Ultimate lotus?
Discussion
Hi guys,
I want to know what the ultimate performance lotus is for everyday use and regular trackday fun. The car will be used on my daily route of 18 miles over twisty, undulating country roads. I'm looking for awesome handling over these less than perfect surfaces plus massive overtaking ability in the 50 -100mph midrange. I have a budget of 40k to spend on the car and upgrades. What do you suggest? My limited knowledge is from casual chat and magazines, not experience. I'll list the options along with some key points and you can tell me what you think....
1.
Start with a tidy elise MK1. From what I understand this is the lightest lotus by some margin - pretty good start then. It's also the prettiest 'classic' shape too, IMO. The VHPD engine could be dropped in, possibly along with a supercharger? Or maybe the honda conversion (any good?), or just a nice little tweek to see 200bnp NA. I've also seen a few brake upgrades out there - 6 point calipers from Tarox, or AP race brakes. Obviously any race spec goodies would be added too - rose joints, carbon seats, close ratio box, you name it. So is this the ultimate trackday weapon? ....
2.
Buy a tidy exige as a basis. The engine could be tweeked as above too. My concerns with this are - is it too hot? Also, is the ride too hard for my undulating cross country blasts? This option appeals most as it's the most rare sight on our roads. I love that perspex rear end too. The best starting point?
3.
Buy a new elise Mk2 sport 190. Keep the engine standard for warranty. This car can be ordered with ALL the track day options - magnesium wheels, rosejoints, you name it. The advantage here is IT WILL PASS THE MOT! Possibly the only car here that won't be a nightmare to get serviced each year too. The downside is it looks a bit japanese. May look better in black though.
So what do you guys think? I'm most tempted by the the hard top exige so far. I'm all for more power but I don't fancy the inconvenience of an annual engine rebuild. It may well be a pain in the backside to trek halfway up the country to Turbo Technics for a service / rebuild. Doesn't it take TT months to instal this as well? Not ideal. I want useable power without the inconvenience. Also, I need to pass the MOT!! Please advise me on upgrades, handling, reliability options. I'm sure you all have your favorite cars and upgrades.
Thanks in anticipation!
Also, has anyone heard of the honda based upgrades? Check out the two kit options...
www.prototyperacing.com/
www.prototyperacing.com/
Hi
Have you considered a bike engined Lotus 7 variant (Caterham/Westfield)? I'd have thought these would provide more trackday fun than any elise variant, certainly worth looking into.
If I was going to choose from your list of 3 choices and I could afford it, I'd go for the Sport 190 S2.
It'll have even better handling than the S1, with as much power as the Exige. Add all the motorsport options and you'll have a mighty fine -- if expensive -- car (looks good in Black too).
Get this month's Evo magazine for some good suggestions.
I can't believe I've said all that, I own an S1 111S.
Bonce.
Have you considered a bike engined Lotus 7 variant (Caterham/Westfield)? I'd have thought these would provide more trackday fun than any elise variant, certainly worth looking into.
If I was going to choose from your list of 3 choices and I could afford it, I'd go for the Sport 190 S2.
It'll have even better handling than the S1, with as much power as the Exige. Add all the motorsport options and you'll have a mighty fine -- if expensive -- car (looks good in Black too).
Get this month's Evo magazine for some good suggestions.
I can't believe I've said all that, I own an S1 111S.
Bonce.
Thanks for the reply. I love the stats of the meagbird nutters and I'm sure they are the ultimate for trackday fun, but I need it as a daily driver too. Plus I love the exige's looks. A decent leak proof roof, heater and micro boot all add up to being semi practical. Aircon would have been good this week too! Does this option add much weight or reduce performance much?
Well if it's your daily driver, I'd say the Exige or S2 190 are your best bet because being factory developed they're slightly less likely to blow up on track and leave you without a car than a highly modified engine - I don't reckon the K series is really strong enough for 230bhp turbochargers.
For your budget you could get a well specced brand new bike engined car, plus a used but well modified and looked after S1 Elise or Exige for wet use.
As far as using a Lotus every day goes, it's fine. Mine is my only car. The S2 has optional aircon which weighs 15Kg, and if it's switched on won't reduce your performance apart from the weight factor - it switches itself off whenever you use the loud pedal in anger.
Bonce
For your budget you could get a well specced brand new bike engined car, plus a used but well modified and looked after S1 Elise or Exige for wet use.
As far as using a Lotus every day goes, it's fine. Mine is my only car. The S2 has optional aircon which weighs 15Kg, and if it's switched on won't reduce your performance apart from the weight factor - it switches itself off whenever you use the loud pedal in anger.
Bonce
I only want one car due to space on the drive. Girlfriend has new TT for the wet / long trips etc anyway. Did you check out the honda engine swap links? If they get on well with the more extreme S2000 engine (240bhp) it will be fun, and reliable! Wonder if a uk tuner is doing this conversion too. Mind you, it could bugger handling / servicing.
Do you know much about tuned lotus passing the MOT? I've heard the 190 exige won't! Funnily enough the new elise mk2 190 does. It must be down to new engine management. Maybe this unit can be installed in the exige to make it pass the MOT. Any ideas?
>> Edited by tailslider on Tuesday 30th July 12:28
Do you know much about tuned lotus passing the MOT? I've heard the 190 exige won't! Funnily enough the new elise mk2 190 does. It must be down to new engine management. Maybe this unit can be installed in the exige to make it pass the MOT. Any ideas?
>> Edited by tailslider on Tuesday 30th July 12:28
quote:
Do you know much about tuned lotus passing the MOT? I've heard the 190 exige won't! Funnily enough the new elise mk2 190 does. It must be down to new engine management. Maybe this unit can be installed in the exige to make it pass the MOT. Any ideas?
As far as I know the 190 will pass the MOT as the regulations are different compared to the licencing requirements. Hence why the 190 was first shipped at lower power then adjusted in the first service. The only part that could be a problem is sports exhausts and the removal of the Cat. However most garages I would imagine will fit the cat test the car pass the MOT and take it off again when you talk to them. Lotus Garages esp are not going to fail the Exige on a technicality.
smeagol, so any lotus dealer will pass a 190 exige for MOT then. That's reasurring. I always thought the exige was the best option, but this element put me off before.
Does anyone know if there are many race style upgrades missing from the standard exige? I'm thinking of the option parts available on the new elise 2 190. Stuff like magnesium wheels, ap racing brakes, rose joints etc. Are these all standard or options on the exige?
Everyone mentions the elise 2 is better handling. Isn't this just down to new tyres made specifically for the new car, where as the original had to put up with 'hatchback' standard tyres? If so, then this tyre upgrade must make the new elise 2 obsolete. Opinions? Also, I take it the exige handles better than the elise 2???
Does anyone know if there are many race style upgrades missing from the standard exige? I'm thinking of the option parts available on the new elise 2 190. Stuff like magnesium wheels, ap racing brakes, rose joints etc. Are these all standard or options on the exige?
Everyone mentions the elise 2 is better handling. Isn't this just down to new tyres made specifically for the new car, where as the original had to put up with 'hatchback' standard tyres? If so, then this tyre upgrade must make the new elise 2 obsolete. Opinions? Also, I take it the exige handles better than the elise 2???
handling....tricky one! Without getting into a very lengthy debate on what really constitutes handling I will say the following...from real world experience..
The S1 and S2 elise will go around any given smooth surface at about the same pace (we're talking unnoticeble 'real' differences). Down to a certain radius of bend the exige will be faster as it has more power and wider tyres and more actual grip. Below a certain radius I doubt this stays true as the steering lock isn't quite as tight and they understeer the same amount as the elises
An S2 WILL go round a rougher bend faster than an S1...by a noticeable if small amount. The reason...revised set-up of all bits (can go into detail if really necessary...suffice to say it's rather more than just tyres!) The exige will be quick, but comparably 'raw' (read uncomfortable if that sort of thing bothers you).
I wouldnt say it necessarily 'handles' better...thats something rather dependant on personal opinion...in my opinion of course!
cheers
Night
The S1 and S2 elise will go around any given smooth surface at about the same pace (we're talking unnoticeble 'real' differences). Down to a certain radius of bend the exige will be faster as it has more power and wider tyres and more actual grip. Below a certain radius I doubt this stays true as the steering lock isn't quite as tight and they understeer the same amount as the elises
An S2 WILL go round a rougher bend faster than an S1...by a noticeable if small amount. The reason...revised set-up of all bits (can go into detail if really necessary...suffice to say it's rather more than just tyres!) The exige will be quick, but comparably 'raw' (read uncomfortable if that sort of thing bothers you).
I wouldnt say it necessarily 'handles' better...thats something rather dependant on personal opinion...in my opinion of course!
cheers
Night
Get a Sport 190 S2 and have TT add their TT260 supersport supercharger to it which is the one added to the Exige and 340R but since the 190 is a VHPD of the Elise Engine like the Exige it can have that upgrade plus with the right exaust and induction you can get them over 270 bhp like the Exige in this months edition of EVO.
Cant you get six pin calipers on an S2 for road use i thought you could.
Cant you get six pin calipers on an S2 for road use i thought you could.
Cheers for the feedback guys. I've decided to go down the route of the Exige. Everytime I see that menacing race track renegade I just want one. I'll probaby keep the engine in fairly standard trim to maintain decent reliability. I'll look at loosing some weight though, when I get one.
Is there anything worth upgrading on the standard car? Does it come with magnesium wheels? Anything to look out for spec wise? Also, does the aircon work well, or is it just 15kg wasted?
Is there anything worth upgrading on the standard car? Does it come with magnesium wheels? Anything to look out for spec wise? Also, does the aircon work well, or is it just 15kg wasted?
I drove an Exige without aircon on a very hot day last year and although it gets really hot I found that opening a window worked just as well. Being stuck in traffic though would be really really hot. I can see where people would say that you need aircon but IMHO you can survive without it.
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