Will Lotus cars make it to 2015?

[RYH64E]

The Pits said:

You can still buy a no-frills Elise for £28k.

What do you propose they make instead that would be more popular and more profitable?

Something like this http://www.arielmotor.co.uk/ at 600kg, or better still this http://www.lccrocket.com/ at 350kg, with factory support for race series for the cars, not F1.

[Tuna]

RYH64E said:

Something like this http://www.arielmotor.co.uk/ at 600kg, or better still this http://www.lccrocket.com/ at 350kg, with factory support for race series for the cars, not F1.

You mean, a bit like the Lotus 2-11?

[John145]

RYH64E said:

A completely bespoke K series and gearbox? I never knew that.

I know that design and development costs are a significant part of the overall cost, but if you sell a decent quantity then you can at least amortise those costs in a sensible way. How many S1 Elises did they sell, 15,000ish?

Oh yeah you can just lift an engine out of a rover and put it into a rear drive car and leave it at that...

[bertie]

John145 said:

Oh yeah you can just lift an engine out of a rover and put it into a rear drive car and leave it at that...

I think my sarcasm filter is bust because I can't tell if you are serious?

[bordseye]

RYH64E said:

Something like this http://www.arielmotor.co.uk/ at 600kg, or better still this http://www.lccrocket.com/ at 350kg, with factory support for race series for the cars, not F1.

You're not a businessman are you?

[arfur daley]

xavierkx250 said:

Will Lotus cars make it to 2015?


Zav

They are lucky they made it passed half past seven.

[John145]

bertie said:

I think my sarcasm filter is bust because I can't tell if you are serious?

The answer is no. You need to redesign the inlet, exhaust, engine mounts, wiring loom, controller and then go through emissions testing and the rest of various government legislations around the world. You can't SVA 15,000 cars.

[bobo]

arfur daley said:

They are lucky they made it passed half past seven.

lol !! good to see its not just the completely delusional and there's still a bit of humor on this thread...

[bertie]

John145 said:

bertie said:

I think my sarcasm filter is bust because I can't tell if you are serious?

The answer is no. You need to redesign the inlet, exhaust, engine mounts, wiring loom, controller and then go through emissions testing and the rest of various government legislations around the world. You can't SVA 15,000 cars.

I'm with you on the exhaust, not sure about much else.

I've just done the self same operation on a mates Caterham with him and it wasn't exactly chalenging!

[The Pits]

RYH64E said:

Something like this http://www.arielmotor.co.uk/ at 600kg, or better still this http://www.lccrocket.com/ at 350kg, with factory support for race series for the cars, not F1.

the LCC rocket was over £40k back when it was launched!

And you don't get much from Ariel for £28k either.

[John145]

bertie said:

I'm with you on the exhaust, not sure about much else.

I've just done the self same operation on a mates Caterham with him and it wasn't exactly chalenging!

Because you aren't mass producing a car.

[bertie]

John145 said:

bertie said:

I'm with you on the exhaust, not sure about much else.

I've just done the self same operation on a mates Caterham with him and it wasn't exactly chalenging!

Because you aren't mass producing a car.

I appreciate that and I know they would have to do the approvals be they WVTA or LVTA, but in terms of actual re-engineering it was basicly a drop in originaly I am pretty sure.

I know it moved away and they ised EFI Technology management on some later cars like Sport 160s.

[RYH64E]

The Pits said:

the LCC rocket was over £40k back when it was launched!

And you don't get much from Ariel for £28k either.

If you don't think that they can compete at the lightweight, basic sports car, enthusiast end of the market then god help them, 'cos they've got no chance of competing with Porsche/Ferrari/Lamborghini in the luxury sports car sector.

[John145]

RYH64E said:

If you don't think that they can compete at the lightweight, basic sports car, enthusiast end of the market then god help them, 'cos they've got no chance of competing with Porsche/Ferrari/Lamborghini in the luxury sports car sector.

Because you say so?

[The Pits]

Pagani managed to do it from scratch. Ford managed it with the GT, McLaren, Audi too with the R8 at the first attempt.

If the car's good enough, desirable enough and different enough to what's out there people will buy it. Trouble is the new esprit has already failed on 2 counts on my scoresheet. It should turn out to be 'good enough' but it needs to look more distinctive and more desirable.

[Oilchange]

Funny you should say these things even though the car hasn't even been launched yet??????

People are delusional if they think Ferr/Lambo/Prsh/Aston are the be all and end all.
The Chinese market is potentially HUGE and Lotus have done rather well there with the Evora GTE, also they have 350 odd orders for the V6 Exige so are not doing too badly, just need the cash flow while they are in ownership limbo...

[bobo]

RYH64E said:

If you don't think that they can compete at the lightweight, basic sports car, enthusiast end of the market then god help them, 'cos they've got no chance of competing with Porsche/Ferrari/Lamborghini in the luxury sports car sector.

absolute rubbish ... money and time (and a bit more vision than you!). the management is already in place.

[RYH64E]

bobo said:

absolute rubbish ... money and time (and a bit more vision than you!). the management is already in place.

I hope you're right, but think you're wrong. I remember following the TVR saga to the inevitable conclusion, despite all the optimism about new models, new management, and new markets that was only ever going to end one way, IMO.

Lotus don't have the market sector experience of Porsche/Ferrari, they don't have the resources of Ford or Audi (with Lamborghini in the group for the R8 don't forget), they don't have the aspirational brand status of the prestige makes, and they don't have the worldwide dealer network needed. The new Mclaren hasn't had the 100% positive reception some might have expected, and they have had their fair share of glitches in the new cars http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a... , what chance lotus getting it right first time?

I just can't see Lotus making it work, at least not in a realistic time frame.

[bobo]

tvr? sorry, never heard of them ...

just for starters tvr have no heritage whats so ever, lotus do and that's eminently marketable at a big premium to the chinese etc. just needs a bona fide product. the list goes on.

simply incomparable, just like morgan or caterham (whoever brought those up!) ... but dont let me spoil the party ...

RYH64E said:

I hope you're right, but think you're wrong. I remember following the TVR saga to the inevitable conclusion, despite all the optimism about new models, new management, and new markets that was only ever going to end one way, IMO.

Lotus don't have the market sector experience of Porsche/Ferrari, they don't have the resources of Ford or Audi (with Lamborghini in the group for the R8 don't forget), they don't have the aspirational brand status of the prestige makes, and they don't have the worldwide dealer network needed. The new Mclaren hasn't had the 100% positive reception some might have expected, and they have had their fair share of glitches in the new cars http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a... , what chance lotus getting it right first time?

I just can't see Lotus making it work, at least not in a realistic time frame.

[bertie]

bobo said:

tvr? sorry, never heard of them ...

just for starters tvr have no heritage whats so ever, lotus do and that's eminently marketable at a big premium to the chinese etc. just needs a bona fide product. the list goes on.

simply incomparable, just like morgan or caterham (whoever brought those up!) ... but dont let me spoil the party ...

Hang on...heritage??

TVR - Founded 1946
Lotus - Founded 1952