Scimitar 5a for 9k?
Discussion
I was flicking through the latest edition of C&SC magazine today and half way through there was a Brightwells auction (I think) of a Scimitar GTE SE5a, including a photo, and underneath it said it fetched about £9,000. 9k for a 5a?. I could understand if it was a rarer model like the Middlebrdige, but a "throwaway" affordable classic like an SE5a I thought was a bit OTT IMO; I say throwaway as alot of them seem to end up abadoned in someone's front garden or used as a spares/repairs. Are we seeing signs of the long awaited value increase of these underrated cars, or is this just a one-off?. I sold a much rarer 6b GTE with a Cologne engine last year for a measly 2 grand lol.
Speaking of crazy auction values, but in the same mag there was a 12,000 mile Ford Sierra RS500 Cosworth that fetched £112,000. The world's gone mad.
Speaking of crazy auction values, but in the same mag there was a 12,000 mile Ford Sierra RS500 Cosworth that fetched £112,000. The world's gone mad.
Edited by Jukebag on Wednesday 6th June 20:07
Was it a green colour, SE5 (rarer than the IMO less good looking and ubiquitous 5a)? From what i saw of it, the paint was really good and that's very important.
If you want a Scimitar and you want one with really good paint, you are looking north of 5 or 6k for a respray, easily.
If its the car I was thinking of, it was in all round very good condition too, so again if you wanted to get a cheap one in the same place it would be big money - engine/gearbox rebuild/interior work new wire wheels etc. that can easily go past 5k.
Get two people both want a top condition car, who understand the rarity of one already like that, and the costs of getting a rough one there and boom! 9K is where its at.
Really good cars have been going for that kind of money for a while, a club member sold his excellent and very well maintained example for a lot more than that (i think, he never actually said the price, just "too much to turn down")
Having said that, apparently the guy who bought it broke down on the way home and was saved by a passing fellow Scimitar owner! Soon fixed those teething troubles though, the big money items have been done on that car,
Scimitars are good value though, really good value and the club is brilliant. I don't understand why they aren't more sought after, i think they are great.
If you want a Scimitar and you want one with really good paint, you are looking north of 5 or 6k for a respray, easily.
If its the car I was thinking of, it was in all round very good condition too, so again if you wanted to get a cheap one in the same place it would be big money - engine/gearbox rebuild/interior work new wire wheels etc. that can easily go past 5k.
Get two people both want a top condition car, who understand the rarity of one already like that, and the costs of getting a rough one there and boom! 9K is where its at.
Really good cars have been going for that kind of money for a while, a club member sold his excellent and very well maintained example for a lot more than that (i think, he never actually said the price, just "too much to turn down")
Having said that, apparently the guy who bought it broke down on the way home and was saved by a passing fellow Scimitar owner! Soon fixed those teething troubles though, the big money items have been done on that car,
Scimitars are good value though, really good value and the club is brilliant. I don't understand why they aren't more sought after, i think they are great.
I think it did have wire wheels, which the ad said was unusual, though I didn't read further as I was just flicking through more than anything but it caught my attention. If 6k is what you'd pay for a top job paintjob than it's no wonder the fibreglass E-Type replica I have is showing a significant amount of micro blistering over the back of the car, this despite (or so I was told) the car having had a respray not too many years ago; probably had a really cheapo sub grand respray done by a local garage. I doubt most people will wanna pay around 6k for a respray. That's fibreglass for you.
But anyway, you're right about Scimitar's or rather the GTE models being undervalued. But at least the less prestine examples will be used more than rather than it being shoved into garage all year around never to be driven only for shows, etc.
But anyway, you're right about Scimitar's or rather the GTE models being undervalued. But at least the less prestine examples will be used more than rather than it being shoved into garage all year around never to be driven only for shows, etc.
Slightly OT but flicking through my charity shop purchase of all of 1981's copies of Motor Sport magazine I noted that a brand new Scimitar GTE was listed at £10,324.
I would save myself a bit of money and get a 1973 Carrera RS for £6,950, a 1964 DB5 for £7,950 or maybe a 74 Dino for £10k.
I would save myself a bit of money and get a 1973 Carrera RS for £6,950, a 1964 DB5 for £7,950 or maybe a 74 Dino for £10k.
Scimitar's, or the majority that is, regardless of whether they're prestine examples or just good runners, should be worth more than what they currently are. But I cannot see any dramatic value increase anytime in the near future. Spending so much on a respray for something like an E-Type is worthwhile considering they are in demand and fetch alot of money, even ones in need of a restoration. But when something like a GTE Scimitar, which only sell for a few hundred to a few thousand (anything from 800-4k), having a 6k respray on it only for it to fetch a measly 9k, I don't think it would be worth bothering IMO. MGBs, Moggy Minors, Spitfires, and even Lotus 7 kit cars sell for more money than a Scimitar.
It's probably a combination of factors that keeps values down; a not very glamorous badge, not much interest outside the UK, it's not a Ford and also the fact that what made it good in the first place (a practical 4-seat closed grand tourer with sensible running gear) aren't virtues that people have high on the list when getting a classic car.
Jukebag said:
Scimitar's, or the majority that is, regardless of whether they're prestine examples or just good runners, should be worth more than what they currently are. But I cannot see any dramatic value increase anytime in the near future. Spending so much on a respray for something like an E-Type is worthwhile considering they are in demand and fetch alot of money, even ones in need of a restoration. But when something like a GTE Scimitar, which only sell for a few hundred to a few thousand (anything from 800-4k), having a 6k respray on it only for it to fetch a measly 9k, I don't think it would be worth bothering IMO. MGBs, Moggy Minors, Spitfires, and even Lotus 7 kit cars sell for more money than a Scimitar.
I think you could say this of many every day, bread and butter classics, Vauxhall Vivas, Triumph Heralds, etc. Have we created a vicious circle for ourselves in this hobby? A Scimitar is worth, for example 2,000 GBP but needs a repaint costing 3,000 GBP, current market value after paint is 3,500 GBP (I'm just playing with example numbers here). So, maybe paint doesn't get done or is done on the cheap. Car still looks shabby, owner goes to sell, now worth less than the original 2,000???. New owner gets it for a bargain price, runs it on a shoestring, and down the condition may spiral and hence price, and maybe one less on the road. There are so many examples of this in the classic car world. Are we going to see some cars totally disappear through high cost of restoration vs market value? That would be a shame in many cases. Many are not in the hobby for the money I know. With cars like the Scimitar it means there could eventually be a very small pool of actual good cars left, with the majority in less than stellar condition perhaps resulting in giving the cars an unnecessarily poor reputation than they really deserve. Surely at some point a few brave souls will put the necessary money into cars like the Scimitar and the market will turn in their favour and the cars actually become relatively economically viable to properly restore?I own a 5a and it's a great car. Guess what, it would be even better with a new paint job, but that is more or less the value of the car again at this time. I'd say one area that Scimitar's are let down in is the interior material quality and fit and finish. Replacement/reman trim is nigh on impossible to source I think. I find mine a very rewarding car to drive. I am in the fortunate enough position to be able to throw some money at my cars beyond their value from time to time as it's the hobby element I enjoy.
Just a few of my rambling thoughts.
Jukebag said:
I was flicking through the latest edition of C&SC magazine today and half way through there was a Brightwells auction (I think) of a Scimitar GTE SE5a, including a photo, and underneath it said it fetched about £9,000. 9k for a 5a?. I could understand if it was a rarer model like the Middlebrdige, but a "throwaway" affordable classic like an SE5a I thought was a bit OTT IMO
It does look like a VERY nice Scim, though.Lot 59 - https://www.brightwells.com/classic-motoring/gener...
Brightwells said:
A really splendid example of the Scimitar GTE, this September 1971 SE5 is fitted with the venerable 3.0 Ford Essex V6 and must be one of the last few 5’s off the production line before the 5a appeared in early 1972 with a few subtle differences.
Finished in wonderfully period Acacia Green, this super example had only three previous owners before the vendor acquired it in 2015. The extensive history file shows a spend of £1,851 on engine and other remedial works in January 2007 since when the car has only covered around 400 miles.
A striking improvement to this car has been the fitment of Triumph TR wire wheels (including the spare) with centre knock caps and adaptors, which really set the car off nicely, giving added drama and sporting intent to the handsome ‘70s shape.
The interior is finished in black vinyl and appears to be in very good order, a MotoLita steering wheel just adding to the sporty looks. Externally, the brightwork is in good condition as is the Acacia paintwork. A glance underneath reveals the car has been kept well and stored in a dry garage with little, if any, signs of corrosion.
The vendor has enjoyed owning the car and has made a few useful upgrades including fitting a new Weber carburettor in March 2018 at a cost of £217. He has also fitted a halogen headlight conversion kit because the originals were “like candles in jam jars”.
Supplied with a considerable history file to back up the modest 64,007 miles indicated, it also comes with a V5C, old blue V5 and older style log book, invoices, various old MOTs and a current MOT valid until August 2018 with no advisories recorded.
I can't understand why Scims are such good value, either. I've long quite fancied one.Finished in wonderfully period Acacia Green, this super example had only three previous owners before the vendor acquired it in 2015. The extensive history file shows a spend of £1,851 on engine and other remedial works in January 2007 since when the car has only covered around 400 miles.
A striking improvement to this car has been the fitment of Triumph TR wire wheels (including the spare) with centre knock caps and adaptors, which really set the car off nicely, giving added drama and sporting intent to the handsome ‘70s shape.
The interior is finished in black vinyl and appears to be in very good order, a MotoLita steering wheel just adding to the sporty looks. Externally, the brightwork is in good condition as is the Acacia paintwork. A glance underneath reveals the car has been kept well and stored in a dry garage with little, if any, signs of corrosion.
The vendor has enjoyed owning the car and has made a few useful upgrades including fitting a new Weber carburettor in March 2018 at a cost of £217. He has also fitted a halogen headlight conversion kit because the originals were “like candles in jam jars”.
Supplied with a considerable history file to back up the modest 64,007 miles indicated, it also comes with a V5C, old blue V5 and older style log book, invoices, various old MOTs and a current MOT valid until August 2018 with no advisories recorded.
They are great value and the green car in question looks superb and worth the money
My 20yr old Nipper drives his a lot including through the winter just gone even though he has access to some much nicer metal he chooses the Scimitar.
It does need a repaint though and that as said here is not worth the investment......yet
My 20yr old Nipper drives his a lot including through the winter just gone even though he has access to some much nicer metal he chooses the Scimitar.
It does need a repaint though and that as said here is not worth the investment......yet
I had to rebuild my Scimitar rear axle, cost me about the same amount I paid for the car. But I didn't buy it make money!
More on the brightwells one
"One of the most popular lots in the sale proved to be a 1972 Reliant Scimitar SE5 GTE which looked most striking in period Acacia Green with silver painted wire wheels and desirable manual overdrive transmission. Rather conservatively estimated at £2,500 - £3,500 due to its somewhat crazed paintwork, it sparked such a fierce bidding war that Brightwells had to stop taking phone bids several days before the sale because every available phone line was taken, the Scimitar eventually falling to a bidder in the room for £9,020. A Thistle Green 1981 Reliant Scimitar GTC Convertible with only 41,500 miles under its wheels but again with various paint defects also smashed its estimate before falling to a Belgian internet bidder for £9,460. "
More on the brightwells one
"One of the most popular lots in the sale proved to be a 1972 Reliant Scimitar SE5 GTE which looked most striking in period Acacia Green with silver painted wire wheels and desirable manual overdrive transmission. Rather conservatively estimated at £2,500 - £3,500 due to its somewhat crazed paintwork, it sparked such a fierce bidding war that Brightwells had to stop taking phone bids several days before the sale because every available phone line was taken, the Scimitar eventually falling to a bidder in the room for £9,020. A Thistle Green 1981 Reliant Scimitar GTC Convertible with only 41,500 miles under its wheels but again with various paint defects also smashed its estimate before falling to a Belgian internet bidder for £9,460. "
Surely nobody goes into classic car ownership with the same mindset as owning a modern car? where cost of repairs/servicing are always weighted against market 'value'?
If you factor in the lack of depreciation of your asset, aftera number of years you will have a fat wedge to spend on that respray!
If you factor in the lack of depreciation of your asset, aftera number of years you will have a fat wedge to spend on that respray!
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