T350C engine dead
Discussion
RichardD said:
Have a read of:-
www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?t=197311&f=152&h=0
Better book it in now then just in case!!! Thanks for the info btw nick. Mine had overheating problems when i first got it but have done 4000 miles since then and no real problems (touch wood). Think i better get an interest free credit card just in case!!
Sorry to hear about your problems Nick. I guess it is no consolation that it happened so close to home and didn't completely ruin your holiday...
Did you have AA 5 Star or similar recovery? Please tell us your recovery experience? I think the French Autoroutes are covered by their own recovery vehicles? How long did they take?
I hope the car gets fixed up asap.
P.S. What colour is your car? I nearly bought an ex Racing Green demo.
Did you have AA 5 Star or similar recovery? Please tell us your recovery experience? I think the French Autoroutes are covered by their own recovery vehicles? How long did they take?
I hope the car gets fixed up asap.
P.S. What colour is your car? I nearly bought an ex Racing Green demo.
NickT said:
Just phoned up DM, It would seem like TVR take quite some time rebuilding engines! I've been told it could be 8 - 12 weeks! The engine gets sent out to them sometime next week (TVR don't have a spot before this).
And they also said again that the first £2k would be covered by the insurance / warranty and anything over this will be payable by me.
As mentioned before, did they supply the car? As a dealer the above stance would be my starting point.
The car is Chameleon Green, a very early example of a T350c (registered Jan 2003). It was purchased by me through Dream Machines as a second hand car 2 months ago.
My recovery experience was not great to be honest. I opted for a cheap European break down cover through a company called "First Call GB Ltd". This may have been a mistake! Below is my experience of the breakdown, a bit long so I warn you now!
*** Breakdown Recovery Story ****
I broke down on the French motorway 20km from the Calais car ferry port. A phone call to the breakdown company was not too helpful and they didn’t explain much to me, they said I would have to contact the French police or something and get the car towed off before they could do anything. While on the phone the French motorway guys turned up, I guess they saw on a camera or someone reported it to them, who knows? They coned the car off and said to me in French (I don't speak French) that a tow truck would be along soon. Sure enough a tow truck arrived and asked me where I would like to be taken. Not sure what to tell them I phoned the breakdown cover people again and they said tell them to take me where ever I wanted. As I was only 20km from the port I opted to be taken back there. I was aware that there would be a charge for collection (from the guys who coned of my car) which I was liable for (fair enough) but I was not made aware by the tow truck driver or the breakdown cover (I would have expected them to know the procedure) that I had to also pay for each kilometre I was towed for. The bill ended up being 260 euros.
After reaching the port I phoned the breakdown company again asking what should we do now. They firstly told me that they wouldn’t cover the cost of the flatbed to Calais and then said that if the guy didn’t take me on the ferry that they would have to call another local breakdown recovery company out to town me from passport control to the ferry terminal and this would be all the cover I would get (no recovery from Dover!) as I am only allowed one call out per fault!? Luckily we persuaded the guy to tow us all the way to a random empty lane for queuing to get onto the ferry. We had to use our own return ferry ticket which was meant to be used 11 days later to get on the next return ferry. Again the European breakdown cover didn’t cover ferry costs. We had to push the car onto the Ferry as the French port guys couldn’t figure out a way of towing it. Luckily it was mainly down hill so no dramas there. As we wanted to continue on our holiday (we were on day 1 of 11 and were due to meet friends in Germany and then family in Italy) we had to then book another return ferry crossing to go back the next morning and return on the original return crossing (more money).
After much arguing on the phone with the breakdown company they said they would cover “some” of the French part of the recovery, we are yet to find out how much. We then arranged for recovery from Dover, but they couldn’t recover the car to the garage and then us home with our luggage, we all had to be dropped at the same place. So as the car needed to go there we got dropped at Dream Machines. The breakdown company refused to organise or even pay for a hire car for me so I attempted to get one myself, unfortunately the hire car companies in Dover I had time to phone had no cars available so we had no option other than to go with the car to Dream Machines. From there we managed to get a lift from my brother who luckily lives a lot closer to Dream Machines than I do (I am in Cambridge, DM is 100 miles or so away from me in Sussex!). After getting a lift with my brother I then borrowed my Mum’s car to drive up to Cambridge to collect my Leon and then drove back down to Sussex to drop my Mum’s car off and then pack up the Leon for the journey. Just enough time from then to get an hour sleep before leaving for the 3am ferry we booked to get back on our holiday.
So after thinking I was saving the breakdown company money by not wanting a hire car or asking for accommodation or anything I got practically nothing in return. The UK side of the breakdown (Dover to Sussex) was covered the same under my free AA cover I get with my bank as well as the breakdown cover which comes with the warranty.
Basically I may as well not have bothered! My friend who has the exact same policy as me broke down the weekend before at the Nurburgring got his car ferried back to his house in England the following week not a problem, without paying a penny. Why I couldn’t get the same service I don’t know. The worst thing was the only suggestion I got from them through the whole experience was to get public transport home from Dover back to Cambridge…. Yeah great, with 11 days worth of holiday luggage and a load of tools etc. for a trip to the Nurburgring, great!
Lesson learnt… get yourself RAC or AA (who don’t cover the Nurburgring) as I am sure they would be far more helpful!
My recovery experience was not great to be honest. I opted for a cheap European break down cover through a company called "First Call GB Ltd". This may have been a mistake! Below is my experience of the breakdown, a bit long so I warn you now!
*** Breakdown Recovery Story ****
I broke down on the French motorway 20km from the Calais car ferry port. A phone call to the breakdown company was not too helpful and they didn’t explain much to me, they said I would have to contact the French police or something and get the car towed off before they could do anything. While on the phone the French motorway guys turned up, I guess they saw on a camera or someone reported it to them, who knows? They coned the car off and said to me in French (I don't speak French) that a tow truck would be along soon. Sure enough a tow truck arrived and asked me where I would like to be taken. Not sure what to tell them I phoned the breakdown cover people again and they said tell them to take me where ever I wanted. As I was only 20km from the port I opted to be taken back there. I was aware that there would be a charge for collection (from the guys who coned of my car) which I was liable for (fair enough) but I was not made aware by the tow truck driver or the breakdown cover (I would have expected them to know the procedure) that I had to also pay for each kilometre I was towed for. The bill ended up being 260 euros.
After reaching the port I phoned the breakdown company again asking what should we do now. They firstly told me that they wouldn’t cover the cost of the flatbed to Calais and then said that if the guy didn’t take me on the ferry that they would have to call another local breakdown recovery company out to town me from passport control to the ferry terminal and this would be all the cover I would get (no recovery from Dover!) as I am only allowed one call out per fault!? Luckily we persuaded the guy to tow us all the way to a random empty lane for queuing to get onto the ferry. We had to use our own return ferry ticket which was meant to be used 11 days later to get on the next return ferry. Again the European breakdown cover didn’t cover ferry costs. We had to push the car onto the Ferry as the French port guys couldn’t figure out a way of towing it. Luckily it was mainly down hill so no dramas there. As we wanted to continue on our holiday (we were on day 1 of 11 and were due to meet friends in Germany and then family in Italy) we had to then book another return ferry crossing to go back the next morning and return on the original return crossing (more money).
After much arguing on the phone with the breakdown company they said they would cover “some” of the French part of the recovery, we are yet to find out how much. We then arranged for recovery from Dover, but they couldn’t recover the car to the garage and then us home with our luggage, we all had to be dropped at the same place. So as the car needed to go there we got dropped at Dream Machines. The breakdown company refused to organise or even pay for a hire car for me so I attempted to get one myself, unfortunately the hire car companies in Dover I had time to phone had no cars available so we had no option other than to go with the car to Dream Machines. From there we managed to get a lift from my brother who luckily lives a lot closer to Dream Machines than I do (I am in Cambridge, DM is 100 miles or so away from me in Sussex!). After getting a lift with my brother I then borrowed my Mum’s car to drive up to Cambridge to collect my Leon and then drove back down to Sussex to drop my Mum’s car off and then pack up the Leon for the journey. Just enough time from then to get an hour sleep before leaving for the 3am ferry we booked to get back on our holiday.
So after thinking I was saving the breakdown company money by not wanting a hire car or asking for accommodation or anything I got practically nothing in return. The UK side of the breakdown (Dover to Sussex) was covered the same under my free AA cover I get with my bank as well as the breakdown cover which comes with the warranty.
Basically I may as well not have bothered! My friend who has the exact same policy as me broke down the weekend before at the Nurburgring got his car ferried back to his house in England the following week not a problem, without paying a penny. Why I couldn’t get the same service I don’t know. The worst thing was the only suggestion I got from them through the whole experience was to get public transport home from Dover back to Cambridge…. Yeah great, with 11 days worth of holiday luggage and a load of tools etc. for a trip to the Nurburgring, great!
Lesson learnt… get yourself RAC or AA (who don’t cover the Nurburgring) as I am sure they would be far more helpful!
Despite all the problems and hassle from the breakdown company I still would like to add I had a fantastic holiday and didn't let this set back ruin it for me.
The Nurburgring is an amazing place like none other no matter what car you have there. Luckily the Leon is also fun on track so I managed to still get in some decent laps and enjoyed the 3000 miles in more comfort than I would have been in the TVR
The Nurburgring is an amazing place like none other no matter what car you have there. Luckily the Leon is also fun on track so I managed to still get in some decent laps and enjoyed the 3000 miles in more comfort than I would have been in the TVR
You had taken this car back for the symptoms of over heating? And it is believed that the cause of the expiry of your engine was down to overheating?
From a warranty point of view you will need to look at when you gave the dealer notice of there being a problem with the cooling system. Look at when you first brought it to their attention and the corrective action they too to solve the issue.
If it proven that you gave them notice of a possible overheating problem with in 30 days of the purchase of the car, and they told you that they had fixed the problem then you my friend have a claim for the whole rebuild.
In simple terms, you asked then to fix a problem within 30 days of purchase. To your knowledge it was done, but in fact it was not. The original problem still existed and caused the engine to seize.
If you wanted to you could take this to Court.
From a warranty point of view you will need to look at when you gave the dealer notice of there being a problem with the cooling system. Look at when you first brought it to their attention and the corrective action they too to solve the issue.
If it proven that you gave them notice of a possible overheating problem with in 30 days of the purchase of the car, and they told you that they had fixed the problem then you my friend have a claim for the whole rebuild.
In simple terms, you asked then to fix a problem within 30 days of purchase. To your knowledge it was done, but in fact it was not. The original problem still existed and caused the engine to seize.
If you wanted to you could take this to Court.
Well time will tell, I trust the guys at Dream Machines to do everything they possibly can to sort the car out for me. They have always done their best to help me from test driving half the cars in their showroom to finding me a lovely T350c at a great price and preparing it exceptionally. Ben has especially always gone out of his way to help. If only my SEAT dealer was like this when I got the Leon, but that is for somewhere else...
The cost of the rebuild will not be known until TVR actually look at the engine and they may not get a chance to do so for a couple of months. It is unfortunate but it isn't worth getting upset or angry over these things, worst things could have happened. At least it gives me time to try and find the money, finishing the bathroom may have to wait another year
On the plus side I should end up with a decent 2005 spec "new" engine which I will have run in from new. It will have the modified parts which will hopefully make it more reliable and it will come with a full TVR 1 year warranty which will give me the piece of mind I need. I'm also guessing I wont need a service for another 6k miles where as I would be due a service in a month or so had I completely my holiday in the TVR.
These things happen. I'll do my best to be able to afford the rebuild and keep the car. Hopefully I will have many years of happy TVR ownership after this "minor" setback.
Thanks guys for all of your condolences and suggestions they are much appreciated.
The cost of the rebuild will not be known until TVR actually look at the engine and they may not get a chance to do so for a couple of months. It is unfortunate but it isn't worth getting upset or angry over these things, worst things could have happened. At least it gives me time to try and find the money, finishing the bathroom may have to wait another year
On the plus side I should end up with a decent 2005 spec "new" engine which I will have run in from new. It will have the modified parts which will hopefully make it more reliable and it will come with a full TVR 1 year warranty which will give me the piece of mind I need. I'm also guessing I wont need a service for another 6k miles where as I would be due a service in a month or so had I completely my holiday in the TVR.
These things happen. I'll do my best to be able to afford the rebuild and keep the car. Hopefully I will have many years of happy TVR ownership after this "minor" setback.
Thanks guys for all of your condolences and suggestions they are much appreciated.
Nick - you are probably aware already, but you will need to get a 1k service undertaken once you have completed this mileage on the rebuilt engine. The running in procedure is currently well documented on the Tuscan forum and I am about to receive my engine/car back to commence this process.
Sorry to hear about this Nick, I guess its something all of us fear and may have to go through at some point during our ownership, very bad luck having it happen when you have just bought the car though 
I really do hope that your car is sorted quickly and with minimum fuss, and hopefully this will be your only 'blip' (albeit a huge one!) during ownership, not the best way to start though!
I wonder if your overheating problem proved to be worse than first thought, like warping something!
I really do hope that your car is sorted quickly and with minimum fuss, and hopefully this will be your only 'blip' (albeit a huge one!) during ownership, not the best way to start though!
I wonder if your overheating problem proved to be worse than first thought, like warping something!
Mustang Baz said:
Nick - you are probably aware already, but you will need to get a 1k service undertaken once you have completed this mileage on the rebuilt engine. The running in procedure is currently well documented on the Tuscan forum and I am about to receive my engine/car back to commence this process.
Remember they only change the oil/filter and adjust the tappets at the 1k service. If it’s due a 6k service I would get this done at the same time. Apart from saving on the price of oil (that’s the only thing you need to pay for on the 1k service) other items on the car will still need to be serviced/checked (wheels, gearbox, exhaust, PAS, Clutch/break fluid etc etc).
You might find it worthwhile to obtain further consumer advice over this matter. The Saturday Telegraph Motoring correspondent HonestJohn has a website www.honestjohn.co.uk and I suggest you read FAQ no 6. As far as I understand it this does not just apply to new cars.
Having made the (very long) trip from SA to the factory in Blackpool I was astonished to find a very bland and indifferent introduction to the facilities from the TVR representative on the day I was there (3 weeks ago). I have to be honest and say that the blokes who design TVR's seem to be the only people there that embody the "mystique", as the everyday employee as far as I'm concerned has about as much enthusiasm as a Blackpool Bus Conductor. Having travelled 6000 miles and being 1 of only three T350C drivers in SA (and to date TVR ambassadaeur) you would think they might put on a bit of an effort - not so I'm afraid. As far as I'm concerned Lee Noble & crew have the edge currently, the car is far more professional, performs better and more reliable, with far more enthusiasm for what the car stands for. TVR - warning - sort yourselves out or face the consequences of losing loyal customers due to your indifference and frankly CRAP build quality and lousy engine reliability.
Thats disgusting! You travelled 6000miles for what?
Is this why at least a dozen TVR owners from these very forums have gone over to the Noble world????
Noble must be having a field day with owners that were or could have been TVR owners... sad... very sad.... I knew things werent going to be good if the russian bought tvr... only time will tell... and it doesnt look good at all
Is this why at least a dozen TVR owners from these very forums have gone over to the Noble world????
Noble must be having a field day with owners that were or could have been TVR owners... sad... very sad.... I knew things werent going to be good if the russian bought tvr... only time will tell... and it doesnt look good at all
I have to say that I almost bought a 2003 Noble before I decided on the Tusc. The 2 things that swung me to the Tusc was the M12's complete lack of practicality. And the bland and spartan interior. IMO, it really is just a track day tool.
However the plus side....The performance and handling was just amazing with virtually no turbo lag at all. If they could eek a few more horses out the Ford 3 litre it would be even better.
I have to agree tho, TVR need to sort a number of factory based issues if they wish to sell their goods to a greater customer fold.
However the plus side....The performance and handling was just amazing with virtually no turbo lag at all. If they could eek a few more horses out the Ford 3 litre it would be even better.
I have to agree tho, TVR need to sort a number of factory based issues if they wish to sell their goods to a greater customer fold.
Tvr employee admits that TVR s6 had a problem?
Can't really believe this poster is a REAL employee at the London TVR place, would any employee really be so naive, to on the face of it admit problems (hence liability?) on a public forum..
If this is reall might help your case.
FROM the General TVR forum, -= TVR London CLosing Down Sale
Another thing to ask, as lots of the bill is labour, ask WHAT labour rate is being used, (at the dealer) the rate they get paid by the factory or the their labour rate to the public.. I don't see why they should make a profit out of you on a warranty claim.?
Ie difference between £25-30 per hour, and £60-70 + per hour.
Their is nice and 'nice' afteall, everyone is nice when they are making a profit.
B
B
>> Edited by bjwoods on Thursday 11th August 10:29
Can't really believe this poster is a REAL employee at the London TVR place, would any employee really be so naive, to on the face of it admit problems (hence liability?) on a public forum..
If this is reall might help your case.
FROM the General TVR forum, -= TVR London CLosing Down Sale
tvr1 said:
Im still here!!!
Watching and reading.
as for my profile, I have been pondering something more interesting than just a pic and an email address but havn't quite got around to it as i have had other things to keep busy with over the last few weeks.
as for my posts..mmmmmm....yes they do seem to have gone-answers on a postcard how that happened please?
And also....'reliable sources' and 'knowing someone who knows someone who has told me'.....doesn't always mean that they have the FULL picture. 2 plus 2 doesn't equal 5. at the risk of sounding too biased I will also point out that most of you have never met N.S (Bosscerbera aside-Hi Phill) and it doesnt matter one way or another what you or I think of him personaly...the truth is that he and his funding have saved TVR yes,SAVED! for all you romantic day dreamers out there PW was in it for the MONEY.Now before you all howl in protest, that was not a criticism,he was a business man and knew that TVR needed fresh blood and financing to survive, something that he was either unable or unwilling to provide. Has any one noticed that very few of the threads on here are discussing problems with cars post PW? don'forget that the Sagaris was going to be PW's last car launched...and I bet that if you put your clear headed hat on, all of you are thankfull that didnt happen.....a lot of you are so happy to moan and groan about NS this and NS that, but he didnt buy sub standard parts from the sub-continent and when things started going bang suggest that 'well what do you expect-its a racing engine' Take those Rose coloured glasses off guys....TVR now makes more reliable ,fun,better developed cars than it has done in it's history...and that is only going to continue...try and think of something constructive to say guys. I don't think some of you grasp the idea that there are many people out there who are considering buying a TVR for the first time as they have heard of all the improvements in build,warranty etc...and foolishly they log onto pisstonheads to get un-biased information! Now I do know that not everyone is negative but come on-try and be a little bit objective, you are putting off people who may well be the the future base of TVR customers.
Responses eagerly anticipated!
Ed
Another thing to ask, as lots of the bill is labour, ask WHAT labour rate is being used, (at the dealer) the rate they get paid by the factory or the their labour rate to the public.. I don't see why they should make a profit out of you on a warranty claim.?
Ie difference between £25-30 per hour, and £60-70 + per hour.
Their is nice and 'nice' afteall, everyone is nice when they are making a profit.
B
B
>> Edited by bjwoods on Thursday 11th August 10:29
Hi NickT
Just reread you original post, And was shocked to see that the car is 2 years old, 14 k miles and you've bought from a main dealer only 2 months ago.
IS THIS the case that the warranty only cover £2k?????
THIS is AWFUL. I can't think of any other manufacturers main dealer warranty that would leave you in this postion, that has so little confidence in their own product...
So it's third party,,,--- does this mean TVR don't back warranties on used cars with such low mileage/age???
Do third party warranty companies have so little faith, that it only goes up to £2k...
Remember you BUY from a MAIN DEALER for the protection you 'supposedly' get...
WHAT is the point of buying used from a main delaer if this applies across all of them?
I CAN guarantee you the difference between buying privately/delaer is substantially more than £2k, so just put 2k aside, buy it privately, probably still more than the trade in price the previous owner got.
I am 'really' impressed by your mellowness here, I would be REALLY demanding better treatment.. NO make that expecting better treatment.
I doubt that a courtesy car (free) has been mentioned?
B
>> Edited by bjwoods on Thursday 11th August 11:44
Just reread you original post, And was shocked to see that the car is 2 years old, 14 k miles and you've bought from a main dealer only 2 months ago.
IS THIS the case that the warranty only cover £2k?????
THIS is AWFUL. I can't think of any other manufacturers main dealer warranty that would leave you in this postion, that has so little confidence in their own product...
So it's third party,,,--- does this mean TVR don't back warranties on used cars with such low mileage/age???
Do third party warranty companies have so little faith, that it only goes up to £2k...
Remember you BUY from a MAIN DEALER for the protection you 'supposedly' get...
WHAT is the point of buying used from a main delaer if this applies across all of them?
I CAN guarantee you the difference between buying privately/delaer is substantially more than £2k, so just put 2k aside, buy it privately, probably still more than the trade in price the previous owner got.
I am 'really' impressed by your mellowness here, I would be REALLY demanding better treatment.. NO make that expecting better treatment.
I doubt that a courtesy car (free) has been mentioned?
B
>> Edited by bjwoods on Thursday 11th August 11:44
gazzab said:
Since buying the car I have always warmed it up to 60 degrees before going past 3k rpm
You should use oil pressure rather than water temp to decide on when to start revving.
You should use oil temperature when the feature is availble and I think thats the temperature Nick was quoting. (The car has an oil temp gauge)
Yeah, it was oil temp I was talking about. I hadn't reached the point of knowing what the oil pressure should be, I will have to look into that when I get it back. I'll end up looking at the display more than the road soon!!
Will have to start looking into the running in procedure for the Speed Six engine as well. Quite excited about having a practically new engine all to myself I had my Leon from knew and I always felt safe in the knowledge that I know exactly how the engine has been treated since the first mile up until now.
Will have to start looking into the running in procedure for the Speed Six engine as well. Quite excited about having a practically new engine all to myself
I had my Leon from knew and I always felt safe in the knowledge that I know exactly how the engine has been treated since the first mile up until now.Gassing Station | Speed Six Engine | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff