New TVR still under wraps! (Vol. 2)
Discussion
unrepentant said:
m4tti said:
dvs_dave said:
skwdenyer said:
There’s quite a difference between a hybrid and an EV.
For instance, the current Eire proposal is that no non-zero emission vehicles will be sold in Ireland after 2030. No hybrids.
And all non-zero emission vehicles off the road completely by 2045.
Eire will not be alone in this.
Part of the problem is that TVR needs investors, who will be looking in part at the current and potential brand equity. Les needs a coherent story as to how the TVR DNA is going to be translated into a ZEV world; otherwise who is going to invest? Or more specifically, who is going to invest on terms that don’t dilute all the existing shareholders out of the door.
They’re saying that now, but I just don’t think it’s feasible. Full EV’s won’t get cheap enough quick enough, and the range isn’t increasing quick enough either. Let alone the vast charging infrastructure that will have to be put in place over the next decade.For instance, the current Eire proposal is that no non-zero emission vehicles will be sold in Ireland after 2030. No hybrids.
And all non-zero emission vehicles off the road completely by 2045.
Eire will not be alone in this.
Part of the problem is that TVR needs investors, who will be looking in part at the current and potential brand equity. Les needs a coherent story as to how the TVR DNA is going to be translated into a ZEV world; otherwise who is going to invest? Or more specifically, who is going to invest on terms that don’t dilute all the existing shareholders out of the door.
The market simply won’t stand it, so they’ll almost certainly back off on it. 20 years time is more realistic. 10 years, no chance.
Without some form of renewable there won’t be any net gain from discontinuing IC’s.
China is driving the engine technologies for the future as this is THE market.
They have pushed hard for electric cars, so every manufacturers had to follow the path.
Now, they are giving more chance to plugin hybrid (I guess they have seen that full electric is not always so convenient and moreover that battery cost is the main drawback). However, they are asking those cars to do at least 50km in zero emission. So, all manufacturers are following this way if you check all coming models.
For tomorrow, they are investing (gambling maybe but with the biggest stack of coins) on hydrogen, I guess that we will see European manufacturers coming soon with such cars.
If you don't target China (or California) this is less a constraint I think.
They have pushed hard for electric cars, so every manufacturers had to follow the path.
Now, they are giving more chance to plugin hybrid (I guess they have seen that full electric is not always so convenient and moreover that battery cost is the main drawback). However, they are asking those cars to do at least 50km in zero emission. So, all manufacturers are following this way if you check all coming models.
For tomorrow, they are investing (gambling maybe but with the biggest stack of coins) on hydrogen, I guess that we will see European manufacturers coming soon with such cars.
If you don't target China (or California) this is less a constraint I think.
m4tti said:
Woah, woah, woah, hold your horses Dave! When I said a few pages back that the infrastructure and renewables weren’t in place to make BEV’s feasible or sustainable, you told me to look how quick mobile phone technology had moved on in a short space of time, and expect energy and bevs to do the same
What I said still stands.....20 years is a short space of time (pretty much how long the cell phone network took to become a properly day-to-day “essential” service) when it comes to sea changes of infrastructure and services. 10 years for ALL new cars to be EV’s and all that’s required to effectively support that is a pie in the sky timeline for Ireland.An analogy of where we’re at now as far as EV development is concerned is somewhere around here.
Amazing tech in isolation, but so so far to go.
dvs_dave said:
What I said still stands.....20 years is a short space of time (pretty much how long the cell phone network took to become a properly day-to-day “essential” service) when it comes to sea changes of infrastructure and services. 10 years for ALL new cars to be EV’s and all that’s required to effectively support that is a pie in the sky timeline for Ireland.
An analogy of where we’re at now as far as EV development is concerned is somewhere around here.
Amazing tech in isolation, but so so far to go.
That looks like a Motorola DynaTAC... released 1984. So 30 years+ !An analogy of where we’re at now as far as EV development is concerned is somewhere around here.
Amazing tech in isolation, but so so far to go.
Edited by m4tti on Tuesday 3rd September 08:06
Yep it’s proper tumble weed territory now. The update was mumbo jumbo.
The fit out has nothing to do with this. It will be refurbished so it can be rented. It’s on “sale and lease back” like the Aston factory. The welsh government have sold it to a fund and now rent it back. They’ll need to get it in shape regardless.
They have no money. Full stop. There will be no car till they do.
The fit out has nothing to do with this. It will be refurbished so it can be rented. It’s on “sale and lease back” like the Aston factory. The welsh government have sold it to a fund and now rent it back. They’ll need to get it in shape regardless.
They have no money. Full stop. There will be no car till they do.
Gazzab said:
They ‘just’ need a better business plan with a product that people want and that is appropriate for these revolutionary times. An ugly car with a V8 petrol engine isn’t it.
No one in their right mind is going to invest in the current project.
Personally I don't think it's "ugly", that's a bit strong. I don't even mind the headlamps, but I'm sure they can be re designed fairly cheaply, not many seem to like them, the muted applause at the reveal said a lot.No one in their right mind is going to invest in the current project.
I hope it does materialise, but every month it's looking less likely, but who knows what's going on behind the scenes?
In the long term electric is the way to go, as nice as a big yank V8 sounds.
I'm sure what most people want is what is generally unobtainable.
A big V8, great sound, good looks, manual gearbox and exclusivity.
I did Snetterton on Thursday. There were far faster and better cars there but I always get people asking to see under the bonnet, comment on the great noise and looks and always ask questions.
You don't get that with the Porsches and Lotuses out there .
Gratuitous photograph.
I still want to see a success made of the new car and in fact the new griff would suit my needs perfectly, but...........
A big V8, great sound, good looks, manual gearbox and exclusivity.
I did Snetterton on Thursday. There were far faster and better cars there but I always get people asking to see under the bonnet, comment on the great noise and looks and always ask questions.
You don't get that with the Porsches and Lotuses out there .
Gratuitous photograph.
I still want to see a success made of the new car and in fact the new griff would suit my needs perfectly, but...........
I think there IS a market for this new TVR. People who don't like the idea of EVs coming along and spoiling their party will buy it!
The problem is that the market is, imo, small. Certainly way too small to support a large factory and all the overheads that go along with it. The problem it seems is that NewCo were shooting for the Moon, but only had enough money to get to Glasgow. Had they been realistic, then they could have got to Glasgow on the money they had and be making (a small number of) cars right now.........
The problem is that the market is, imo, small. Certainly way too small to support a large factory and all the overheads that go along with it. The problem it seems is that NewCo were shooting for the Moon, but only had enough money to get to Glasgow. Had they been realistic, then they could have got to Glasgow on the money they had and be making (a small number of) cars right now.........
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