New TVR still under wraps! (Vol. 2)

New TVR still under wraps! (Vol. 2)

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Discussion

phazed

18,181 posts

149 months

Monday 9th September
quotequote all
All in all a real shame.

On my way back yesterday, I called in to where the prototype is parked in the showroom window of their office, front on.

In the flesh, the front doesn’t look as guppy as people make out and as a whole the car looks great, an individual coupe set apart from the bland norm. It’s just sat there waiting to be released!

Such a shame it has faltered at this stage.

El stovey

27,746 posts

208 months

Monday 9th September
quotequote all
V6 Pushfit said:
They had a nicely full order book of those who were ok with the front so despite your views on it (which I understand to a point) the front was not the deal breaker
Most deposits were placed before it was released. They’ve declined ever since. If it looked better there would be more deposits and people wanting to invest in it. The poor communication and PR etc have all added to it though. But if that car looked better to more people it wouldn’t be in such a dire situation.

Gazzab

17,070 posts

227 months

Monday 9th September
quotequote all
Opinions are like **** holes but as far as I am concerned the looks of the car did mean it received a damp reception. Regardless of brexit, factory, welsh government, EV’s etc the styling issues have contributed to the reduction in deposits, the lack of excitement within the motoring press, the lack of awareness with the general public and finally the investor challenges. An investor when shown nothing more tangible than a spreadsheet of hope is going to leave their cheque book in their pocket. If however the excitement and anticipation was off the scale then they MIGHT be more likely to invest.

V6 Pushfit

10,703 posts

55 months

Monday 9th September
quotequote all
El stovey said:
Most deposits were placed before it was released. They’ve declined ever since. If it looked better there would be more deposits and people wanting to invest in it. The poor communication and PR etc have all added to it though. But if that car looked better to more people it wouldn’t be in such a dire situation.
My understanding is that by the original reveal they had orders yes, but the UK 'tour reveal' and the one in Holland resulted in a flood of orders. I stand by the onion that the front is just a red herring smile

midenginedcoupe

4,439 posts

77 months

Monday 9th September
quotequote all
V6 Pushfit said:
My understanding is that by the original reveal they had orders yes, but the UK 'tour reveal' and the one in Holland resulted in a flood of orders. I stand by the onion that the front is just a red herring smile
Agreed.

bullittmcqueen

803 posts

36 months

Monday 9th September
quotequote all
Gazzab said:
Opinions are like **** holes but as far as I am concerned the looks of the car did mean it received a damp reception. Regardless of brexit, factory, welsh government, EV’s etc the styling issues have contributed to the reduction in deposits, the lack of excitement within the motoring press, the lack of awareness with the general public and finally the investor challenges. An investor when shown nothing more tangible than a spreadsheet of hope is going to leave their cheque book in their pocket. If however the excitement and anticipation was off the scale then they MIGHT be more likely to invest.
Comms etc. all agreed.

But i dare you to take a look at any of the forums here or elsewhere. I have not seen a single car that did not get its fair share of flak. Supra, Z4, devastating. Janarelly low-end mixed at best. Just take a look at the recent forum-entries for the Ferraris here on PH and a pattern emerges. It's two thirds negative. Cars just lost their capacity to excite any more, at least not the overall audience here. And they don't have to. You just need to cater to the 3% that actually want to buy it and forget the rest of the crowd. Pleasing everybody is not going anywhere.

With the initial response, are you referring to Goodwood ? The car got applause and that's all you can expect. No idea what anybody expected beyond that. I've seen Ferrari reveals that got 3 seconds of applause.

It's just gotten a lot more difficult to be extreme these days, hence the comparison with old TVRs is a bit moot. Same in music: the Beatles grew their hair an inch longer and that was the end of civilization. These days you could blow yourself up on stage and people would complain it's boring.

With all that said, their comms and planning still suck, but i hope they make it. I've seen the car in the flesh and i'm sure it would turn way more heads than the usual Ferrari/Porsche/Lambo etc. crowd.



Gazzab

17,070 posts

227 months

Monday 9th September
quotequote all
Not sure I referred to an ‘initial response’ / an event. However the threads on here and fb at the time of a reveal or a showing did generally poor scorn on the front end. The other cars you mention are a different kettle of fish ie they aren’t a start up, aren’t after funding, are productionised, are after different customer segments etc. But I do agree that there are plenty of ugly cars out there that probably do ok despite what we see. I quite fancy an Alpine and that’s got a funny front end (but they are available to buy and the real world feedback is fab).

bullittmcqueen

803 posts

36 months

Monday 9th September
quotequote all
Gazzab said:
Not sure I referred to an ‘initial response’ / an event. However the threads on here and fb at the time of a reveal or a showing did generally poor scorn on the front end. The other cars you mention are a different kettle of fish ie they aren’t a start up, aren’t after funding, are productionised, are after different customer segments etc. But I do agree that there are plenty of ugly cars out there that probably do ok despite what we see. I quite fancy an Alpine and that’s got a funny front end (but they are available to buy and the real world feedback is fab).
I see. Sure, the others are established manufacturers, creating the business side alongside the car in these times poses an additional monumentous task. It's an extreme niche car, no doubt. But in the end it may be a better proposition than trying to play with the big boys like Aston does. Look at their economics, they are doomed to cater to the stock-market expectations which is not a good thing imo and might ultimately kill them.

But back to the looks, what was the last car that actually flashed you ? I cannot remember, tbh. Lot's of disappointments recently, and that's only the looks. All BMWs off, dead boring. Audi has completely lost it. Porsche, hm. Janarelly, liked the Cobra-resemblance at first, but too fuzzy and the cut-aways don't work., but to many extremes in that one. Very nice rear though. Supra, get's the price for the biggest f*ck-up in ages. Alpine is nice, great heritage and they knew what they were doing (looks apart: no manual, unmanly engine). Even the Lotuses are not really there. New C8 decided to go undistinguishable as well.
Closest to a true masterpiece imo is the Merc AMG GT, but the interior, no manual and it's a Merc.

So, it's not easy afterall.


m4tti

4,604 posts

100 months

Monday 9th September
quotequote all
bullittmcqueen said:
Comms etc. all agreed.

But i dare you to take a look at any of the forums here or elsewhere. I have not seen a single car that did not get its fair share of flak. Supra, Z4, devastating. Janarelly low-end mixed at best. Just take a look at the recent forum-entries for the Ferraris here on PH and a pattern emerges. It's two thirds negative. Cars just lost their capacity to excite any more, at least not the overall audience here. And they don't have to. You just need to cater to the 3% that actually want to buy it and forget the rest of the crowd. Pleasing everybody is not going anywhere.

With the initial response, are you referring to Goodwood ? The car got applause and that's all you can expect. No idea what anybody expected beyond that. I've seen Ferrari reveals that got 3 seconds of applause.

It's just gotten a lot more difficult to be extreme these days, hence the comparison with old TVRs is a bit moot. Same in music: the Beatles grew their hair an inch longer and that was the end of civilization. These days you could blow yourself up on stage and people would complain it's boring.

With all that said, their comms and planning still suck, but i hope they make it. I've seen the car in the flesh and i'm sure it would turn way more heads than the usual Ferrari/Porsche/Lambo etc. crowd.
It’s a bit early to be hitting the bottle hehe

I can’t see it turning any heads. The front really is gormless. I took a pic at Beaulie last year. It just needs some teeth.







Gumpert have still managed to produce something crazy looking.


phazed

18,181 posts

149 months

Monday 9th September
quotequote all
Agree with all the above.

Unbelievably with so many cars on the road there is actually little choice. Nothing really sets the heart on fire, generic and boring spring to mind.

bullittmcqueen

803 posts

36 months

Monday 9th September
quotequote all
m4tti said:
Gumpert have still managed to produce something crazy looking.

Yep, crazy it is, but not all madness looks good biggrin

With the TVR, yes there is a front-angle that is not convincing. It's not as grave in the flesh, though, but still. Not a showstopper for me.

And don't forget, this here is the same car, so there are angles that work:


Gazzab

17,070 posts

227 months

Monday 9th September
quotequote all
I think there are plenty of new cars on the road that I personally think look pretty good (for what they are) and are likely to be considerations for Griff type customers.:
911
R8
Aston Martin various
Merc AMG GT
Alpine
Lotus Evora

Well designed ‘sports cars’ (some GTs).

Byker28i

19,171 posts

162 months

Monday 9th September
quotequote all
...and everyone forgets that the car isn't just for TVR owners only and isn't a follow on from the Sagaris, it has to appeal to many other buyers as the first of the new cars. As such it was never going to be bonkers.

Stick this on the top gear test track, it goes top ten, they love it and it'll fly...

V6 Pushfit

10,703 posts

55 months

Monday 9th September
quotequote all
Gazzab said:
Not sure I referred to an ‘initial response’ / an event. However the threads on here and fb at the time of a reveal or a showing did generally poor scorn on the front end.
Fair enough but 99% of those who gave it stick wouldn't have been in a position to buy it anyway. It didn't stop more deposits and wasn't the death knell - lack of comms and impetus hitting a brick wall have been the issue.

m4tti

4,604 posts

100 months

Monday 9th September
quotequote all
Byker28i said:
...and everyone forgets that the car isn't just for TVR owners only and isn't a follow on from the Sagaris, it has to appeal to many other buyers as the first of the new cars. As such it was never going to be bonkers.

Stick this on the top gear test track, it goes top ten, they love it and it'll fly...
This is interesting... what will it do on the top gear test track. I can pretty much guarantee it won’t be top 10. It’ll be amazing if it’s top 20.

I’m going for 1:17.8


Edited by m4tti on Monday 9th September 13:29

Wacky Racer

31,510 posts

192 months

Monday 9th September
quotequote all
A reminder of what the reveal was like:-

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lFsOB78eBeE

Personally, I don't mind the headlamps......

bullittmcqueen

803 posts

36 months

Monday 9th September
quotequote all
Wacky Racer said:
A reminder of what the reveal was like:-

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lFsOB78eBeE

Personally, I don't mind the headlamps......
That one has particularly bad sound and position. Check this one: (1:22 - 1:45)

https://youtu.be/lUeCXMPmyvk?t=84


Honestly, this was a random 50year+ audience. What to expect ?


Here, similar events

Ferrari:
https://youtu.be/KnY_JB97Nr8?t=126

Aston:
https://youtu.be/Pzf5gdwjKYA?t=90


And here a thundering round of applause for the new Porsche:
https://youtu.be/eMq2JrpId8c?t=823


So the TVR reveal was pretty representative in terms of general excitement.

Edited by bullittmcqueen on Monday 9th September 13:47

rev-erend

20,090 posts

229 months

Monday 9th September
quotequote all
So has it been cancelled but to depositors pulling out and other issues ?

phazed

18,181 posts

149 months

Monday 9th September
quotequote all
I know it’s from this angle and the colour all adds to it but for me, this is exactly the right shape and size of a usable car for the English roads. A sort of sensible sized dodge viper.


[/quote]

The colour red on the prototype has never done it any favours in my opinion.

bullittmcqueen

803 posts

36 months

Monday 9th September
quotequote all

phazed said:
I know it’s from this angle and the colour all adds to it but for me, this is exactly the right shape and size of a usable car for the English roads. A sort of sensible sized dodge viper.



The colour red on the prototype has never done it any favours in my opinion.
I very much like everything from all angles about it in this video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zo-Rccip5Es

And after looking at it for 5 times again, i say: build the damn thing !!