New forum, club for pre war owners - thoughts please.
Discussion
Riley Blue said:
Pub based 'noggin & natters' make me shudder - sorry...
No need to apologise. I quite like them of a summer's evening, park up, get a pint, chat a bit of nonsense and go home when I'm ready. I usually do them alone.p.s The Lagonda Club is pretty well essential for an owner because they really do have one of the best spares sections I have known for any club. They reproduce new parts with the club funds and curate second hand parts. It really is excellent.
dhutch said:
Oh yeah, I'm mean please don't get me wrong, I don't think we need separate ph sub-forum, nor do I really think an age related owners club is helpful, unless it's an affiliated program within a large club like the NTET 'steam apprentice club'.
A lot is moving to facebook groups, which a great for sharing events and photos, and quick advice, but too transient for complex discussion or building up a portfolio of infomation. That said, and recommendations grateful received.
I've tried to join www.oldclassiccar.co.uk as it looked reasonable however it appears you have to be manually added, so I guess it's down to as and when the email gets processed.
Much of the advice is to 'join the owners club first' but is that the VSCC which appears to mainly be about racing, they all appear to be manufacture or even model special, which when you are still trying to decide if you want a Austin 16/6 , a Bullnose Morris or a Humber.
Daniel
First port of call is decide your budget, that will determine where you are in the pre war market regards marque. If you feel it’s Austin or Morris, and I would recommend either as relatively easy running costs and good spares /club assistance. A lot is moving to facebook groups, which a great for sharing events and photos, and quick advice, but too transient for complex discussion or building up a portfolio of infomation. That said, and recommendations grateful received.
I've tried to join www.oldclassiccar.co.uk as it looked reasonable however it appears you have to be manually added, so I guess it's down to as and when the email gets processed.
Much of the advice is to 'join the owners club first' but is that the VSCC which appears to mainly be about racing, they all appear to be manufacture or even model special, which when you are still trying to decide if you want a Austin 16/6 , a Bullnose Morris or a Humber.
Daniel
Second, I would definitely recommend you attend several shows and chat with the owners of said cars. You will certainly get a ‘handle’ on the likelihood of your own ownership of given marque.
I would steer well clear of cars that have been laid up for a number of years owing to likelyhood they will need recommissioning.
Go for a car that has been in regular use and has been loved.
LotusOmega375D said:
You can't be alone. The owners die out, but the cars keep on going. I'm not in your lucky position yet, but I've always had a hankering for an Alvis Speed 20 Vanden Plas tourer, if anyone's got one they no longer want.
I too am thinking of moving to the dark side. The E-type and I are joined at the hip, but soon the XKSS must go. Your mention of Alvis is what prompted me to reply really. this is one I would really like to own - except those seat belt stalks would have to go!https://www.prewarcar.com/310723-original-1939-alv...
lowdrag said:
I too am thinking of moving to the dark side. The E-type and I are joined at the hip, but soon the XKSS must go. Your mention of Alvis is what prompted me to reply really. this is one I would really like to own - except those seat belt stalks would have to go!
https://www.prewarcar.com/310723-original-1939-alv...
The seat belts are an easy fix: https://www.quickfitsbs.com/classic_cars_seatbelts...https://www.prewarcar.com/310723-original-1939-alv...
So get it bought!
dhutch said:
the VSCC which appears to mainly be about racing
Enjoy your search.Although racing, and speed events, are a large and public part of the VSCC, there are also non-speed, competitive and social events for members. There's also the LC&E Section. They do however have some arcane eligibility rules, so check them if that is important to you, although some of their events are now open to all Pre War Cars. The VSCC is often an invited club at many MSA events, which can be handy. Try to go to an event, or show when we're allowed, but owners can be biased by their own choice of cars. I know the VSCC were planning (before the virus) all sort of events at Oulton, we used to stay in Heswell with a cousin when we went up north.
As Crankedup says, decide your budget - how fast can you afford to go? Also how do you want to arrive at your destination, a early 20s Cowley two seater and dixie will be different, to your passengers, to a mid 30s 16/6 Saloon. What events do you want to do, or just a run down to the local? Humbers come in all shapes and sizes, pre Roots and after the Hillman merger and can even be hot rodded - check out the Diffey Humbug on You-Tube. I've navigated in a 8/18 Humber on one LCES rally, the owner has few other interesting cars, including the ex Footitt Cognac special at one point.
Couple of years ago we did a Inter-Register Scatter Rally, near Newbury, we entered the A7 in the VSCC invitation class, as did Allen L in his LeaF, After the event, and a meal at the pub, we called in on the Bullnose lot on the way home, a friend from the VSCC had just obtained a Oxford Tourer to go with his Cowley. A good day out.
davepen said:
Enjoy your search.
Although racing, and speed events, are a large and public part of the VSCC, there are also non-speed, competitive and social events for members. There's also the LC&E Section. They do however have some arcane eligibility rules, so check them if that is important to you, although some of their events are now open to all Pre War Cars. The VSCC is often an invited club at many MSA events, which can be handy. Try to go to an event, or show when we're allowed, but owners can be biased by their own choice of cars. I know the VSCC were planning (before the virus) all sort of events at Oulton, we used to stay in Heswell with a cousin when we went up north.
As Crankedup says, decide your budget - how fast can you afford to go? Also how do you want to arrive at your destination, a early 20s Cowley two seater and dixie will be different, to your passengers, to a mid 30s 16/6 Saloon. What events do you want to do, or just a run down to the local? Humbers come in all shapes and sizes, pre Roots and after the Hillman merger and can even be hot rodded - check out the Diffey Humbug on You-Tube. I've navigated in a 8/18 Humber on one LCES rally, the owner has few other interesting cars, including the ex Footitt Cognac special at one point.
Couple of years ago we did a Inter-Register Scatter Rally, near Newbury, we entered the A7 in the VSCC invitation class, as did Allen L in his LeaF, After the event, and a meal at the pub, we called in on the Bullnose lot on the way home, a friend from the VSCC had just obtained a Oxford Tourer to go with his Cowley. A good day out.
Indeed, good information. You have lost me on most of the acronyms, but otherwise I get the gist.Although racing, and speed events, are a large and public part of the VSCC, there are also non-speed, competitive and social events for members. There's also the LC&E Section. They do however have some arcane eligibility rules, so check them if that is important to you, although some of their events are now open to all Pre War Cars. The VSCC is often an invited club at many MSA events, which can be handy. Try to go to an event, or show when we're allowed, but owners can be biased by their own choice of cars. I know the VSCC were planning (before the virus) all sort of events at Oulton, we used to stay in Heswell with a cousin when we went up north.
As Crankedup says, decide your budget - how fast can you afford to go? Also how do you want to arrive at your destination, a early 20s Cowley two seater and dixie will be different, to your passengers, to a mid 30s 16/6 Saloon. What events do you want to do, or just a run down to the local? Humbers come in all shapes and sizes, pre Roots and after the Hillman merger and can even be hot rodded - check out the Diffey Humbug on You-Tube. I've navigated in a 8/18 Humber on one LCES rally, the owner has few other interesting cars, including the ex Footitt Cognac special at one point.
Couple of years ago we did a Inter-Register Scatter Rally, near Newbury, we entered the A7 in the VSCC invitation class, as did Allen L in his LeaF, After the event, and a meal at the pub, we called in on the Bullnose lot on the way home, a friend from the VSCC had just obtained a Oxford Tourer to go with his Cowley. A good day out.
Budget is something like £8-15k and I think the main objective is to enjoy driving around in it, including with friends, however I find it always helps to have an excuse to go somewhere.
So four/five seats, likely something larger than a Austin 7 or Morris 8 we're think, the fun of a tourer appears but I'm unsure how good they are with the roof up and a fixed head salon probably makes more sense.
Able to a sort of drive locally for a day trip, but maybe 50miles somewhere and back in the day, be that the main days activity. Perhaps make the occasion 100 mile trip if stopping the night. Attend a local vintage and steam rally.
On Sunday we saw a very nice 1928 Austin Heavy 12 with Windsor saloon body in restored condition which was very nice indeed and I think fairly close to the objective. The owner was very helpful also had a Landaulette bodied Heavy 12, although I find the style rather odd, and a 1913 Austin. He said the heavy 12 can do around 50mph but cruises comfortably in the low 40s.
We also have family friends who have recently bought a Morris Isis.
There is a Austin 20 tourer for sale nearby, which I believe is going to be considerably longer? I've also found a few 16/4 and 16/6s which are presumed to be a bit larger than a 12 but also quicker?
Having something a bit left field appeals, but I also worry I might regret it when a spare part is needed.
I don't feel overly concerned as to off it's late 20s and hence 'vintage' or early 30s and therefore 'post vintage' as that appears mainly to only be an issue if competing with it which j don't think is the plan. I've done a 12car driving my E36, and it was ok, but we both get horribly car sick if not looking ahead, so I don't think navigational rallies are our thing and if was we could use the kitcar.
We already have a steam narrowboat where any spare needs making first! I also have a Westfield, which is used for sunny day fast road use and national autotest and autosolo events which I enjoy.
Thoughts welcome.
Daniel
^^^^^
The Austin 12 / 4 is said to be the most robust car ever made, hundreds were put into work as taxis
and some didn’t retire until the late 1950s. They are even now a good reliable car that was certainly over engineered. Of course they are now all elderly and will require looking after, but with sensible
service work oil changes and greasing there is no reason that a good car should not continue to be enjoyed. Most of these cars will only be used for gentle ambling along 1000 - 3000 miles each year.
The Austin 16/6 is a much smoother drive with its six cylinder engine, synchro on 3rd and 4th gear its an easier car to drive.A. more ‘modern feel’ to it, but it’s all relative, they are all very involving cars to drive and both models are enthusiastically followed.
Do not expect speed, gathering pace is the order of the day, slowing down in a casual manner. You learn to read the road ahead and adjust your driving habits to suit, dashing up to a corner and hitting the brakes is not the way. I would not want to drive my previous 12/4 at 50mph, mechanical sympathy demands 40mph on the flat sections finding the sweet spot where the car is ‘happy’. There is a big difference in 10mph extra in these old cars. Once it clicks into place you then know what it is all about! Think of it as your steam narrow boat, the journey is not essential nor is the rate of knots, it’s all about enjoyment.
You will find insurance is about £100 yearly, free road tax of course and expect something in the order of 20 x25mpg. Tyres and inner tubes are easy to purchase with several suppliers with a huge variety of sizes, budget around £80 corner, but they last about ten years anyway!
Hope this is helpful and have fun searching out your car.Please let us all know about your search and what it is you find.
The Austin 12 / 4 is said to be the most robust car ever made, hundreds were put into work as taxis
and some didn’t retire until the late 1950s. They are even now a good reliable car that was certainly over engineered. Of course they are now all elderly and will require looking after, but with sensible
service work oil changes and greasing there is no reason that a good car should not continue to be enjoyed. Most of these cars will only be used for gentle ambling along 1000 - 3000 miles each year.
The Austin 16/6 is a much smoother drive with its six cylinder engine, synchro on 3rd and 4th gear its an easier car to drive.A. more ‘modern feel’ to it, but it’s all relative, they are all very involving cars to drive and both models are enthusiastically followed.
Do not expect speed, gathering pace is the order of the day, slowing down in a casual manner. You learn to read the road ahead and adjust your driving habits to suit, dashing up to a corner and hitting the brakes is not the way. I would not want to drive my previous 12/4 at 50mph, mechanical sympathy demands 40mph on the flat sections finding the sweet spot where the car is ‘happy’. There is a big difference in 10mph extra in these old cars. Once it clicks into place you then know what it is all about! Think of it as your steam narrow boat, the journey is not essential nor is the rate of knots, it’s all about enjoyment.
You will find insurance is about £100 yearly, free road tax of course and expect something in the order of 20 x25mpg. Tyres and inner tubes are easy to purchase with several suppliers with a huge variety of sizes, budget around £80 corner, but they last about ten years anyway!
Hope this is helpful and have fun searching out your car.Please let us all know about your search and what it is you find.
Edited by crankedup on Tuesday 27th October 11:09
Yes, it appears than in being a 'scaled down 20' the heavy 12 it is a larger engineered car than it deserves to be for its size almost.
Oddly also appears to be a crossflow engine, where all other engines around it have the exhaust and inlet on the same side? Often even with a 'hotspot' where the two bolt together.
The is a 1919 Austin 20 Tourer very close in Wallasey, which we plan to see at the weekend if we can.
Also a 1935 Austin 'Light' 12/4 Ascot in Cheshire somewhere, so hopefully we can see that also.
Struggling to find a 16/6 anywhere near the Northwest at the moment.
Just try and get a feel of it all. How much bigger a 16 is to 12, difference between a light and heavy 12, etc. Drophead or fixed.
Heavy 12's appear to have pressed steel 'artillery' wheels where the 16/6 has wire wheels. Presumably both are fine? The Heavy 12 also tends to have lovely chunky brass centre to the steering wheel also? I guess within a model there was also variation too?
Presumably the 16 like the 'Light' 12 has the 'ball shift' rather than the gated shift? Or does that also vary with age? Assuming people have not moved them also! The gate type appears fun, but I also appreciate some prefer the synco on 4th, and an extra 10mph on the cruising speed can be useful in modern driving.
I have tried to make a spreadsheet to somewhere wrap my head around the model names and years,and the time-line at the bottom of the wiki pages does help too.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Austin_12
The Austin range takes some following, but Morris appears to have just thrown out logic and changed the name like the wind, while also reusing but a handful again and again.
How does a 1929 Morris Isis (or 1928 Light 6, or 'Twenty Five') compare to a Auston 12 or 16 size wise? Speed? Are early hydraulic brakes good or bad?
Cheers
Oddly also appears to be a crossflow engine, where all other engines around it have the exhaust and inlet on the same side? Often even with a 'hotspot' where the two bolt together.
The is a 1919 Austin 20 Tourer very close in Wallasey, which we plan to see at the weekend if we can.
Also a 1935 Austin 'Light' 12/4 Ascot in Cheshire somewhere, so hopefully we can see that also.
Struggling to find a 16/6 anywhere near the Northwest at the moment.
Just try and get a feel of it all. How much bigger a 16 is to 12, difference between a light and heavy 12, etc. Drophead or fixed.
Heavy 12's appear to have pressed steel 'artillery' wheels where the 16/6 has wire wheels. Presumably both are fine? The Heavy 12 also tends to have lovely chunky brass centre to the steering wheel also? I guess within a model there was also variation too?
Presumably the 16 like the 'Light' 12 has the 'ball shift' rather than the gated shift? Or does that also vary with age? Assuming people have not moved them also! The gate type appears fun, but I also appreciate some prefer the synco on 4th, and an extra 10mph on the cruising speed can be useful in modern driving.
I have tried to make a spreadsheet to somewhere wrap my head around the model names and years,and the time-line at the bottom of the wiki pages does help too.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Austin_12
The Austin range takes some following, but Morris appears to have just thrown out logic and changed the name like the wind, while also reusing but a handful again and again.
How does a 1929 Morris Isis (or 1928 Light 6, or 'Twenty Five') compare to a Auston 12 or 16 size wise? Speed? Are early hydraulic brakes good or bad?
Cheers
RichB said:
Thinking, when we are allowed out next year, it would be great to have Pistonheads pre-war meet-up. Perhaps at Bicester or somewhere?
Sounds like a plan, done well car meets are one of the most covid secure things out there. We got two Westfield gatherings in between lockdowns here on the Wirral.Blackpool is nearer to me than Bister, but with luck the future car will manage a day trip to the BlackCountry. Locations not starting with B also welcome.
A jump to the vintage era is not that far for me since my current cars were designed in the 1950's anyway. I am sure that many of you will have noticed just how this forum has changed over the last few years, but in a more modern direction, not older. A quick look at the current subjects says it all; Capris, Fiestas, Rover SD1 for example; yes, the demographics are changing and people like me are falling off their perches to be sure, but discussion of fifties, sixties and even seventies cars is on the wane, let alone vintage. I've done a few projects here over the years, but the last one was seven years back and there were two eight and thirteen years ago, but we don't see much in the way of restorations well documented here any more. The number of daily posts in the forum is also well down on years gone by. More and more it seems to me that the overall interest in cars of any age seems to be waning. My grandchildren see me as a polluting dinosaur and have no interest in cars at all, and I have doubts they will even learn to drive. Going to the monthly car meet sees a line of Porsches since the words "classic cars" has been replaced with "collectors cars". The era of the car as we know it is coming to a close, and in a few years we shall be charging up, not filling up, our cars while doing the shopping. The age of the mechanic is coming to a close, and who will tune my triple Webers then? On the bright side, I am actively helping two youngsters in their 20s here who have started up a garage specializing in old British cars, and they are stacked out with work. Last week they had two TR4s, a split screen Moggie, a TF, an S2 Landie, a Singer Gazelle convertible, and an E-type in the works, and have a long waiting list. Currently I am sourcing for them parts to convert a very early TR3 (TR2 nose) from RHD to LHD for example, screen rubbers for the Gazelle, and so on. We need to see more people like them coming through. Sorry to ramble on, but I just thought I'd pen a few of my thoughts. But if I can screw myself down to let the XKSS go, I shall be moving to the dark side most surely. Forty years of Jaguar is about enough I reckon. The page needs turning.
dhutch said:
Yes, it appears than in being a 'scaled down 20' the heavy 12 it is a larger engineered car than it deserves to be for its size almost.
Oddly also appears to be a crossflow engine, where all other engines around it have the exhaust and inlet on the same side? Often even with a 'hotspot' where the two bolt together.
The is a 1919 Austin 20 Tourer very close in Wallasey, which we plan to see at the weekend if we can.
Also a 1935 Austin 'Light' 12/4 Ascot in Cheshire somewhere, so hopefully we can see that also.
Struggling to find a 16/6 anywhere near the Northwest at the moment.
Just try and get a feel of it all. How much bigger a 16 is to 12, difference between a light and heavy 12, etc. Drophead or fixed.
Heavy 12's appear to have pressed steel 'artillery' wheels where the 16/6 has wire wheels. Presumably both are fine? The Heavy 12 also tends to have lovely chunky brass centre to the steering wheel also? I guess within a model there was also variation too?
Presumably the 16 like the 'Light' 12 has the 'ball shift' rather than the gated shift? Or does that also vary with age? Assuming people have not moved them also! The gate type appears fun, but I also appreciate some prefer the synco on 4th, and an extra 10mph on the cruising speed can be useful in modern driving.
I have tried to make a spreadsheet to somewhere wrap my head around the model names and years,and the time-line at the bottom of the wiki pages does help too.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Austin_12
The Austin range takes some following, but Morris appears to have just thrown out logic and changed the name like the wind, while also reusing but a handful again and again.
How does a 1929 Morris Isis (or 1928 Light 6, or 'Twenty Five') compare to a Auston 12 or 16 size wise? Speed? Are early hydraulic brakes good or bad?
Cheers
Best to do. Google on each car and drop into wiki, I say this because he variations in each car an be wide. For example, performance is related to body style owing to weight variations, it really does make a difference in these vintage / post vintage cars.Oddly also appears to be a crossflow engine, where all other engines around it have the exhaust and inlet on the same side? Often even with a 'hotspot' where the two bolt together.
The is a 1919 Austin 20 Tourer very close in Wallasey, which we plan to see at the weekend if we can.
Also a 1935 Austin 'Light' 12/4 Ascot in Cheshire somewhere, so hopefully we can see that also.
Struggling to find a 16/6 anywhere near the Northwest at the moment.
Just try and get a feel of it all. How much bigger a 16 is to 12, difference between a light and heavy 12, etc. Drophead or fixed.
Heavy 12's appear to have pressed steel 'artillery' wheels where the 16/6 has wire wheels. Presumably both are fine? The Heavy 12 also tends to have lovely chunky brass centre to the steering wheel also? I guess within a model there was also variation too?
Presumably the 16 like the 'Light' 12 has the 'ball shift' rather than the gated shift? Or does that also vary with age? Assuming people have not moved them also! The gate type appears fun, but I also appreciate some prefer the synco on 4th, and an extra 10mph on the cruising speed can be useful in modern driving.
I have tried to make a spreadsheet to somewhere wrap my head around the model names and years,and the time-line at the bottom of the wiki pages does help too.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Austin_12
The Austin range takes some following, but Morris appears to have just thrown out logic and changed the name like the wind, while also reusing but a handful again and again.
How does a 1929 Morris Isis (or 1928 Light 6, or 'Twenty Five') compare to a Auston 12 or 16 size wise? Speed? Are early hydraulic brakes good or bad?
Cheers
The ‘artillery’ style wheels (sankey) are the most prevalent in vintage cars, the more expensive cars of the period would be wearing spoked wheel.Manufacturers did star to offer spoked wheels as an option as years rolled by. I wouldn’t even think about dismissing a possible purchase on the basis of which wheels it is shod. If you look at a sankey wheeled car as a serious proposition be aware that these wheels are 80/90 years old. One drawback of them is they can and do rust from the inside to out. This causes the welded seam, they are built as two half welded together, to come under pressure and very slowly split the join. Inspect wheels carefully to see if you can spot any spitting in the rims and spokes. This is not to put you off them, I have had cars running on repaired sankey wheels but it’s not ideal.
Wire wheels are much easier to have repaired of course as they are still in production many specialists are on hand. Not as easy to keep clean though
Yes the ignition and speed controls in the vintage 12 are handsome in brass, the move to bakelight or plastic in the post 1930 cars is one of the ‘improvements’ along with the ball change gear selector. It really is a case of finding your preferences. The post vintage period, as in my Austin, brought changes that suit my needs perfectly and it is a slightly easier car to drive than any of my previous vintage chariots.
As for brakes, well none of the cars come close to the performance of modern. Personally I am happy with what I have always thought to be reasonable brakes with the old rod and cables set up. Once they are set up correctly they are adequate. We are not travelling at a high speed, be aware of its limitations and drive accordingly, you will quickly adapt.
For all this it’s what makes vintage/post vintage motoring the fun that it is bags of character and involvement. Perhaps a little like your narrow boat, put in the effort for wonderful rewards.
If you do settle on an Austin I would urge you to join the Vintage Austin Register (VAR) and/or the Austin ten drivers club.
Good luck in your search
lowdrag said:
A jump to the vintage era is not that far for me since my current cars were designed in the 1950's anyway. I am sure that many of you will have noticed just how this forum has changed over the last few years, but in a more modern direction, not older. A quick look at the current subjects says it all; Capris, Fiestas, Rover SD1 for example; yes, the demographics are changing and people like me are falling off their perches to be sure, but discussion of fifties, sixties and even seventies cars is on the wane, let alone vintage. I've done a few projects here over the years, but the last one was seven years back and there were two eight and thirteen years ago, but we don't see much in the way of restorations well documented here any more. The number of daily posts in the forum is also well down on years gone by. More and more it seems to me that the overall interest in cars of any age seems to be waning. My grandchildren see me as a polluting dinosaur and have no interest in cars at all, and I have doubts they will even learn to drive. Going to the monthly car meet sees a line of Porsches since the words "classic cars" has been replaced with "collectors cars". The era of the car as we know it is coming to a close, and in a few years we shall be charging up, not filling up, our cars while doing the shopping. The age of the mechanic is coming to a close, and who will tune my triple Webers then? On the bright side, I am actively helping two youngsters in their 20s here who have started up a garage specializing in old British cars, and they are stacked out with work. Last week they had two TR4s, a split screen Moggie, a TF, an S2 Landie, a Singer Gazelle convertible, and an E-type in the works, and have a long waiting list. Currently I am sourcing for them parts to convert a very early TR3 (TR2 nose) from RHD to LHD for example, screen rubbers for the Gazelle, and so on. We need to see more people like them coming through. Sorry to ramble on, but I just thought I'd pen a few of my thoughts. But if I can screw myself down to let the XKSS go, I shall be moving to the dark side most surely. Forty years of Jaguar is about enough I reckon. The page needs turning.
Our grandson had a look over my 1928 Vauxhall 20/60, sat himself in the drivers seat tried out the passengers seats and loved it. When I sold my vintage and purchased a ‘modern classic’ he was not happy at all, even refused to look at the ‘modern classic’!!! Now I have reverted back he is over the moon, I have promised him a ride out, in private grounds owing to legalities, and he can’t waitto come over. He also loves steam so all is not lost.
Generally though I do agree that interest in vintage has waned very considerably over the past twenty years especially. As you mention the owners of such motor cars are shuffling off and young people less interested. I have noticed this at team rallies where we used to see 100 and more vintage cars on display now dropped of to a mere handful. Classic cars taking their places.
lowdrag said:
A jump to the vintage era is not that far for me since my current cars were designed in the 1950's anyway. I am sure that many of you will have noticed just how this forum has changed over the last few years, but in a more modern direction, not older.
My grandchildren see me as a polluting dinosaur and have no interest in cars at all, and I have doubts they will even learn to drive. Going to the monthly car meet sees a line of Porsches since the words "classic cars" has been replaced with "collectors cars". The era of the car as we know it is coming to a close, and in a few years we shall be charging up, not filling up, our cars while doing the shopping. The age of the mechanic is coming to a close, and who will tune my triple Webers then?
On the bright side, I am actively helping two youngsters in their 20s here who have started up a garage specializing in old British cars, and they are stacked out with work.
But if I can screw myself down to let the XKSS go, I shall be moving to the dark side most surely. Forty years of Jaguar is about enough I reckon. The page needs turning.
We're going through a similar thing with the Steam Boat Association, which has been slowly falling from around 1200 members to around 900 for the last 5-10 years, and the number of active boats dropping more rapidly. Mainly because as you say older members, typically original founder member types who worked with steam, are shuffling up or atleast hanging up their shovels. The club is 50yo, and probably did peek ten years ago, as did online forums!My grandchildren see me as a polluting dinosaur and have no interest in cars at all, and I have doubts they will even learn to drive. Going to the monthly car meet sees a line of Porsches since the words "classic cars" has been replaced with "collectors cars". The era of the car as we know it is coming to a close, and in a few years we shall be charging up, not filling up, our cars while doing the shopping. The age of the mechanic is coming to a close, and who will tune my triple Webers then?
On the bright side, I am actively helping two youngsters in their 20s here who have started up a garage specializing in old British cars, and they are stacked out with work.
But if I can screw myself down to let the XKSS go, I shall be moving to the dark side most surely. Forty years of Jaguar is about enough I reckon. The page needs turning.
However as you also say, it's not all doom and gloom. The traction engine lot, which are nearly 20 years ahead on formation, are doing really very well indeed, they even have a whole sub-club or 'steam apprentice club' for younger members, engine values continue to rise, and plenty is being spent restoring and maintaining them. A brand new previously lost 'super lion' made from scratch recently, a little like Tornado the new A1 loco. And forums continue to live alongside facebook/insta/twitter.
I'm 33 so bucking the curve on vintage cars, as well as steam boats, but am ten years older than the most of the traction engine lot I know.
crankedup said:
Best to do. Google on each car and drop into wiki, I say this because he variations in each car an be wide. For example, performance is related to body style owing to weight variations, it really does make a difference in these vintage / post vintage cars.
The ‘artillery’ style wheels (sankey) are the most prevalent in vintage cars, the more expensive cars of the period would be wearing spoked wheel.Manufacturers did star to offer spoked wheels as an option as years rolled by. I wouldn’t even think about dismissing a possible purchase on the basis of which wheels it is shod. If you look at a sankey wheeled car as a serious proposition be aware that these wheels are 80/90 years old. One drawback of them is they can and do rust from the inside to out. This causes the welded seam, they are built as two half welded together, to come under pressure and very slowly split the join. Inspect wheels carefully to see if you can spot any spitting in the rims and spokes. This is not to put you off them, I have had cars running on repaired sankey wheels but it’s not ideal.
Wire wheels are much easier to have repaired of course as they are still in production many specialists are on hand. Not as easy to keep clean though
Yes the ignition and speed controls in the vintage 12 are handsome in brass, the move to bakelight or plastic in the post 1930 cars is one of the ‘improvements’ along with the ball change gear selector. It really is a case of finding your preferences. The post vintage period, as in my Austin, brought changes that suit my needs perfectly and it is a slightly easier car to drive than any of my previous vintage chariots.
As for brakes, well none of the cars come close to the performance of modern. Personally I am happy with what I have always thought to be reasonable brakes with the old rod and cables set up. Once they are set up correctly they are adequate. We are not travelling at a high speed, be aware of its limitations and drive accordingly, you will quickly adapt.
For all this it’s what makes vintage/post vintage motoring the fun that it is bags of character and involvement. Perhaps a little like your narrow boat, put in the effort for wonderful rewards.
If you do settle on an Austin I would urge you to join the Vintage Austin Register (VAR) and/or the Austin ten drivers club.
Good luck in your search
Yes, I have read a reasonable number of the wiki articles, if not retained all the detail completely, not that it is all present. However will also certainly re-read it as time goes on and as I narrow down size/model of car, and likely run the listing past the collection before final purchase. The ‘artillery’ style wheels (sankey) are the most prevalent in vintage cars, the more expensive cars of the period would be wearing spoked wheel.Manufacturers did star to offer spoked wheels as an option as years rolled by. I wouldn’t even think about dismissing a possible purchase on the basis of which wheels it is shod. If you look at a sankey wheeled car as a serious proposition be aware that these wheels are 80/90 years old. One drawback of them is they can and do rust from the inside to out. This causes the welded seam, they are built as two half welded together, to come under pressure and very slowly split the join. Inspect wheels carefully to see if you can spot any spitting in the rims and spokes. This is not to put you off them, I have had cars running on repaired sankey wheels but it’s not ideal.
Wire wheels are much easier to have repaired of course as they are still in production many specialists are on hand. Not as easy to keep clean though
Yes the ignition and speed controls in the vintage 12 are handsome in brass, the move to bakelight or plastic in the post 1930 cars is one of the ‘improvements’ along with the ball change gear selector. It really is a case of finding your preferences. The post vintage period, as in my Austin, brought changes that suit my needs perfectly and it is a slightly easier car to drive than any of my previous vintage chariots.
As for brakes, well none of the cars come close to the performance of modern. Personally I am happy with what I have always thought to be reasonable brakes with the old rod and cables set up. Once they are set up correctly they are adequate. We are not travelling at a high speed, be aware of its limitations and drive accordingly, you will quickly adapt.
For all this it’s what makes vintage/post vintage motoring the fun that it is bags of character and involvement. Perhaps a little like your narrow boat, put in the effort for wonderful rewards.
If you do settle on an Austin I would urge you to join the Vintage Austin Register (VAR) and/or the Austin ten drivers club.
Good luck in your search
Sankey wheels, noted. Will certainly check for failing welds before purchase, and during ownership, appears there wheels around for sale too. Easy to clean is nice, but like you, I have no strong preferences yet, and as they wont be chrome either way, am not against having wire wheels which look like they have just driven to the event.
Bakelite is not a fashion which has aged well, but such is life!
Yes, I am very interested to drive a car an feel what the brakes are like for myself for the first time, but as you say, hard late braking from high (any) speed is not going to be the order of the day anyway and a bit like the traction engines looking ahead and an amount of defensive driving is obviously going to be the order of the day.
I am well up for some character and will certainly join suitable clubs once I have the car, if not maybe before. Although at £40 a pop I wont be joining them all just to decide if that make/model is for me or not!
More questions to follow I am sure. Hopefully see a few cars over the weekend and expand my sample size from 1 to maybe 3-4!
Daniel
dhutch said:
Yes, I am very interested to drive a car an feel what the brakes are like for myself for the first time, but as you say, hard late braking from high (any) speed is not going to be the order of the day anyway and a bit like the traction engines looking ahead and an amount of defensive driving is obviously going to be the order of the day.
Driving older vehicles does require a better standard of driving, if you like to think that way.There was a motto along the lines of "never drive into a situation that you can't see the way out of" which sums up what we might call defensive driving.
crankedup said:
hutch, your narrowboat image failed, can you have another go as I, and am sure others, would like to see it.Cheers.
Ah, I tried to hot-link it of our website which worked in the preview but they must block it.Try again with thumbcnap. And one of out boats the launch back in spring 92....
The site was last updated about 15 years ago but has other photos/information etc. for anyone interested.
http://www.emilyanne.co.uk/
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