Al Melling Plans to keep TVR British
Discussion
GETSIS said:
mid 2004 engine builds, most of the "soft" parts had been engineered out by then. Rule of thumb is the later the engine the better. Also if the warm up procedure isn't done correctly it can reduce the life of the engine.
I would only buy a 2002 car etc if it had an engine rebuild after 2004!!! that's just me! I would still get the warranty though :-)
I would only buy a 2002 car etc if it had an engine rebuild after 2004!!! that's just me! I would still get the warranty though :-)
Thanks. Do you happen to know the warm up/cool down procedure?
He designed those engines for TVR, however it seems that perhaps to cut production costs some of the components were replaced with inferior ones, such as the designed solid billet crank being replaced with a cast one. Similarly, the con rods were slightly different in their geometry to the ones that Mr Melling's company designed. Also the finger followers got a similar 'tweak'. The result was that certain engines went bang, & hence so many re-builds that you read about in the 'for sale' columns. There is also a story that at times in the Blackpool plant (or wherever TVR's own engines were assembled), some parts delivered were 'faultly', and some were fine, and again there's mass speculation as to how this happened.
Sadly this has been a major contributor to TVR's sales slump & current problems. Someone please correct me if i've got this wrong[/quote]
At a Directors (KJ) instruction the inferior parts were bought in from India using inferior material. Even the cranks followed the same route but after a time TVR shipped the casting to India for machining and heat treatment etc. 
Again poor management decisions !
Sadly this has been a major contributor to TVR's sales slump & current problems. Someone please correct me if i've got this wrong[/quote]
At a Directors (KJ) instruction the inferior parts were bought in from India using inferior material. Even the cranks followed the same route but after a time TVR shipped the casting to India for machining and heat treatment etc. Again poor management decisions !Jappo said:
GETSIS said:
mid 2004 engine builds, most of the "soft" parts had been engineered out by then. Rule of thumb is the later the engine the better. Also if the warm up procedure isn't done correctly it can reduce the life of the engine.
I would only buy a 2002 car etc if it had an engine rebuild after 2004!!! that's just me! I would still get the warranty though :-)
I would only buy a 2002 car etc if it had an engine rebuild after 2004!!! that's just me! I would still get the warranty though :-)
Thanks. Do you happen to know the warm up/cool down procedure?
Your handbook will tell you but these were JR's words on the subject;
RUNNING IN
Most importantly, drive fairly normally. Being too gentle with an engine when running in can be as bad as being too rough.
Although it is important to avoid full throttle or over 4,000 rpm during the first 1,000 miles, occasional bursts (c.5 seconds) of 75% throttle up to 4,000 rpm, will help to bed the piston rings in.
FROM COLD
When starting, please be careful not to let it rev straight up so please make sure that you do not give it anything more than a tiny bit of throttle while cranking it over and then lift off as soon as it catches.
Then try to avoid more than 3,000 rpm until the oil (not water) temperature has exceeded 40°C, 4,000 rpm until 60°C and 7,000 rpm until 80°C. If it climbs above 110°C, please keep the revs below 5,000 rpm until the oil temperature returns to normal.
bjwoods said:
ie if a rebuild was what was requuired every 50-60k miles on a rv8 car, most people would go along with it. Actually wouldn't be to surprised on a ferrari either. it could be budgeted for.
you can double that figure, more like 100-120k miles before a rebuild on them great rv/tvr8 cars.
ogie said:
At a Directors (KJ) instruction the inferior parts were bought in from India using inferior material. Even the cranks followed the same route but after a time TVR shipped the casting to India for machining and heat treatment etc. Again poor management decisions !Much is made of the 'cheap parts from India' and, with hindsight, it was clearly a poor decision. I think the poorer decisions were actually those that took place on and after the delivery of those parts. When KJ took the buying decision, it was fashionable in the auto industry to source from Asia - it would undoubtedly have seemed to be a good idea. TVR/KJ weren't the only ones caught out by shonky parts. The problem, as seen so many times with TVR, was in dealing with the shonkiness once it had occurred. TVR never had the processes to inspect/quality assure the incoming parts or the time and skill to correct the downstream problems. Hindsight - again - clearly indicates that it would have been cheaper to have addressed the parts issues properly than to have presided over the collapse of the company's reputation.
Melling's "sermon on the mount" lambasted the use of cheap parts and cast cranks etc.. IMHO, that was a cheap shot. At point of purchase, there was nothing to suggest that the components ordered would be anything less than fit for purpose.
The only thing more entertaining than reading all this Melling speculation and abuse for Boy Blunder, is to read what PHer's were saying about the Moleskins buy out in summer 2004! 
Read this one for starters;
www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?p=1&f=13&t=114455&h=0&hw=Smolenski
laugh
, cry 
or bow your head in shame 
- you know who you are! 
PS My former handle was ScotsGrey
PPS Well done bj woods!
Read this one for starters;
www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?p=1&f=13&t=114455&h=0&hw=Smolenski
laugh
, cry or bow your head in shame - you know who you are! PS My former handle was ScotsGrey
PPS Well done bj woods!
Edited by CiderwithCerbie on Thursday 8th February 11:02
Edited by CiderwithCerbie on Thursday 8th February 11:54
Look, can we be clear on this. Either Al Melling designed fantastic V8 & straight six engines for TVR, but TVR CHOSE to replace certain components with cheaper or 'different' ones (is this where the 'intelligent property / copyright' subject comes up ref these engines?) that have now shown themselves to not be 'fit for purpose' in these engines, or else TVR kept his designs in their entirety but were let down by a foreign parts source / supply 'error'?
If it's the latter then why did TVR never make a formal statement to explain this (after all, it was them that were let down), and recall cars of a certain age range to replace or check any suspect parts? Surely they'd be legally due some financial compensation from these Asian parts suppliers?
If it's the latter then why did TVR never make a formal statement to explain this (after all, it was them that were let down), and recall cars of a certain age range to replace or check any suspect parts? Surely they'd be legally due some financial compensation from these Asian parts suppliers?
In 2004 HAWTHORNS LTD said:
Blackpool.... UK......Monday 26th July 2004...0730hrs
Ben Samuelson greets new owner of TVR, now known to all as Saint Nik, or NS
BS: Morning NS, how was your flight to Blackpool international?
NS: Fcuk flight, I drive in my TVR
just buy from London dealer, old fellow who look like dead,
but he nice man.
BS: Oh! so did you enjoy your drive?
NS: Da, very nice, but we cum to Watford crap and "Bang" big noise from engine and he no go, man with yellow truck say it
ed, so he drive us here, he nice man too, very nice man.
BS: Ah,
NS: My car speed six da?
BS: uuumm, da, I mean yes
NS: Oky doky, not call speed six no more, just six, like grandmother, she six for many year live near power station,
why you call car with this bad name? Me think no make more car like this
BS: Well, we do have another engine, it's a AJP V8
NS: V8, like Zil ya, this good, we invent this in old days, man from Buick sell blueprints
BS: Well it's not as easy as that, we only use it now in the Cerbs and the Tuscan race car.
NS: why you give to Serbs, these people strange, give them speed six, get rid to them,
we keep V8 da!
BS: Ok NS, whatever you say
NS: I like that you say this Mr Ben, you good man, you stay help me make this company good again da, ah, and get me interpreter, I not understanding people here, sound differant to London talk, man on gate say"oooohhhthefukareyou" what this mean????
Ben Samuelson greets new owner of TVR, now known to all as Saint Nik, or NS
BS: Morning NS, how was your flight to Blackpool international?
NS: Fcuk flight, I drive in my TVR
just buy from London dealer, old fellow who look like dead, but he nice man. BS: Oh! so did you enjoy your drive?
NS: Da, very nice, but we cum to Watford crap and "Bang" big noise from engine and he no go, man with yellow truck say it
ed, so he drive us here, he nice man too, very nice man. BS: Ah,
NS: My car speed six da?
BS: uuumm, da, I mean yes
NS: Oky doky, not call speed six no more, just six, like grandmother, she six for many year live near power station,
why you call car with this bad name? Me think no make more car like this BS: Well, we do have another engine, it's a AJP V8
NS: V8, like Zil ya, this good, we invent this in old days, man from Buick sell blueprints
BS: Well it's not as easy as that, we only use it now in the Cerbs and the Tuscan race car.
NS: why you give to Serbs, these people strange, give them speed six, get rid to them,
we keep V8 da! BS: Ok NS, whatever you say
NS: I like that you say this Mr Ben, you good man, you stay help me make this company good again da, ah, and get me interpreter, I not understanding people here, sound differant to London talk, man on gate say"oooohhhthefukareyou" what this mean????
the green hornet said:
Look, can we be clear on this. Either Al Melling designed fantastic V8 & straight six engines for TVR, but TVR CHOSE to replace certain components with cheaper or 'different' ones (is this where the 'intelligent property / copyright' subject comes up ref these engines?) that have now shown themselves to not be 'fit for purpose' in these engines, or else TVR kept his designs in their entirety but were let down by a foreign parts source / supply 'error'?
Neither. Clear enough?
Horse_Apple said:
BossCerbera said:
One of my favourites:
It's sad how wrong I was about Wheeler. A great shame.In 2004 Horse_Apple said:
Who honestly believes that Wheeler would offload a company such as TVR, which he has put so much into, to some monkey, ignorant cowboy?
Take solace from how accurate you were about the other bloke!
BossCerbera said:
the green hornet said:
Look, can we be clear on this. Either Al Melling designed fantastic V8 & straight six engines for TVR, but TVR CHOSE to replace certain components with cheaper or 'different' ones (is this where the 'intelligent property / copyright' subject comes up ref these engines?) that have now shown themselves to not be 'fit for purpose' in these engines, or else TVR kept his designs in their entirety but were let down by a foreign parts source / supply 'error'?
Neither. Clear enough?
Errm, how about no!
BossCerbera said:
Horse_Apple said:
BossCerbera said:
One of my favourites:
It's sad how wrong I was about Wheeler. A great shame.In 2004 Horse_Apple said:
Who honestly believes that Wheeler would offload a company such as TVR, which he has put so much into, to some monkey, ignorant cowboy?
Take solace from how accurate you were about the other bloke!
Gassing Station | General TVR Stuff & Gossip | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff