1980 Lotus Elite 504
Discussion
Mistron said:
I couldn't believe how many condensors I got through with my mini. It ended up being the first thing I'd check when anything went wrong, and 9/10 times it was another duff one.
Al
Condenser is easy in the Mini though, just whip the grill off, dizzy in this thing is burried under the carbs Al
Thinking about it i changed the points and condenser before i sorted the coil/ballast problem so the new condenser probably got fried if it wasn't dodgy to begin with.
May bite the bullet and go for an Aldon Ignitor kit.
The best thing I ever did for mine was to fit electronic ignition, after that it was just a once a year job to check the cap and lube the felt, no more guessing if a condenser was bad.
The original fuel pump was an SU as used on Morris Minors and MGs, I should think your Facet pump will outflow the original. BTW do you still have the electric cut off valve in the delivery pipe, I had some grief with that at first.
The original fuel pump was an SU as used on Morris Minors and MGs, I should think your Facet pump will outflow the original. BTW do you still have the electric cut off valve in the delivery pipe, I had some grief with that at first.
kev b said:
The best thing I ever did for mine was to fit electronic ignition, after that it was just a once a year job to check the cap and lube the felt, no more guessing if a condenser was bad.
The original fuel pump was an SU as used on Morris Minors and MGs, I should think your Facet pump will outflow the original. BTW do you still have the electric cut off valve in the delivery pipe, I had some grief with that at first.
Electric cut off valve is gone, must have been taken off when the engine and box was changed.The original fuel pump was an SU as used on Morris Minors and MGs, I should think your Facet pump will outflow the original. BTW do you still have the electric cut off valve in the delivery pipe, I had some grief with that at first.
Funny, i did question the quality of points and condensers with the motor factors when i bought them, with such low demand these days the quality may be iffy, he recons most sets are not actually new but NOS, but i read somewhere most of these parts have a shelf life of 10 years.
Going to order an electronic kit during the week.
I'll second the electronic ignition move and while you're at it I think I'd also change the coil because it sounds like it's not been running correctly in the past. It probably sounds very luddite-ish but I changed the ballast coil on mine to a plain 12v version with no resistor on the logic of just one thing less to go wrong.....
Brian
Brian
A Facet red top could overwhelm the carbs unless you fit a pressure regulator as well.
Best bet for a new pump is to get an SU with the electronic setup instead of points. AZX1308EN is the part number you need.
If your car had a flowlock and it's been removed, it's worth fitting another one as it stops the tank draining through the carbs when it's parked nose down.
Best bet for a new pump is to get an SU with the electronic setup instead of points. AZX1308EN is the part number you need.
If your car had a flowlock and it's been removed, it's worth fitting another one as it stops the tank draining through the carbs when it's parked nose down.
b2hbm said:
I'll second the electronic ignition move and while you're at it I think I'd also change the coil because it sounds like it's not been running correctly in the past. It probably sounds very luddite-ish but I changed the ballast coil on mine to a plain 12v version with no resistor on the logic of just one thing less to go wrong.....
Brian
Most electronic ignition setups run without ballast resistors because the electronics control the voltage to the coil.Brian
On a points system, the ballast is there to reduce voltage in normal running so the coil doesn't overheat and start to break down. This is done because the voltage to the coil usually drops during starting because of the high load from the starter. As a result, coils on points systems are designed to work at around 9V rather than 12. During starting, the ballast resistor is bypassed and only switched in once the starter circuit is disengaged.
At this point, I'd suggest that all Elite/Eclat/Excel owners should head across to a particular online forum where there's a lot of knowledge about these cars - but I daren't because it would probably constitute advertising.
I'd also probably invite all Elite/Eclat owners to contact me if they'd like to show their car at the NEC Classic Motor Show in November as there are plans for a 40th anniversary celebration.
I'd also probably invite all Elite/Eclat owners to contact me if they'd like to show their car at the NEC Classic Motor Show in November as there are plans for a 40th anniversary celebration.
marshalla said:
Most electronic ignition setups run without ballast resistors because the electronics control the voltage to the coil.
On a points system, the ballast is there to reduce voltage in normal running so the coil doesn't overheat and start to break down. This is done because the voltage to the coil usually drops during starting because of the high load from the starter. As a result, coils on points systems are designed to work at around 9V rather than 12. During starting, the ballast resistor is bypassed and only switched in once the starter circuit is disengaged.
That's what i thought my problem initially was, had the car running until motor was running rough and ready to die, the coil was very hot, it had been hot wired to the ignition switch, fitted a new coil and Ballast resistor, measured the voltage at the coil and it was 10.2 volts, so fitted a second Ballast and it's now 8.6 volts and running cool.On a points system, the ballast is there to reduce voltage in normal running so the coil doesn't overheat and start to break down. This is done because the voltage to the coil usually drops during starting because of the high load from the starter. As a result, coils on points systems are designed to work at around 9V rather than 12. During starting, the ballast resistor is bypassed and only switched in once the starter circuit is disengaged.
Didn't help though as there is still a problem
Got an Accuspark kit ordered but thinking about it today starting to loose faith in it being the Condenser at all.
Ran out of all other avenues though.
Regarding the fuel pressure i have a regulator already as the Silvertop runs at 4-5 psi, have the regulator set at 3psi (recommended for the Dellorto's) .
marshalla said:
At this point, I'd suggest that all Elite/Eclat/Excel owners should head across to a particular online forum where there's a lot of knowledge about these cars - but I daren't because it would probably constitute advertising.
I'd also probably invite all Elite/Eclat owners to contact me if they'd like to show their car at the NEC Classic Motor Show in November as there are plans for a 40th anniversary celebration.
Hope you get a better spot then last time!! Lovely carsI'd also probably invite all Elite/Eclat owners to contact me if they'd like to show their car at the NEC Classic Motor Show in November as there are plans for a 40th anniversary celebration.
Right, got the Accuspark kit during the week, dead easy to fit, built it all back up, started, ran fine, set the timing and left it at that to test it properly today.
Got it out into the drive, ran it up to temperature, then ......................... it started running rough and died
At least i can get it to break down in the drive now and not stranded at the side of the road.
So, whipped the tops off the carbs and the float chambers were dry (when i tested for fuel at the carbs before i whipped off the plastic jet cover, there seemed to be fuel there, also fuel when i undid the 16mm banjo bolt so have just been assuming the fuel side was fine).
Pulled the outlet hose off the pump in the boot and turned the ignition on, just a trickle came out, initially thought a tank blockage so pulled off the tank to pump hose, blew through it seems to be fine, checked the tank breathers those are fine, ran a feed to the pump from a petrol can at it seems no better, pump is getting 13.5V with the engine running and is earthed straight to the battery so it's all pointing to a dodgy new fuel pump.
Got it out into the drive, ran it up to temperature, then ......................... it started running rough and died
At least i can get it to break down in the drive now and not stranded at the side of the road.
So, whipped the tops off the carbs and the float chambers were dry (when i tested for fuel at the carbs before i whipped off the plastic jet cover, there seemed to be fuel there, also fuel when i undid the 16mm banjo bolt so have just been assuming the fuel side was fine).
Pulled the outlet hose off the pump in the boot and turned the ignition on, just a trickle came out, initially thought a tank blockage so pulled off the tank to pump hose, blew through it seems to be fine, checked the tank breathers those are fine, ran a feed to the pump from a petrol can at it seems no better, pump is getting 13.5V with the engine running and is earthed straight to the battery so it's all pointing to a dodgy new fuel pump.
Just pulled the pump out and bench tested it, ran a feed to it from a can with a line from the outlet back into the can, would run ok for about ten minutes then start to splutter, unscrewed the base and found some crud in and around the filter, stripped it down, cleaned it out, tested it again and it's still the same.
Apparently Facet pumps have developed a poor reputation lately so looks like i'll be shopping for a new pump.
Apparently Facet pumps have developed a poor reputation lately so looks like i'll be shopping for a new pump.
Keep smiling, you'll get there eventually (unless your money or patience run out first) the Lotus experience seems not to have changed since I owned one.
The last straw for me was having to re-do jobs I had already done properly, rear wheel bearings and drive-shafts being the prime example.
I sold mine, almost had to give it away with the cherished number plate the buyer really wanted, intending to buy the much improved Excel. The stop gap car I bought was a MK1 Fiesta XR2, compared with the Elite it was just as fast point to point, more economical, orders of magnitude more reliable, easier to park and way better to drive on our narrow local roads, easier to work on too.
So good in fact that I kept it and have never been seriously tempted by a Lotus since. The Elite cost me a fair bit at the time but saved me tens of thousands in the long run by stopping me buying any more exotic cars.
I still work on other peoples specialist cars occasionally but rather like grandchildren I am always glad I can give them back at the end of the day.
I watched Wheeler Dealers with the Esprit recently which brought it all back, the awkward access, the expense, tackling one job and finding three more...........
The last straw for me was having to re-do jobs I had already done properly, rear wheel bearings and drive-shafts being the prime example.
I sold mine, almost had to give it away with the cherished number plate the buyer really wanted, intending to buy the much improved Excel. The stop gap car I bought was a MK1 Fiesta XR2, compared with the Elite it was just as fast point to point, more economical, orders of magnitude more reliable, easier to park and way better to drive on our narrow local roads, easier to work on too.
So good in fact that I kept it and have never been seriously tempted by a Lotus since. The Elite cost me a fair bit at the time but saved me tens of thousands in the long run by stopping me buying any more exotic cars.
I still work on other peoples specialist cars occasionally but rather like grandchildren I am always glad I can give them back at the end of the day.
I watched Wheeler Dealers with the Esprit recently which brought it all back, the awkward access, the expense, tackling one job and finding three more...........
kev b said:
Keep smiling, you'll get there eventually (unless your money or patience run out first) the Lotus experience seems not to have changed since I owned one.
The last straw for me was having to re-do jobs I had already done properly, rear wheel bearings and drive-shafts being the prime example.
I sold mine, almost had to give it away with the cherished number plate the buyer really wanted, intending to buy the much improved Excel. The stop gap car I bought was a MK1 Fiesta XR2, compared with the Elite it was just as fast point to point, more economical, orders of magnitude more reliable, easier to park and way better to drive on our narrow local roads, easier to work on too.
So good in fact that I kept it and have never been seriously tempted by a Lotus since. The Elite cost me a fair bit at the time but saved me tens of thousands in the long run by stopping me buying any more exotic cars.
I still work on other peoples specialist cars occasionally but rather like grandchildren I am always glad I can give them back at the end of the day.
I watched Wheeler Dealers with the Esprit recently which brought it all back, the awkward access, the expense, tackling one job and finding three more...........
Cheers Kev, i didn't expect an easy time with the Lotus anyway, will be better once i get the running issue sorted start using it regular and will carry some tools and spares just in case (hate having to call the big yellow Taxi) The last straw for me was having to re-do jobs I had already done properly, rear wheel bearings and drive-shafts being the prime example.
I sold mine, almost had to give it away with the cherished number plate the buyer really wanted, intending to buy the much improved Excel. The stop gap car I bought was a MK1 Fiesta XR2, compared with the Elite it was just as fast point to point, more economical, orders of magnitude more reliable, easier to park and way better to drive on our narrow local roads, easier to work on too.
So good in fact that I kept it and have never been seriously tempted by a Lotus since. The Elite cost me a fair bit at the time but saved me tens of thousands in the long run by stopping me buying any more exotic cars.
I still work on other peoples specialist cars occasionally but rather like grandchildren I am always glad I can give them back at the end of the day.
I watched Wheeler Dealers with the Esprit recently which brought it all back, the awkward access, the expense, tackling one job and finding three more...........
I know the Excel is better (a lot of it is Toyota) but they still have problems, besides i much prefer the shape of the Elite to the Excel/Eclat.
Had an XR2 spec MK1 Fiesta years ago, was a green/silver Bravo, cracking little car, also loved the 3.0S Capri's i had, one of those feels bombproof compared to the Elite, but the Elite is a superb driver.
Funny you mention rear wheel bearings, i've still to do mine, there is play in them but were just an advise at the MOT, still to do the timing belt too and fix the oil leak at the top end of the engine, changed the cam cover gaskets but either the lower one is still leaking or i fear it may be the cam carrier gasket.
Just ordered one of these cheap fuel pumps (they have sold tons and the feedback is good so they must be decent ?) so will see how that goes, will also fit a filter between the tank and pump as some crap from the tank may have knackered the Facet pump.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/12v-ELECTRIC-FUEL-PUMP-D...
From previous experience I'd suggest fit a dry-break fuel filter, something like these
http://www.demon-tweeks.co.uk/motorsport/dry-break...
Saves having to drain down a tankful of fuel to clear it in a dark, rainy, lay-by.
http://www.demon-tweeks.co.uk/motorsport/dry-break...
Saves having to drain down a tankful of fuel to clear it in a dark, rainy, lay-by.
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