Another one! Tap, tap, clack clack !!!
Discussion
Justin
Looks like you might well get away with the 'ball of string method' - actually nylon washing line inserted thru the spark plug hole when both values are closed near TDC.. allowing you to compress the srping & release collets..
Check value for free action in guide (don't drop it) as you will need to lower piston.
If all looks good also throughly check all others for wear & tear..
Oil change & flush & then fresh oil & filter again after flush.. to be safe.
Looks like you might well get away with the 'ball of string method' - actually nylon washing line inserted thru the spark plug hole when both values are closed near TDC.. allowing you to compress the srping & release collets..
Check value for free action in guide (don't drop it) as you will need to lower piston.
If all looks good also throughly check all others for wear & tear..
Oil change & flush & then fresh oil & filter again after flush.. to be safe.
Top man.
its about time the so called myth on these "exotic" engines was exposed. An engine is an engine I have always said as much.
the collet and retainer destruction certainly tells a story? over revved? seized valve in guide? poor or faulty retainer a combination of all 3
Bottom line is that the repairs are not insurmountable by anyone with a modicuum of engine building knowledge. The only real problem is the manufacturer not supplying the bits and making it as difficult as possible for an owner toself rectify a problem which was in built by the factory due to poor development of the product prior to sale in the first place.
Dont get me wrong. I don't mind this but I do mind a cover up and failure to assist owners by selling them required parts.
Wouldn't it be great if someone fully strips a new engine and engineers small batches of pattern parts to sell directly??
neil.
The bits are also not that exotic are they.
be interesting to get a matalurgist report on the guide material, work out the coefficient of expansion and then compare it with the running guide to valve clearance???
its about time the so called myth on these "exotic" engines was exposed. An engine is an engine I have always said as much.
the collet and retainer destruction certainly tells a story? over revved? seized valve in guide? poor or faulty retainer a combination of all 3
Bottom line is that the repairs are not insurmountable by anyone with a modicuum of engine building knowledge. The only real problem is the manufacturer not supplying the bits and making it as difficult as possible for an owner toself rectify a problem which was in built by the factory due to poor development of the product prior to sale in the first place.
Dont get me wrong. I don't mind this but I do mind a cover up and failure to assist owners by selling them required parts.
Wouldn't it be great if someone fully strips a new engine and engineers small batches of pattern parts to sell directly??
neil.
The bits are also not that exotic are they.
be interesting to get a matalurgist report on the guide material, work out the coefficient of expansion and then compare it with the running guide to valve clearance???
chris watton said:
Justin,
Very sorry to hear about your troubles, you serviced by a dealer and it had no securing pins on the airbox! Hard to bite ones tongue sometimes, isn't it?
Your post is very well written/informative and I respect fully what you are about to do, please keep us informed on how you get on, I'm sure there are a lot on here who would be intersted, and also why we have to fork out £5K per rebuild, that was pill too bitter for you to take, and a lot of others too (me included if it ever happens)
>> Edited by chris watton on Friday 2nd September 12:10
One of my clips pinged off once when I was fiddling, it went somewhere down near the radiator. I couldnt find it. Meanwhile the airbox has remained tightly closed for the past 6k miles...
Good luck with the repair, we're all watching with baited breath. Let us know if you find the torque clearance data (or sell it
). T/.
>> Edited by targarama on Friday 2nd September 14:19
rev-erend said:
I've just checked out :
<a href="www.tvrgear.com/">www.tvrgear.com/</a>
Serious stuff.. even engine parts
Its one thing listing the parts, it a totally different ballgame getting hold of them...
Justin, YHM mate, good luck
Mr F
Ok Ill post it here, there is a conical (spl) filter in the Oil tank that is built to pick up debries from engine swarf and the like. This gets cleaned out at the 1000 mile service, as the engine is put together with sealer, not gaskets. Its a cone shaped thing, so you might be lucky and find and bits in there... Have a look, you will need to take the oil tank out, so drain some oil off, clamp the hoses in and out, and then remove the tank. The tank should just slide out, they are not bolted in...
Good luck Justin
Mr F
>> Edited by Mr Freefall on Friday 2nd September 15:34
targarama said:
One of my clips pinged off once when I was fiddling, it went somewhere down near the radiator. I couldnt find it. Meanwhile the airbox has remained tightly closed for the past 6k miles...
Out of interest, if the clips and latches are removed, is there anything else that needs taking off before the black plasic cover can be removed? Could you change the air filter yourself without much hassle?
>> Edited by chris watton on Friday 2nd September 17:58
There’s nothing much needed to remove the filter, there are 3 catches, two on the outside (one in my case), and one down the centre middle back, that is easy reached with you right arm under the LH side of the car. You need to pop off the wiper "yokes" (they just pop-off the ball joints and press on after), to move it out easy. The base adjusts on the LH front if required too!
Now your on the subject here’s my filter (same as everyone else’s) its supposedly done less than 1000 miles.
Serviced last month :-(
Now your on the subject here’s my filter (same as everyone else’s) its supposedly done less than 1000 miles.
Serviced last month :-(
Registering the name and creating the site wont take long. The time consuming bit will be collecting and formatting all the info.
I hope to have something (all be it rough with little info) by next week and hopefully it will grow from there.
I think it can only be good for owners and residuals if the fear surrounding the speed six is removed.
People will worry less about buying into TVR ownership if the cost of repairs is less prohibitive.
Well done Justin!!
I hope to have something (all be it rough with little info) by next week and hopefully it will grow from there.
I think it can only be good for owners and residuals if the fear surrounding the speed six is removed.
People will worry less about buying into TVR ownership if the cost of repairs is less prohibitive.
Well done Justin!!
This is a great thread...I can't help but thinking that we are slowing moving the S6 cars towards the 'enthusiast' space that RV8 TVR owners always refer to when we S6 owners have problems.
I for one wouldn't fancy being the first to tackle an S6 rebuild, but with a website/guide/thread or two to help me, then I just might do that.
Well done Justin.
I for one wouldn't fancy being the first to tackle an S6 rebuild, but with a website/guide/thread or two to help me, then I just might do that.
Well done Justin.
UpTheIron said:
This is a great thread...I can't help but thinking that we are slowing moving the S6 cars towards the 'enthusiast' space that RV8 TVR owners always refer to when we S6 owners have problems.
I for one wouldn't fancy being the first to tackle an S6 rebuild, but with a website/guide/thread or two to help me, then I just might do that.
Well done Justin.
Agreed, its so nice having a thread thats turning an initial negative into a positive for us S6 owners, with very useful info. I think the sooner the 'magical veil of mystery' surrounding the S6 is lifted, the easier most S6 (and potential S6) owners will feel. I'm the type that always loved looking through a Haynes manual for my cars, so I know everything about them!
How long will it be I wonder 'till TVR releases some technical information to make this sort of home maintenance a bit easier?
Some sort of workshop manual would be a godsend, even if the majority of owners just kept it to see what their dealers / servicers should be doing to their P&J's.
I really don't see how the more technically minded - that 'have a go' themselves - could make any more of a hash of it than some of the {ahem} less conscientious (sp?) dealers?
If someone gets 'stuck-in' and it all goes tits-up, then the dealer will make a killing anyway....BUT if it doesn't go wrong........
I realise the downsides to this (gaps in service history, potential resale values, et al), but it seems that there are too many enthusiast owners (who know what to look for) to make a huge difference.......I know who I'd rather buy from - it's not that hard to spot a well looked after car, and I've known too many people who got shafted at 'reputable' dealers (not just TVR) to worry about the occasional missing stamp in the 'book.
Who knows, it might even make Tiv ownership a bit more interesting, with more pride of ownership than is currently the case?
Some sort of workshop manual would be a godsend, even if the majority of owners just kept it to see what their dealers / servicers should be doing to their P&J's.
I really don't see how the more technically minded - that 'have a go' themselves - could make any more of a hash of it than some of the {ahem} less conscientious (sp?) dealers?
If someone gets 'stuck-in' and it all goes tits-up, then the dealer will make a killing anyway....BUT if it doesn't go wrong........
I realise the downsides to this (gaps in service history, potential resale values, et al), but it seems that there are too many enthusiast owners (who know what to look for) to make a huge difference.......I know who I'd rather buy from - it's not that hard to spot a well looked after car, and I've known too many people who got shafted at 'reputable' dealers (not just TVR) to worry about the occasional missing stamp in the 'book.
Who knows, it might even make Tiv ownership a bit more interesting, with more pride of ownership than is currently the case?
Good luck Justin and good on yer.
As for poor servicing there is no excuse. Stamps in a service book look nice but they are only as good as the bloke who did the work [or not]. I've been flamed for this opinion before but don't give a toss, IT'S OUR MONEY and OUR CAR.
[sorry to drift off a bit]
As for poor servicing there is no excuse. Stamps in a service book look nice but they are only as good as the bloke who did the work [or not]. I've been flamed for this opinion before but don't give a toss, IT'S OUR MONEY and OUR CAR.
[sorry to drift off a bit]
macdeb said:
Good luck Justin and good on yer.
As for poor servicing there is no excuse. Stamps in a service book look nice but they are only as good as the bloke who did the work [or not]. I've been flamed for this opinion before but don't give a toss, IT'S OUR MONEY and OUR CAR.
[sorry to drift off a bit]
LOL, I can relate to that! (and so can the people who sent me emails going through the same!, ie ripped off for work that was at best shoddy, and worst not done at all, but billed for it anyway!)
At the very least, you know you can trust yourself to look after your P&J that you paid for!
For balance, there are quite a few dealers I wouldnt hesitate to try!
Waits for the metaphorical ‘protectorate of the poor downtrodden dealers’ to swoop down, telling me that’s an unfair comment!
macdeb said:
Good luck Justin and good on yer.
As for poor servicing there is no excuse. Stamps in a service book look nice but they are only as good as the bloke who did the work [or not]. I've been flamed for this opinion before but don't give a toss, IT'S OUR MONEY and OUR CAR.
[sorry to drift off a bit]
I agree. Unfortunately a lot of the stories that have come out from rebuilds at the factory and services at main dealers mean that the 'Full dealer service history' which would be invaluable for a BMW or Merc is maybe not worth that much any more.
With a BMW you have the knowledge that even if you are buying second hand from a 5 year old car if the service schedule has been performed correctly you are seriously limiting the potential of needing expensive work.
With a Tuscan even if you have had your car serviced at main dealers there is still no guarantee. Moreover it will probably still need an expensive rebuild at one time. If the car has been rebuild by the factory, there is every chance that it will need it again.
Thus I really feel that TVR has shot themselves in the foot. Whilst there are companies who can perhaps do their job better such as Autocraft for a rebuild or SFR for finger followers etc, it would perhaps be of more value to a service history to have the work done there!?
If it is the case that an outside company can sort out serious work to a better standard, why should it make any sense that TVR can service the car any better than one of these specialist companies.
There are a few independants out there but they are mainly run by ex TVR engineers such as SFR. Perhaps this is why TVR are a bit reluctant to release a service manual and replacement engine parts.
After all if they had no doubt that a specialist could not hope to do as good a job and thus it would be damaging the customers own service record (and thus no-one would want to do it) surely they would have nothing to be scared of by releasing parts and the information needed?
justinbaker said:
There’s nothing much needed to remove the filter, there are 3 catches, two on the outside (one in my case), and one down the centre middle back, that is easy reached with you right arm under the LH side of the car. You need to pop off the wiper "yokes" (they just pop-off the ball joints and press on after), to move it out easy. The base adjusts on the LH front if required too!
Now your on the subject here’s my filter (same as everyone else’s) its supposedly done less than 1000 miles.
Serviced last month :-(
Justin, when the conical filter gets blocked, is pisses oil up the breather pipe straight into the air filter, and this could be the cause of the crap in it. I had this one, and this was the cause. Have a look at the airbox for excess oil, and in the throttle bodies. Also check the air intake at the bottom of the airbox, if this is greasy, then even if the air filter was changed 1000 miles previous, it would look shagged by now...
Mr F
Can only comment from a cerbera sp6 perspective but there should be some oil in the foam filter, its the oil that traps the crap in the foam stopping it getting into the engine. Unlike the cerbera foam filter that can degreased washed in detergent and wringed out like a long floppy sponge the tuscan one looks a bit of a pain to clean out properly.
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