Ultra rare mk 1 Escort at upcoming auction
Discussion
Touring442 said:
The RS2000 had that 3.54 diff as well that gave it some legs in 1st-3rd.
A decent cam absolutely transformed the Pinto. Even on the stock 32/36 Weber, a 270 ish degree cam really let it fill its lungs. The 2.0 inlet ports were too big which is why they weren't as torquey as they should have been. A 270 Piper stick and a rejet was good for 15 bhp or so.
RS2000 used gearbox (just the fancy short shift lever) in any Pinto powered Ford at the time Cortina MK3 Capri MK 2/3 etc also had a 3.5 1st gear rather than the rarer used in early GT models 3.0 1st of the twinks gearbox , both figures approx but close , its where the nearly 40mph in 1st came about would imagine thats a 3.77 diff too A decent cam absolutely transformed the Pinto. Even on the stock 32/36 Weber, a 270 ish degree cam really let it fill its lungs. The 2.0 inlet ports were too big which is why they weren't as torquey as they should have been. A 270 Piper stick and a rejet was good for 15 bhp or so.
Edited by Zener on Monday 27th July 16:32
Zener said:
Touring442 said:
The RS2000 had that 3.54 diff as well that gave it some legs in 1st-3rd.
A decent cam absolutely transformed the Pinto. Even on the stock 32/36 Weber, a 270 ish degree cam really let it fill its lungs. The 2.0 inlet ports were too big which is why they weren't as torquey as they should have been. A 270 Piper stick and a rejet was good for 15 bhp or so.
RS2000 used gearbox (just the fancy short shift lever) in any Pinto powered Ford at the time Cortina MK3 Capri MK 2/3 etc also had a 3.5 1st gear rather than the rarer used in early GT models 3.0 1st of the twinks gearbox , both figures approx but close , its where the nearly 40mph in 1st came about would imagine thats a 3.77 diff too A decent cam absolutely transformed the Pinto. Even on the stock 32/36 Weber, a 270 ish degree cam really let it fill its lungs. The 2.0 inlet ports were too big which is why they weren't as torquey as they should have been. A 270 Piper stick and a rejet was good for 15 bhp or so.
Edited by Zener on Monday 27th July 16:32
whereas two changes was needed in the Twink, as 2nd gear only ran to 56mph.
Zener said:
RS2000 used gearbox (just the fancy short shift lever) in any Pinto powered Ford at the time Cortina MK3 Capri MK 2/3 etc also had a 3.5 1st gear rather than the rarer used in early GT models 3.0 1st of the twinks gearbox , both figures approx but close , its where the nearly 40mph in 1st came about would imagine thats a 3.77 diff too
Indeed.Edited by Zener on Monday 27th July 16:32
The RS2000 used the 2000 Cortina/Taunus box, a German made unit that later became the T9 with the fifth gear added. Capris used the clunky old side change Transit/Zephyr box with that strange side selector set up. Mexicos, RS1600's and TC's had the superb Corsair V4 GT gearbox, the 2000E. The single rail box from the Mark III Cortina 1300/1600 had similar ratios. Iirc they were a straight swap if you couldn't find/afford a 2000E.
Diffs: 3.89 was the 1300 and GT with 12 inch wheels and the Sport had a 4.1 due to the 13 inch wheels. Mexico's, RS1600's and TC's were 3.77 standard. RS2000's and 1600 Sport/Ghias had the 3.54.
aeropilot said:
Lotus quality control meant they varied enormously, it was pot luck if you got a good one or a bad one, so anything from 100bhp to 115.
It was the same with the 911 engine fitted to the Sunbeam-Lotus a decade later, huge variation in standard spec power between engines.
A similar story to the 907 engine in the Jensen Healey a few years earlier, though poor reliability was the more critical factor in that application.It was the same with the 911 engine fitted to the Sunbeam-Lotus a decade later, huge variation in standard spec power between engines.
aeropilot said:
Zener said:
Touring442 said:
The RS2000 had that 3.54 diff as well that gave it some legs in 1st-3rd.
A decent cam absolutely transformed the Pinto. Even on the stock 32/36 Weber, a 270 ish degree cam really let it fill its lungs. The 2.0 inlet ports were too big which is why they weren't as torquey as they should have been. A 270 Piper stick and a rejet was good for 15 bhp or so.
RS2000 used gearbox (just the fancy short shift lever) in any Pinto powered Ford at the time Cortina MK3 Capri MK 2/3 etc also had a 3.5 1st gear rather than the rarer used in early GT models 3.0 1st of the twinks gearbox , both figures approx but close , its where the nearly 40mph in 1st came about would imagine thats a 3.77 diff too A decent cam absolutely transformed the Pinto. Even on the stock 32/36 Weber, a 270 ish degree cam really let it fill its lungs. The 2.0 inlet ports were too big which is why they weren't as torquey as they should have been. A 270 Piper stick and a rejet was good for 15 bhp or so.
Edited by Zener on Monday 27th July 16:32
whereas two changes was needed in the Twink, as 2nd gear only ran to 56mph.
Prices for these things are absolutely stupid. I was having a conversation about similar with a friend the other day around a rare Pokemon card, whatever that is, going for something like £200k. What you have at the moment is people who lusted after Escorts (or Pokemon cards) as kids who now have plenty of money and are willing to buy mint examples for £££. In a couple of decades (or sooner) when the generation who has some nostalgic attachment to these things has died off, and the generation with money no longer care about them they will be worth next to nothing as there is no inherent value.
rsbmw said:
Prices for these things are absolutely stupid.
Here we go again...Escort prices were jet fuelled once they were allowed into FIA Historic Rallying, and demand for cars/shells to build new rally cars pulled everything else up with it......especially the genuine road cars. If an ordinary 1100/1300 L with an ID plate and V5 was 'worth' 5-10k to build a rally car from, that was going to make a genuine Mex or Twink or RS2, or Mk2 RS18 etc worth 3 or 4 times that amount.
The same thing happened to Lotus-Cortina (and GT etc) values a decade earlier when the FIA rules only allowed for pre-66 cars and excluded the Escort from Historic comps.
The rules of supply and demand mean that more people are chasing a finite supply of cars.....and so the price goes up.
I'd love to get behind the wheel of one again 30 years on from the last time I drove one - which was funnily enough a RS1600.
rsbmw said:
Prices for these things are absolutely stupid. I was having a conversation about similar with a friend the other day around a rare Pokemon card, whatever that is, going for something like £200k. What you have at the moment is people who lusted after Escorts (or Pokemon cards) as kids who now have plenty of money and are willing to buy mint examples for £££. In a couple of decades (or sooner) when the generation who has some nostalgic attachment to these things has died off, and the generation with money no longer care about them they will be worth next to nothing as there is no inherent value.
Highly unlikely judging by the amount of "younger" people who love them. Old Escorts will Always be worth decent money, as time marches on, appreciation for them only increases. I do agree though, some of the prices asked are Rather "keen" those cars do tend to hang around for sale a long time.That's gorgeous. I'd love to own an Escort again. Funnily enough though (and you guys may disagree) but I always felt the 02 series BMW's were very like an Escort but with independent rear suspension.
Here's mine...
[url]
It's started as a 1.6 but now has a 1.9 twin cam.
|https://thumbsnap.com/otfXVB1U[/url]
Here's mine...
[url]It's started as a 1.6 but now has a 1.9 twin cam.
|https://thumbsnap.com/otfXVB1U[/url]generationx said:
Mark A S said:
Much Escort P()rn
Lovely, the significant car being DKP191T, originally a David Sutton/Ari Vatanen car seen variously as a Rothmans or "Black Beauty" Shell car. Of course at the time Mark was using it it was just another old rally Escort... Hindsight eh?
Acropolis Rally I would guess from the background.
I might have had a grainy photo of it taken in the old Sutton Motorsports workshop in Bollo Lane, when I used to often pop down in my work lunch hour on oft chance of seeing something interesting during the '81 season....and I was lucky a few times. Sadly all those photos taken on my pocket 110 are now long gone, all damaged when they were left in my parents loft after I had moved out in the late 80's....
Mark A S said:
rsbmw said:
Prices for these things are absolutely stupid. I was having a conversation about similar with a friend the other day around a rare Pokemon card, whatever that is, going for something like £200k. What you have at the moment is people who lusted after Escorts (or Pokemon cards) as kids who now have plenty of money and are willing to buy mint examples for £££. In a couple of decades (or sooner) when the generation who has some nostalgic attachment to these things has died off, and the generation with money no longer care about them they will be worth next to nothing as there is no inherent value.
Highly unlikely judging by the amount of "younger" people who love them. Old Escorts will Always be worth decent money, as time marches on, appreciation for them only increases. I do agree though, some of the prices asked are Rather "keen" those cars do tend to hang around for sale a long time.Henry Catchpole off EVO isn’t that old is he? I presume he still has his Mk2 - even though he could probably sell it and buy something else, newer and not a Ford Escort
Never driven a 2002, but that is Very nice.
Hindsight,,,,,,,,,,,,, used to pee me off a bit, but now I just have VERY fond memories. Yes, Gp 4 Mk 2’s were fairly common back then, for sensible money as well, at the Time, I did not realise DKP’s history, as you say, just another Escort.
Aero, yep, Acropolis Rally which Ari had just won in DKP, along with the 1000 lakes also in DKP that year.
When Suttons sold up there Fords end of 81, DKP was sold to MCD [ later RED ] who Ran Ari in it in 82 as the famous Shell black car [ black beauty was another Mk 2].
Ari never won anything that year in DKP but lead several events, eventually wrecking DKP on the Manx. MCD re-built it into a RHD shell, painted in there red colour. We bought it from them in Early 83. Beautifully built car, I re-shelled it later that year after my one and only [ thankfully ] big off, Welsh pines, don’t move!
Sadly most of my old photos in scrap books “disappeared” many years ago, thank god for the internet aye
Hindsight,,,,,,,,,,,,, used to pee me off a bit, but now I just have VERY fond memories. Yes, Gp 4 Mk 2’s were fairly common back then, for sensible money as well, at the Time, I did not realise DKP’s history, as you say, just another Escort.
Aero, yep, Acropolis Rally which Ari had just won in DKP, along with the 1000 lakes also in DKP that year.
When Suttons sold up there Fords end of 81, DKP was sold to MCD [ later RED ] who Ran Ari in it in 82 as the famous Shell black car [ black beauty was another Mk 2].
Ari never won anything that year in DKP but lead several events, eventually wrecking DKP on the Manx. MCD re-built it into a RHD shell, painted in there red colour. We bought it from them in Early 83. Beautifully built car, I re-shelled it later that year after my one and only [ thankfully ] big off, Welsh pines, don’t move!
Sadly most of my old photos in scrap books “disappeared” many years ago, thank god for the internet aye
Mark A S said:
...eventually wrecking DKP on the Manx...
There's video of this on YT somewhere. The absolute classic is a world-weary looking Terry Harryman (co-driver) being interviewed afterwards and, when asked when he realised they were going to have an accident, he said "Scrutineering" 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iKjlqH-ni6Q&t=...
As far as i know, the only video of me in DKP back in 1983, think this was my first Forest rally in it. We are at 3.45, 5.06 and 10.00.
I recall the Harryman comment well
As far as i know, the only video of me in DKP back in 1983, think this was my first Forest rally in it. We are at 3.45, 5.06 and 10.00.
I recall the Harryman comment well
generationx said:
Mark A S said:
...eventually wrecking DKP on the Manx...
There's video of this on YT somewhere. The absolute classic is a world-weary looking Terry Harryman (co-driver) being interviewed afterwards and, when asked when he realised they were going to have an accident, he said "Scrutineering" 
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