XK120 banger racing!

[RetroCosworth]

Out of shear interest why aren't mundane cars used such as a Ford Mondeo Mk2 or a Ford Fiesta MK3 used more regularly than the barges?

[lowdrag]

RetroCosworth said:

Out of shear interest why aren't mundane cars used such as a Ford Mondeo Mk2 or a Ford Fiesta MK3 used more regularly than the barges?

Frankly RetroCosworth, I don't think you are really understanding the whole point of this thread. The man bought a wreck, no papers, no identity, just a chassis, wrong engine, no history, and decided to do something with it. He has rebuilt this "bitza" to a standard where it can race, and gives a lot of pleasure to people in so doing. It is his passion - maybe not mine but nevertheless - he is racing a wreck which otherwise is just bits and pieces.

Get to grips with the fact that this is not really an XK150 but the remains of something that is really just a wreck. Personally I feel he is making this wreck live again. Would you rather see the remains sold on to a dealer who would just "recreate" an "original" XK?

I just admire the chap for having the gall to do what he has done. I am right behind him and I think you should be too.

[RetroCosworth]

lowdrag said:

Frankly RetroCosworth, I don't think you are really understanding the whole point of this thread. The man bought a wreck, no papers, no identity, just a chassis, wrong engine, no history, and decided to do something with it. He has rebuilt this "bitza" to a standard where it can race, and gives a lot of pleasure to people in so doing. It is his passion - maybe not mine but nevertheless - he is racing a wreck which otherwise is just bits and pieces.

I'd rather it be restored than raced even if it has no indentity or papers to it.

lowdrag said:

Get to grips with the fact that this is not really an XK150 but the remains of something that is really just a wreck. Personally I feel he is making this wreck live again. Would you rather see the remains sold on to a dealer who would just "recreate" an "original" XK?

I'd rather it was used to recreate an original XK than being used on a banger racing circuit.

lowdrag said:

I just admire the chap for having the gall to do what he has done. I am right behind him and I think you should be too.

I'm not with you on that I'm afraid.

[ewenm]

Buy it yourself then.

Why do people get so upset about what other people do with their property? XK150s aren't hugely rare, there are plenty of garage-queen examples out there for those who worry about such things to drool over. Who really cares if a few, and be honest it is only a very very few, get used in banger racing?

Edited by ewenm on Sunday 11th July 00:19

[MGB Boy]

lowdrag said:

Would you rather see the remains sold on to a dealer who would just "recreate" an "original" XK?

...

You can't be serious?

[plonker751]

Right, im going to try and explain the story of this xk150 so thatg it may give a better idea of the state and circumstances, then you can come to your own conclusion of the car, this may be a long reply.
2 of my mates run a scrap company, they occasionally get phone calls to go pick up old scrap cars etc, they had done some work for this woman cutting up her old truck a while back. About 4 months ago they got a phone call off her daughter saying they had a rover p6 to go pick if they wanted, when they turned up, there was a complete 1957 3.8 manual jaguar xk150, after abit of talking they found out there had been a misunderstanding with the rover p6 and it was the jag they were picking up. The car was complete and in primer, the owner said he wanted £100 and the car to be cut up and taken away, my mates then said can we not give you £1000 and take away as is, owner said nope, cut it up, my mates went away then next day came back with me, bearing in mind the first time my mates saw it, it was a complete car, when we all went back the car was missing all the interior, lights, bumpers,wire wheels, boot, doors, bonnet, windows, cam covers, water pump and distributor. We cut the roof off, gave £100 got it back to the yard.
First things first, get it rollable, we bought a set of xj6 hubs, and after over 4 hours per hub, we managed to get the xk150 brake discs to bolt to the xj6 hubs so that we could have some normal studded wheels, roof was welded back on with reinforcing on the places it was cut, over a week went intomaking the doors and bonnet and get them to look right, engine bits had to be sourced,make up floor pans as wooden floors, get a steering wheel to fit, find a proper seat for it and fix it in, then on top of that was the normal 2 weeks worth of building we put into a banger anyway, then 3 days wroth of prep then another 2 days on top for the paint, plus another day for the sign writing. So overall about 4 months worth of work, its not the moeny side that bothers us as it only stands us in at about £600 maximum, its the amount of time and effort we put into it that we cant put a price on, which is one of the rasons we refused the offers we were given on the day.
Now ive explained that, im more than happy to answer anymore questions, and even though you may not think it as im only '18 years old' but i fully understand and apprieciate if your not exactly pleased with what happened, but like its been said before, better it have been raced than sit around and rot into the ground, seen it happen all to many times with cars ive asked for, e.g. i no of a 3ltr mk1 granada coupe, mk2 granada estate, mk3 capri and a standard ensign all sitting and rotting away, all owned by same owner and he wont let any of em go for racing, road or resoration, likes to watch em rot, and in my opinion, even banger racing them is better than letting them rot!

[plonker751]

RetroCosworth said:

Out of shear interest why aren't mundane cars used such as a Ford Mondeo Mk2 or a Ford Fiesta MK3 used more regularly than the barges?

that comment then just 'sums you up' mate, you seem to want to tell me waht you think of banger racing then put a comment like that, mk2 mondeos ARE the number 1 choice of bangers now, you will be lucky to go to a big 2ltr banger meeting and see anything other than a mondeo, and mk3 fiesta's, yes please, i rate them little things, good strong and reliable cars for the smaller meeting, only today i went to eastbourne to watch the micro bangers and no few than 6 mk3 fiesta were out there!
And theres another meeting at eastbourne in 2 weeeks time, a 2ltr national meeting, from the sounds of it im the only person out there who ISNT in a mondeo!

[Andy 308GTB]

RetroCosworth said:

lowdrag said:

Get to grips with the fact that this is not really an XK150 but the remains of something that is really just a wreck. Personally I feel he is making this wreck live again. Would you rather see the remains sold on to a dealer who would just "recreate" an "original" XK?

I'd rather it was used to recreate an original XK than being used on a banger racing circuit.

I think this is the key point here - any restoration performed on this car would create a vehicle that is no more original that a kit car. Except that this 'restoration' would have an original log book - it would be a complete sham & probably make someone a lot of money. For that reason I don't have a problem with it going banger racing.

Also at the end of the day as 'Plonker' has said, it's his car, it's his money and he'll do what he wants with it. I actually don't think he's doing it to ps off Classic Car enthusiasts - he's doing it to give a bit of a show and has worked damned hard to do so.

[plonker751]

Andy 308GTB said:

RetroCosworth said:

lowdrag said:

Get to grips with the fact that this is not really an XK150 but the remains of something that is really just a wreck. Personally I feel he is making this wreck live again. Would you rather see the remains sold on to a dealer who would just "recreate" an "original" XK?

I'd rather it was used to recreate an original XK than being used on a banger racing circuit.

I think this is the key point here - any restoration performed on this car would create a vehicle that is no more original that a kit car. Except that this 'restoration' would have an original log book - it would be a complete sham & probably make someone a lot of money. For that reason I don't have a problem with it going banger racing.

Also at the end of the day as 'Plonker' has said, it's his car, it's his money and he'll do what he wants with it. I actually don't think he's doing it to ps off Classic Car enthusiasts - he's doing it to give a bit of a show and has worked damned hard to do so.

thank you

[plonker751]

braddo said:

williamp said:

Well I still think you're a bd and I'll happily say that to your face. What's wrong with you?

I wonder if the next car Plonker has his eye on for racing is a decrepit AM V8?

Nope, somthing older than the xk150

[a8hex]

plonker751 said:

when they turned up, there was a complete 1957 3.8 manual jaguar xk150, after abit of talking they found out there had been a misunderstanding with the rover p6 and it was the jag they were picking up. The car was complete and in primer, the owner said he wanted £100 and the car to be cut up and taken away, my mates then said can we not give you £1000 and take away as is, owner said nope, cut it up, my mates went away then next day came back with me, bearing in mind the first time my mates saw it, it was a complete car, when we all went back the car was missing all the interior, lights, bumpers,wire wheels, boot, doors, bonnet, windows, cam covers, water pump and distributor. We cut the roof off, gave £100 got it back to the yard.

I'm not doubting you but I completely fail to understand this.
It's tin worm that kills XKs.
All the panels on this one were good. They invariably go before the chassis.
So I would have thought we are talking about somewhere in the region of £15->20 grands worth of car when your mates first saw it.

I can not think for a legitimate reason why someone with 20grands worth of car wants it wiped out. What were they trying to hide?

[MGB Boy]

I understand it was a lot of work etc etc
But the parts were still rare and therefore worth it for people to buy.
I saw a not bangered one at a classic car show today and it was beautiful, Shame many of the parts that make it so ie wings from yours will be needlessly destroyed.

[plonker751]

a8hex said:

plonker751 said:

when they turned up, there was a complete 1957 3.8 manual jaguar xk150, after abit of talking they found out there had been a misunderstanding with the rover p6 and it was the jag they were picking up. The car was complete and in primer, the owner said he wanted £100 and the car to be cut up and taken away, my mates then said can we not give you £1000 and take away as is, owner said nope, cut it up, my mates went away then next day came back with me, bearing in mind the first time my mates saw it, it was a complete car, when we all went back the car was missing all the interior, lights, bumpers,wire wheels, boot, doors, bonnet, windows, cam covers, water pump and distributor. We cut the roof off, gave £100 got it back to the yard.

I'm not doubting you but I completely fail to understand this.
It's tin worm that kills XKs.
All the panels on this one were good. They invariably go before the chassis.
So I would have thought we are talking about somewhere in the region of £15->20 grands worth of car when your mates first saw it.

I can not think for a legitimate reason why someone with 20grands worth of car wants it wiped out. What were they trying to hide?

if you ever find the answer to that question let me no, all the bits he took off though ended up on ebay a few days later anyway as we were thinking of buying the bonnet, a sentimental reason is the most likely thing i can think of to be honest, as i no of quite a few occasions where a car is picked up for scrap and been given strict orders not to put it back on the road due to sentimental reasons, mk2 granada estate and vw beetle come to mind, the beetle was as rotten as anything but it was the cleanest granada ive ever seen, a mate of mine bought it just before it went over the wiegh bridge of a scrap yard, owner said the engine was knackered and it wasnt to go back on the road for reasons about his passed away father, got car back to the yard and it fired up 1st time, so might be case with xk150.
The jag has been raced, whats done is done, car WILL be goin out again in october, and if it survives that, it goes out somewhere else, either way, what ever happens, ive already got 2 people interested in buying the whole remains and more than 5 people wantin to buy the engine and box, so alot of it lives on anyway not a complete waste

[RetroCosworth]

MGB Boy said:

I saw a not bangered one at a classic car show today and it was beautiful, Shame many of the parts that make it so ie wings from yours will be needlessly destroyed.

However, it's justified because it isn't a Mk2 Mondeo

After all, as he said a car is just metal so he wouldn't have a fecking clue if it was rare.

Edited by RetroCosworth on Sunday 11th July 17:55

[bigblock]

a8hex said:

I'm not doubting you but I completely fail to understand this.
It's tin worm that kills XKs.
All the panels on this one were good. They invariably go before the chassis.
So I would have thought we are talking about somewhere in the region of £15->20 grands worth of car when your mates first saw it.

I can not think for a legitimate reason why someone with 20grands worth of car wants it wiped out. What were they trying to hide?

Assuming that the current owner did not recieve the registration document with the XK and he has already said it does'nt have a VIN plate, then I imagine that the chassis number has been used to create a more valuable 'period' Jaguar XK or a derivative. Hence the reason the original had to disappear.

Edited by bigblock on Sunday 11th July 18:21

[plonker751]

RetroCosworth said:

MGB Boy said:

I saw a not bangered one at a classic car show today and it was beautiful, Shame many of the parts that make it so ie wings from yours will be needlessly destroyed.

However, it's justified because it isn't a Mk2 Mondeo

After all, as he said a car is just metal so he wouldn't have a fecking clue if it was rare.

Edited by RetroCosworth on Sunday 11th July 17:55

For your information i do have a clue on whats rare or not, the jag was rare, i new that, so was the 1928 dodge standard 8 a few years ago, all the mk1 and mk2 granadas that race are rare, xj6's, rover p5's, p4's, toyota crowns etc etc just i like to see a rare car on the banger track every now and then, from all your posts and comments ive been able to 'sum you up' and you seem jealous, you didnt like the idea of the car being bought by banger drivers, so instead of doing what alot of the other people on this forum are doing, which is come to facts with the idea and give me support, your just bhing and moaning about it. At first it didnt bother me too much, as i knew alot of people were going to be abit hacked off with me, but your now resorting to insulting my intelligence etc..... childish in my opinion mate.

[MGB Boy]

I don't have a problem with you (hope I'm not coming across like that) you seem like a decent bloke with 'misguided' vehicle choices for the circumstances.
I can only hope in future you wont be using any more classics?

[a8hex]

bigblock said:

a8hex said:

I'm not doubting you but I completely fail to understand this.
It's tin worm that kills XKs.
All the panels on this one were good. They invariably go before the chassis.
So I would have thought we are talking about somewhere in the region of £15->20 grands worth of car when your mates first saw it.

I can not think for a legitimate reason why someone with 20grands worth of car wants it wiped out. What were they trying to hide?

Assuming that the current owner did not recieve the registration document with the XK and he has already said it does'nt have a VIN plate, then I imagine that the chassis number has been used to create a more valuable 'period' Jaguar XK or a derivative. Hence the reason the original had to disappear.

Edited by bigblock on Sunday 11th July 18:21

I thought of this as a possibility. But to my mind it doesn't compute, or almost doesn't and I don't like the option that does.
If you are building a modern replica and need an historic identity, such as Lowdrag's C-Type, I can't imagine you'd take one from a car with that sort of value. There are plenty of XK140/150 FHCs which really are beyond economic repair be even the most ardent of DIY mechanics. You can buy a rescuable one for 5->6K if you like replacing panels. The description of this car seems much better than that. I presume for this purpose any old Jaguar would do.
So this option doesn't make sense to me.

A more valuable XK150 would be almost any other XK150, expect a 3.4FHC, but cutting a FHC to a DHC wouldn't add enough value, the chassis plate would still be a FHC and converted cars are a lot cheaper than original ones. Besides you'd still need the DHC, this might have made a good basis for such a project.

From an economic stand point the only thing that makes sense (the concept I don't like to think about) was than you had a stolen good condition XK150FHC and wanted to swap the identity to a barn find one. Now I'm not suggesting this is what had happened and I'm certainly not suggesting that Plonker has anything to do with anything like this, but from a "money" point of view I can't think of any other reason why you'd want to chuck away that much money.

Plonkers suggestion of an emotional tie is more likely. Either that or vengeance, perhaps there was money owing somewhere in it's history and someone was seeking revenge. I don't know. A year or ago an XK emerged in the US which had been cut into pieces and buried by an irate father who had told his son not to do something and the lad had gone ahead and done it anyway. So his dad hacked up and buried the lads car.

All I know is I doubt I'm ever likely to be a position I could afford to throw 20grand away like that.


Plonker, thank you for being honest with the group here.
I would appreciate any information you can give me about the car. There are a number of people I know around the world that are attempting to trace the history of all the XKs. There are a surprising number still with us. It is also quite common for the XK club to be contacted by ex owners or often their now grown up kids, trying to locate information on XKs that they used to own or they remember their parents have when they were young.
I know you haven't seen the ID plate but there are numbers on the chassis, the body, the engine and the gearbox. All/any of these would help people to know something about the car.
Thanks
Ken

[plonker751]

MGB Boy said:

I don't have a problem with you (hope I'm not coming across like that) you seem like a decent bloke with 'misguided' vehicle choices for the circumstances.
I can only hope in future you wont be using any more classics?

sorry mate, last comment wasnt directed at you, was talking to retro cosworth, hope i aint caused any offence mate, cant say that im not going to be using any more classics though, as ive got another one lined up, but this one really is far past restorable, most likely still get abuse for it though
Cheers

[MGB Boy]

I know it wasn't aimed at me but just wanted to be clear that I don't have a problem with you, Just what your doing