Great British Cars often forgotten
Discussion
cjb44 said:
Jaguar as you quite rightly say cancelled the project, reportedly they were afraid it would eclipse the E Type. Well they may have been fearful because had Daimler used the wonderful 4.5 larger brother of the 2.5 litre V8 they would have been in trouble as the V8 is lovely smooth engine with plenty of low down grunt. One of these engines was used very successfully in a single seat hillclimb car in the 60's/70's.
In the mid 1970s I fitted a couple of SP 250s (and a 250 V8 saloon), with the 4.6 Majestic Major engine transforming their straight line performance. The SP250 chassis wasn't really up to it though, entertaining nonetheless.
grumpy52 said:
Does Costin qualify ? 
I remember an article on them back in the 70s , The prototype had a mast on the roof with sidelights on it so it could be seen over the hedgerows.
Frank Costin was involved in many famous projects and companies but unless you're a car geek the majority of the public won't have heard of him let alone that he produced cars .
One of eight built, only three in the UK at present, only two of them on the road and here's one of them at the Marcos 60th anniversary meet at Wroxhall Abbey in Warwickshire a few weeks ago...I remember an article on them back in the 70s , The prototype had a mast on the roof with sidelights on it so it could be seen over the hedgerows.
Frank Costin was involved in many famous projects and companies but unless you're a car geek the majority of the public won't have heard of him let alone that he produced cars .
Edited by P5BNij on Friday 26th July 11:45
Allan L said:
I had a 1950 2½ Sports in 1959-66 (Photo below)
The only 1948 2½ litre Sports Lea-Francis I know of was the prototype, registration GKV904. LEA would be a West Bromwich registration but probably later than 1948 - I have no record of a Lea-Francis with such a registration, but The Club may have.
I'd love one. They're a stunning looking car imo. I'll give the club a shout. Re the 1948 part, just going on what I remember as a kid so possibly not right and the front plate was partly broken. ETA, could it have been a 14hp sports and not a 2 1/2 litre as they looks fairly similar? I only saw it once without a tonne of stuff on it in the garage.The only 1948 2½ litre Sports Lea-Francis I know of was the prototype, registration GKV904. LEA would be a West Bromwich registration but probably later than 1948 - I have no record of a Lea-Francis with such a registration, but The Club may have.
Edited by mneame on Friday 26th July 12:34
Etypephil said:
In the mid 1970s I fitted a couple of SP 250s (and a 250 V8 saloon), with the 4.6 Majestic Major engine transforming their straight line performance. The SP250 chassis wasn't really up to it though, entertaining nonetheless.
I can imagine, the early SP250 chassis was often ridiculed by the motoring press who managed to twist the chassis enough for the doors to fly open when cornered hard. I can imagine that a 250 V8 saloon would have been a real Q car in its day and I could put up with one today come to that.In the 60's AC, when faced with the supply of Bristol engines drying up, fitted an SP250 engine to the factory Ace mule for assessment; the car accepted it well but as usual Daimler decided they could not sell engines to AC and they ended up fitting the iron Ford 2.6 Zephyr engine. Just think had Daimler agreed, that possibly would have made the Majestic engine available and just maybe Shelby would not have got his fingers in the pie; mind you not sure if the Majestic would have been so tuneable or durable as the Ford V8.
As an aside, in the late 60's early 70's a friend of mine when faced with a rebuild of the Bristol engine in his Ace decided to go the 2.5 Daimler route, after some development work the car went and handled very well with it's new engine; the lightness and low centre of gravity enhancing the already excellent handling qualities of the Ace. Of course this conversion was frowned upon by Club members of the day and today would not be acceptable by the purists, that particular car is still alive and well and currently being restored with it's original Bristol engine by a well known AC restorer.
cjb44 said:
My memory tells me that Daimler produced one prototype to replace the SP250, this car as I recall did not look much like the Scimitar but a vast improvement on the SP250. Somewhere I have seen a picture of this car but now I am afraid this is where my memory has failed me, I am sure a knowledgeable PH person will come up trumps.
Jaguar as you quite rightly say cancelled the project, reportedly they were afraid it would eclipse the E Type. Well they may have been fearful because had Daimler used the wonderful 4.5 larger brother of the 2.5 litre V8 they would have been in trouble as the V8 is lovely smooth engine with plenty of low down grunt. One of these engines was used very successfully in a single seat hillclimb car in the 60's/70's.
I think it was Jaguar that produced the SP252 prototype not Daimler. They decided not to take it any further.Jaguar as you quite rightly say cancelled the project, reportedly they were afraid it would eclipse the E Type. Well they may have been fearful because had Daimler used the wonderful 4.5 larger brother of the 2.5 litre V8 they would have been in trouble as the V8 is lovely smooth engine with plenty of low down grunt. One of these engines was used very successfully in a single seat hillclimb car in the 60's/70's.
I don't see why they would have been afraid to produce a car, or an engine, that would be successful.
Personally I like the SP250 but the general consensus, then and now, is that it was underdeveloped and actually rather ugly.
brucky74 said:
This is it, fully refurbished. Reliant purchased the design from Daimler. Ogle tweaked the body to fit the Sabre chassis.
http://sporting-reliants.com/images/Prototypes/Ogl...
I see quite a strong resemblance to the Lamborghini 350 and 400 GTs from that angle.http://sporting-reliants.com/images/Prototypes/Ogl...
GTRene said:
Nerdherder said:
bucksmanuk said:
RodMod said:
Triumph Italia (or TR3B)
Rod.
Rod.
I've never heard of that one before, what a truly beautiful car
https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
Was it very expensive to produce? It's the only reason I can think of why it didn't sell in 1000's
CDP said:
Truely beautiful.
Was it very expensive to produce? It's the only reason I can think of why it didn't sell in 1000's
here is the storyWas it very expensive to produce? It's the only reason I can think of why it didn't sell in 1000's
story said:
Ruffino envisioned building 1,000 cars, between 1960 and 1962, with worldwide distribution including the American marketplace. He had a verbal agreement to have every Triumph dealer (720) purchase an Italia. The Italia never became an official model of Standard-Triumph.
Faced with ensuing financial and labor problems, Standard-Triumph was taken over by Leyland Motors in 1961. The new management did not follow through with the verbal contract that Ruffino had made with Triumph. Perhaps fearing increased competition, Triumph concentrated their efforts on the new TR4 to be released in 1962. The TR4, also designed by Michelotti, clearly borrowed many elements from the Italia: the distinctive bonnet bulge, kick-up door with wind-up windows, and roomier modern body design.
With Triumph's decision not to distribute the Italia, Ruffino S.p.A. re-badged the car as the Italia 2000 and continued production. Over a three-year production period (mid-1959 to mid-1962) Vignale produced approximately 329 cars. Six cars were produced in right-hand drive. The first show car, Italia #1, was converted to right-hand drive after being sold by Standard-Triumph. After a six-month halt in production, the last run of 30 cars was based on the TR3B chassis. These all used the TSF chassis specification and, as such, retained the 1991cc engine and non-synchro first gear transmission of the TR3.
Indeed, sad, great car, lovely designFaced with ensuing financial and labor problems, Standard-Triumph was taken over by Leyland Motors in 1961. The new management did not follow through with the verbal contract that Ruffino had made with Triumph. Perhaps fearing increased competition, Triumph concentrated their efforts on the new TR4 to be released in 1962. The TR4, also designed by Michelotti, clearly borrowed many elements from the Italia: the distinctive bonnet bulge, kick-up door with wind-up windows, and roomier modern body design.
With Triumph's decision not to distribute the Italia, Ruffino S.p.A. re-badged the car as the Italia 2000 and continued production. Over a three-year production period (mid-1959 to mid-1962) Vignale produced approximately 329 cars. Six cars were produced in right-hand drive. The first show car, Italia #1, was converted to right-hand drive after being sold by Standard-Triumph. After a six-month halt in production, the last run of 30 cars was based on the TR3B chassis. These all used the TSF chassis specification and, as such, retained the 1991cc engine and non-synchro first gear transmission of the TR3.
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