the new price will get to around 100k, you can also buy a new or almost new AMG GT version with around 500 or more hp, those look also good me thinks and are very fast also on the Ring if thats your thing as well.
there are many for sale, from in the 60 to start with, just an example
https://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/...
made a little compilation? TVR Griffith vs AMG GT(sorts)
I mean, if the new price will get to around 100k, you can also buy a new or almost new AMG GT version with around 500 or more hp, those look also good me thinks and are very fast also on the Ring if thats your thing as well.
there are many for sale, from in the 60 to start with, just an example
https://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/...
made a little compilation? TVR Griffith vs AMG GT(sorts)
GTRene said:
how would say such lovely AMG GT(s etc) compare to the 'new' (already old) TVR Griffith?
I mean, if the new price will get to around 100k, you can also buy a new or almost new AMG GT version with around 500 or more hp, those look also good me thinks and are very fast also on the Ring if thats your thing as well.
there are many for sale, from in the 60 to start with, just an example
https://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/...
made a little compilation? TVR Griffith vs AMG GT(sorts)
A mate bought one last year - ex dealer demonstrator stock with 1500 miles for £68k. It’s awesome, and now retuned to some ridiculous hp on tap not that he’ll use it much but it’s there. I mean, if the new price will get to around 100k, you can also buy a new or almost new AMG GT version with around 500 or more hp, those look also good me thinks and are very fast also on the Ring if thats your thing as well.
there are many for sale, from in the 60 to start with, just an example
https://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/...
made a little compilation? TVR Griffith vs AMG GT(sorts)
GTRene said:
how would say such lovely AMG GT(s etc) compare to the 'new' (already old) TVR Griffith?
I mean, if the new price will get to around 100k, you can also buy a new or almost new AMG GT version with around 500 or more hp, those look also good me thinks and are very fast also on the Ring if thats your thing as well.
there are many for sale, from in the 60 to start with, just an example
https://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/...
made a little compilation? TVR Griffith vs AMG GT(sorts)
Amg no contest. If it weren't for the fact you can't fit a bike rack on the roof (don't laugh) I'd have had one on my drive now. I mean, if the new price will get to around 100k, you can also buy a new or almost new AMG GT version with around 500 or more hp, those look also good me thinks and are very fast also on the Ring if thats your thing as well.
there are many for sale, from in the 60 to start with, just an example
https://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/...
made a little compilation? TVR Griffith vs AMG GT(sorts)
New corvette now has a release date of 18/07/19, and they’ve added 400 jobs to one of their plants. Will be very interesting to see how this pans out.
Cost will be inline or less than the Griffith.
https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a27274986/chevro...
Cost will be inline or less than the Griffith.
https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a27274986/chevro...
GTRene said:
how would say such lovely AMG GT(s etc) compare to the 'new' (already old) TVR Griffith?
I mean, if the new price will get to around 100k, you can also buy a new or almost new AMG GT version with around 500 or more hp, those look also good me thinks and are very fast also on the Ring if thats your thing as well.
there are many for sale, from in the 60 to start with, just an example
https://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/...
made a little compilation? TVR Griffith vs AMG GT(sorts)
Much as I like TVR, I would have the Merc, for me the 'new' Griff looks limp. I mean, if the new price will get to around 100k, you can also buy a new or almost new AMG GT version with around 500 or more hp, those look also good me thinks and are very fast also on the Ring if thats your thing as well.
there are many for sale, from in the 60 to start with, just an example
https://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/...
made a little compilation? TVR Griffith vs AMG GT(sorts)
GTRene said:
how would say such lovely AMG GT(s etc) compare to the 'new' (already old) TVR Griffith?
I mean, if the new price will get to around 100k, you can also buy a new or almost new AMG GT version with around 500 or more hp, those look also good me thinks and are very fast also on the Ring if thats your thing as well.
there are many for sale, from in the 60 to start with, just an example
https://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/...
made a little compilation? TVR Griffith vs AMG GT(sorts)
That is a mighty compelling argument!!I mean, if the new price will get to around 100k, you can also buy a new or almost new AMG GT version with around 500 or more hp, those look also good me thinks and are very fast also on the Ring if thats your thing as well.
there are many for sale, from in the 60 to start with, just an example
https://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/...
made a little compilation? TVR Griffith vs AMG GT(sorts)
Of course the AMG wont be properly engineered or have build quality anything like a TVR.....Mercedes just dont have the resources obviously.....
The TVR does not have to be empirically better than every competitor.
It just has to appeal to a few people who want something different from Mercs and Corvettes and Porsches and whatever other mainstream name people want to throw up.
Rather like a bumble bee, Morgan shouldn’t be able to fly. Because the competition is ‘better’.
And yet enough people fancy something a little different.
It just has to appeal to a few people who want something different from Mercs and Corvettes and Porsches and whatever other mainstream name people want to throw up.
Rather like a bumble bee, Morgan shouldn’t be able to fly. Because the competition is ‘better’.
And yet enough people fancy something a little different.
swisstoni said:
The TVR does not have to be empirically better than every competitor.
It just has to appeal to a few people who want something different from Mercs and Corvettes and Porsches and whatever other mainstream name people want to throw up.
Rather like a bumble bee, Morgan shouldn’t be able to fly. Because the competition is ‘better’.
And yet enough people fancy something a little different.
Morgan are different and succeed because they have a USP of the styling.It just has to appeal to a few people who want something different from Mercs and Corvettes and Porsches and whatever other mainstream name people want to throw up.
Rather like a bumble bee, Morgan shouldn’t be able to fly. Because the competition is ‘better’.
And yet enough people fancy something a little different.
If Morgan tried to do a modern looking car I think they’d struggle too which is why they don’t.
bertie said:
swisstoni said:
The TVR does not have to be empirically better than every competitor.
It just has to appeal to a few people who want something different from Mercs and Corvettes and Porsches and whatever other mainstream name people want to throw up.
Rather like a bumble bee, Morgan shouldn’t be able to fly. Because the competition is ‘better’.
And yet enough people fancy something a little different.
Morgan are different and succeed because they have a USP of the styling.It just has to appeal to a few people who want something different from Mercs and Corvettes and Porsches and whatever other mainstream name people want to throw up.
Rather like a bumble bee, Morgan shouldn’t be able to fly. Because the competition is ‘better’.
And yet enough people fancy something a little different.
If Morgan tried to do a modern looking car I think they’d struggle too which is why they don’t.
The TVR will be different.
swisstoni said:
They are different.
The TVR will be different.
Not different enough though. The TVR will be different.
The TVR looks like a Toyota, the Morgan is unique
It only has a USP if you say you want a car from a start up with a front engine, V8 manual, rear wheel drive, built in Wales called a TVR Griffith and buyers happy to wait for ages.
Yes there is no other car that meets that criteria.
I wonder why other manufacturers haven’t noticed and filled that gap?
Zippee said:
GTRene said:
how would say such lovely AMG GT(s etc) compare to the 'new' (already old) TVR Griffith?
I mean, if the new price will get to around 100k, you can also buy a new or almost new AMG GT version with around 500 or more hp, those look also good me thinks and are very fast also on the Ring if thats your thing as well.
there are many for sale, from in the 60 to start with, just an example
https://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/...
made a little compilation? TVR Griffith vs AMG GT(sorts)
Amg no contest. If it weren't for the fact you can't fit a bike rack on the roof (don't laugh) I'd have had one on my drive now. I mean, if the new price will get to around 100k, you can also buy a new or almost new AMG GT version with around 500 or more hp, those look also good me thinks and are very fast also on the Ring if thats your thing as well.
there are many for sale, from in the 60 to start with, just an example
https://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/...
made a little compilation? TVR Griffith vs AMG GT(sorts)
roof rack? they seem to have this, but I would not dare such if I was a bike person.
https://seasuckerblog.com/2017/10/01/mercedes-amg-...
AMG GT-R looks great as well, but more expensive.
Edited by GTRene on Friday 26th April 14:07
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