Best wheel cleaner?
Discussion
Fair play re.Bilt Hamber then.
I was just going by experience. I'm one of those who likes the inside of my alloys to be clean, and I often remove the wheels to clean them. Whenever I buy a new (second hand) car it's on the list of things to do.
My experience with Bilt Hamber came when I bought a 2002 MR2 this summer - the wheels had never been cleaned on the inside, they were filthy. I read the reviews of Bilt and decided it must be good. I tried several applications, including scrubbing with a non-stick pad but it simply wouldn't shift the burned on brake dust. I then ordered some trusty Wonder Wheels, and with a bit of scrubbing with the brush the black crud was gone.
I have since discovered Harpic toilet cleaner (same active ingredient as Wonder Wheels, hydrochloric acid (10%) - but it's actually better because the gel is easier to apply and sticks to the crud doing it's magic. Undiluted for never cleaned wheels, 50% with water for regular cleaning. Quick spray, then power wash off is all it needs.
I did use what was left of the Bilt for regular cleaning and it was fine once the burnt on stuff was gone.
The whole 'turns red' is pure marketing gimmick. If you spray it onto plastic (clean) garden furniture or concrete etc. it still turns red. They simply add a colour changing chemical into the mix to make it look cool.
I was just going by experience. I'm one of those who likes the inside of my alloys to be clean, and I often remove the wheels to clean them. Whenever I buy a new (second hand) car it's on the list of things to do.
My experience with Bilt Hamber came when I bought a 2002 MR2 this summer - the wheels had never been cleaned on the inside, they were filthy. I read the reviews of Bilt and decided it must be good. I tried several applications, including scrubbing with a non-stick pad but it simply wouldn't shift the burned on brake dust. I then ordered some trusty Wonder Wheels, and with a bit of scrubbing with the brush the black crud was gone.
I have since discovered Harpic toilet cleaner (same active ingredient as Wonder Wheels, hydrochloric acid (10%) - but it's actually better because the gel is easier to apply and sticks to the crud doing it's magic. Undiluted for never cleaned wheels, 50% with water for regular cleaning. Quick spray, then power wash off is all it needs.
I did use what was left of the Bilt for regular cleaning and it was fine once the burnt on stuff was gone.
The whole 'turns red' is pure marketing gimmick. If you spray it onto plastic (clean) garden furniture or concrete etc. it still turns red. They simply add a colour changing chemical into the mix to make it look cool.
^
Try the same test with Sonax or any of the other similar wheel cleaners, and they’d have done the same.
I’ve already said that it’s a simple visual chemical reaction taking place.
If you want to test this out, simply re-apply it on something you’ve just used it on and rinsed off – it’ll not turn red if there’s nothing left to react with.
Try the same test with Sonax or any of the other similar wheel cleaners, and they’d have done the same.
I’ve already said that it’s a simple visual chemical reaction taking place.
bilthamber website said:
...auto-wheel’s pH neutral formulation reacts with the oxidising surface of the metallic particles rendering it water soluble, the rapid removal of this microscopically rusted surface reduces the embedded particle size and releases it from the surface. Unlike acid based alloy wheel cleaners, this method is harmless to the wheel’s finish. The reaction is seen by a rapid colour change from clear to deep red. After a simple hose, rinse down or jetwash it leaves the wheel spotless. In severe cases the included wheel brush can be used to assist the process.
Fallout isn’t just brake dust from your own brakes that’s somehow managed to get on your paintwork – it’s airborne, which means it is carried on the wind and lands wherever it does.If you want to test this out, simply re-apply it on something you’ve just used it on and rinsed off – it’ll not turn red if there’s nothing left to react with.
Wait Here Until Green Light Shows said:
Sorry but Bilt Hamber is shyte (have you guys actually used it, or are you just relying on suspect reviews to form an opinion...I don't get it?) - it's only good as a regular cleaner for light brake dust, assuming you can stand the awful smell.
Harpic power plus watered down and chucked in a spray bottle is perfect for regular use...it's also mega cheap.
I use it regularly (once a month) and the results are very good for a PH neutral water based product. I guarantee that you can clean all you like with Harpic or whatever nasty bleach you want to throw on the lacquer on your wheels that if you spray Auto Wheel on it after you will see red, its because its not a wheel cleaner as such, its like IronX it removes all the fallout your bleach wont touch that will ultimately end the life of your wheels earlier than without the fallout being removed. Harpic power plus watered down and chucked in a spray bottle is perfect for regular use...it's also mega cheap.
Edited by Wait Here Until Green Light Shows on Wednesday 6th September 23:17
coldel said:
Wait Here Until Green Light Shows said:
Sorry but Bilt Hamber is shyte (have you guys actually used it, or are you just relying on suspect reviews to form an opinion...I don't get it?) - it's only good as a regular cleaner for light brake dust, assuming you can stand the awful smell.
Harpic power plus watered down and chucked in a spray bottle is perfect for regular use...it's also mega cheap.
I use it regularly (once a month) and the results are very good for a PH neutral water based product. I guarantee that you can clean all you like with Harpic or whatever nasty bleach you want to throw on the lacquer on your wheels that if you spray Auto Wheel on it after you will see red, its because its not a wheel cleaner as such, its like IronX it removes all the fallout your bleach wont touch that will ultimately end the life of your wheels earlier than without the fallout being removed. Harpic power plus watered down and chucked in a spray bottle is perfect for regular use...it's also mega cheap.
Edited by Wait Here Until Green Light Shows on Wednesday 6th September 23:17
Fallout is a general terms for tiny iron particles that make their way off the road surface, off your brakes, etc. which as they are red hot stick to the wheels then cool down and cannot be removed by normal cleaning methods. Something like Auto Wheel or IronX when applied causes a reaction which effectively melts (for a better word!) these contaminants from the wheels without damaging the wheel (I like Auto Wheel as its water based, some cheaper fallout removers are loaded with chemicals). If left on fallout will end up effectively eating through the lacquer and ultimately cause rust and other degradation issues.
Its worth noting that this product is not a wheel cleaner. The routine I have is that I seal clean wheels with a decent wax, I clean my wheels with good old fashioned car shampoo regularly (use a different mitt to the bodywork as the stuff coming off wheels is generally more nasty that off the bodywork) and all the brake dust etc just comes away no problem (and no chemical in sight), then once a month use some fallout remover to ensure there is no contamination.
Hope that helps? Appreciate people have different views on what they feel is good value etc.
Its worth noting that this product is not a wheel cleaner. The routine I have is that I seal clean wheels with a decent wax, I clean my wheels with good old fashioned car shampoo regularly (use a different mitt to the bodywork as the stuff coming off wheels is generally more nasty that off the bodywork) and all the brake dust etc just comes away no problem (and no chemical in sight), then once a month use some fallout remover to ensure there is no contamination.
Hope that helps? Appreciate people have different views on what they feel is good value etc.
I appreciate the reply and I'm not trying to be rude...but I don't believe one word of it...it sounds like cleaver marketing blurb to me.
Think about it - surely a chemical which turns iron particles red as they dissolve will have disastrous consequences when applied to cast iron brake callipers and disks?
You know what - I've got an old alloy wheel at home. Tonight to satisfy my curiosity I'm going to apply Harpic to a section, and another section I'll apply Wonder Wheels, and another section I'll apply Bilt. I'll try and make a cup type arrangement so the chemicals pool. I'll leave it for a few days and clean it off to see the results. I'll post the results in due course.
Think about it - surely a chemical which turns iron particles red as they dissolve will have disastrous consequences when applied to cast iron brake callipers and disks?
You know what - I've got an old alloy wheel at home. Tonight to satisfy my curiosity I'm going to apply Harpic to a section, and another section I'll apply Wonder Wheels, and another section I'll apply Bilt. I'll try and make a cup type arrangement so the chemicals pool. I'll leave it for a few days and clean it off to see the results. I'll post the results in due course.
Wait Here Until Green Light Shows said:
I appreciate the reply and I'm not trying to be rude...but I don't believe one word of it...it sounds like cleaver marketing blurb to me.
Think about it - surely a chemical which turns iron particles red as they dissolve will have disastrous consequences when applied to cast iron brake callipers and disks?
You know what - I've got an old alloy wheel at home. Tonight to satisfy my curiosity I'm going to apply Harpic to a section, and another section I'll apply Wonder Wheels, and another section I'll apply Bilt. I'll try and make a cup type arrangement so the chemicals pool. I'll leave it for a few days and clean it off to see the results. I'll post the results in due course.
Its a fair shout to challenge things like this where the process isn't obvious or clear to the naked eye. As it happens as I never tested it sequentially in any way (only applied it and 'felt' the difference to touch) decided to test the challenge around colour change. Think about it - surely a chemical which turns iron particles red as they dissolve will have disastrous consequences when applied to cast iron brake callipers and disks?
You know what - I've got an old alloy wheel at home. Tonight to satisfy my curiosity I'm going to apply Harpic to a section, and another section I'll apply Wonder Wheels, and another section I'll apply Bilt. I'll try and make a cup type arrangement so the chemicals pool. I'll leave it for a few days and clean it off to see the results. I'll post the results in due course.
So I took a single spoke on my alloy, wiped it down then sprayed a single shot of Bilt onto it and got the following result 2 mins after application:
So differing levels of red depending on location, more in the middle (where I admit I am more lazy at trying to clean as the nuts get in the way) vs on the spoke. Certainly not a uniform as you might expect if there was a generic colour change agent in there.
Watered down, dried and another equal application to the same spot:
Much less red this time, none on the spoke but still a little in the hub and on the rim edge.
So another water down and another application of Bilt got this:
Its now pretty much clear with no colour change at all.
Additionally, I did a rather subjective test (which you will have to take my word for) of lightly dragging the back of my finger nails over the surface of the treated spoke vs an untreated but wiped down spoke and it was much smoother on the treated spoke with the other one clearly having contaminants on it so tiny bumps that are noticeable to touch.
Its a tough one as I say its pretty much an invisible process, we all pretty much agree that claying works as when you use a clay bar you can see the crap coming off what looks like a sparkling clean surface onto the clay. The same is happening here but in reaction form rather than a clay/adhesive form.
coldel said:
Wait Here Until Green Light Shows said:
I appreciate the reply and I'm not trying to be rude...but I don't believe one word of it...it sounds like cleaver marketing blurb to me.
Think about it - surely a chemical which turns iron particles red as they dissolve will have disastrous consequences when applied to cast iron brake callipers and disks?
You know what - I've got an old alloy wheel at home. Tonight to satisfy my curiosity I'm going to apply Harpic to a section, and another section I'll apply Wonder Wheels, and another section I'll apply Bilt. I'll try and make a cup type arrangement so the chemicals pool. I'll leave it for a few days and clean it off to see the results. I'll post the results in due course.
Its a fair shout to challenge things like this where the process isn't obvious or clear to the naked eye. As it happens as I never tested it sequentially in any way (only applied it and 'felt' the difference to touch) decided to test the challenge around colour change. Think about it - surely a chemical which turns iron particles red as they dissolve will have disastrous consequences when applied to cast iron brake callipers and disks?
You know what - I've got an old alloy wheel at home. Tonight to satisfy my curiosity I'm going to apply Harpic to a section, and another section I'll apply Wonder Wheels, and another section I'll apply Bilt. I'll try and make a cup type arrangement so the chemicals pool. I'll leave it for a few days and clean it off to see the results. I'll post the results in due course.
So I took a single spoke on my alloy, wiped it down then sprayed a single shot of Bilt onto it and got the following result 2 mins after application:
So differing levels of red depending on location, more in the middle (where I admit I am more lazy at trying to clean as the nuts get in the way) vs on the spoke. Certainly not a uniform as you might expect if there was a generic colour change agent in there.
Watered down, dried and another equal application to the same spot:
Much less red this time, none on the spoke but still a little in the hub and on the rim edge.
So another water down and another application of Bilt got this:
Its now pretty much clear with no colour change at all.
Additionally, I did a rather subjective test (which you will have to take my word for) of lightly dragging the back of my finger nails over the surface of the treated spoke vs an untreated but wiped down spoke and it was much smoother on the treated spoke with the other one clearly having contaminants on it so tiny bumps that are noticeable to touch.
Its a tough one as I say its pretty much an invisible process, we all pretty much agree that claying works as when you use a clay bar you can see the crap coming off what looks like a sparkling clean surface onto the clay. The same is happening here but in reaction form rather than a clay/adhesive form.
coldel said:
Wait Here Until Green Light Shows said:
I appreciate the reply and I'm not trying to be rude...but I don't believe one word of it...it sounds like cleaver marketing blurb to me.
Think about it - surely a chemical which turns iron particles red as they dissolve will have disastrous consequences when applied to cast iron brake callipers and disks?
You know what - I've got an old alloy wheel at home. Tonight to satisfy my curiosity I'm going to apply Harpic to a section, and another section I'll apply Wonder Wheels, and another section I'll apply Bilt. I'll try and make a cup type arrangement so the chemicals pool. I'll leave it for a few days and clean it off to see the results. I'll post the results in due course.
Its a fair shout to challenge things like this where the process isn't obvious or clear to the naked eye. As it happens as I never tested it sequentially in any way (only applied it and 'felt' the difference to touch) decided to test the challenge around colour change. Think about it - surely a chemical which turns iron particles red as they dissolve will have disastrous consequences when applied to cast iron brake callipers and disks?
You know what - I've got an old alloy wheel at home. Tonight to satisfy my curiosity I'm going to apply Harpic to a section, and another section I'll apply Wonder Wheels, and another section I'll apply Bilt. I'll try and make a cup type arrangement so the chemicals pool. I'll leave it for a few days and clean it off to see the results. I'll post the results in due course.
>>>>pics removed to save space<<<<
Its now pretty much clear with no colour change at all.
Additionally, I did a rather subjective test (which you will have to take my word for) of lightly dragging the back of my finger nails over the surface of the treated spoke vs an untreated but wiped down spoke and it was much smoother on the treated spoke with the other one clearly having contaminants on it so tiny bumps that are noticeable to touch.
Its a tough one as I say its pretty much an invisible process, we all pretty much agree that claying works as when you use a clay bar you can see the crap coming off what looks like a sparkling clean surface onto the clay. The same is happening here but in reaction form rather than a clay/adhesive form.
(still not got round to doing my test - but haven't forgotten)
cib24 said:
I'm looking for something pretty strong. From a few track days brake dust has baked itself on my wheels and each time I go to clean it after the track days I really struggle to get it off. In fact, I can't get all of it off no matter which product I try and if I scrub too aggressively I micro mar the surface and end up with a bunch of fine scratches.
I have tried multiple bottles of Auto Finesse Iron Out, Bilt Hamber Auto Wheel, foam cleaner, etc. I can see them working and getting the big stuff out but there are little specs that just won't come out and when you rub a towel across the wheel it will snag as a result. So polishing the wheels or adding a sealant is not that easy.
Is there a gel or something that I can spray on or apply and let it sit for a while to attack the brake dust? Something that is really aggressive but won't damage the paint?
You need to seal the wheels once you've managed cleaned them up, Swisswax do a fantastic product but it ain't cheap. I would avoid acidic products like wonder wheels, despite what others say, the best process is to clean with a product that is non acidic and then seal.I have tried multiple bottles of Auto Finesse Iron Out, Bilt Hamber Auto Wheel, foam cleaner, etc. I can see them working and getting the big stuff out but there are little specs that just won't come out and when you rub a towel across the wheel it will snag as a result. So polishing the wheels or adding a sealant is not that easy.
Is there a gel or something that I can spray on or apply and let it sit for a while to attack the brake dust? Something that is really aggressive but won't damage the paint?
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